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RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:28:12 PM   
Bravado


Posts: 87
Joined: 6/15/2010
Status: offline 		Poise, I would not argue that in such a relationship that a person could desire in their heart to serve. Why would I deny the truth, especially one that is subjective and on the basis of emotion?

I would argue, though, that a "true slave," which is apparently meant to impress a person into thinking that a person is the real deal, unlike all those "fake slaves" out there, hasn't the circumstance in which any feeling in their heart is relevant.

You might know how I'm seeing the issue of you look at it from a less relevant angle to something that you are emotional about. If someone claims to be a "true prisoner," but chooses to be where they are and is free to leave at any time, what would you call that?

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Profile   Post #: 21
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:31:12 PM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		OP you have subscribed to the regrettably common fallacy that true slavery means enslavement to an idiot with no sense of morality or ethics. That could only happen if the slave was equally idiotic.

Intelligent people don't go around buying a Ferrari and then keying it, and pouring sugar in the gas tank. Equally, they take that level of care to the people they are responsible for. 

However the fact that your mind automatically runs to destroying the person who trusts you says more about you than about us. And I assure you, it says nothing positive about you.


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RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:32:17 PM   
Bravado


Posts: 87
Joined: 6/15/2010
Status: offline 		It's amusing that I've burned a page out of my own book and everyone is rushing to claim that it's an effigy of themselves. No one needs to defend themselves here, passively or otherwise. A statement of personal opinion would suffice.

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RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:33:18 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bravado

LadyPact, I'm certain they already know the difference between themselves and Nigerians being kidnapped or scammed and sold overseas. And no, it isn't that they aren't black!

So, what is your complaint?  That a slave in BDSM is not sold or that it doesn't involve the trade of the human commodity?  That some terms used in BDSM have literally been 'stolen' from other uses in the vocabulary?  That's not new and the word "slave" isn't the only one that it's been done with.  Master, Mistress, kink, lifestyle, community, and scores of others didn't have the same meaning a hundred years ago as we've transformed them to mean today.  Perhaps we should have invented new words for everything, so as not to confuse anyone.


_____________________________

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Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

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RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:33:53 PM   
BoiJen


Posts: 2608
Joined: 3/7/2007
Status: offline 		Ya know...Ma'am just got finished reading the former slave narratives from the 1930's in her text for her American history class. She was shocked. The majority of individuals being interviewed weren't happy with their "freedom". You see, smart owners understood that then it, like with a car today, it costs more to buy a new slave than take care of the one they had. Then again, freedom without a plan to express it safely and with a safety net created some resentment. Many former slaves went from a secured food and shelter situation to not knowing where to go. Those who could, did everything they could to maintain a relationship with their former owners to be able to continue to work and get fed. Some former owners, however, could not afford to pay wages good enough to house and feed their former slaves.

That's not even getting into the indentured servant contracts that didn't really need to be eliminated, rather, they needed to be regulated. Debtors prisons became overrun shortly after the elimination of slavery and indentured servitude in the United States.

But these facts about "true slavery" doesn't change, that like today, some people were and are abusive to their "property" or that people should be able to exercise and enjoy certain human rights.

But knowing these facts would definitively change a person's perspective the "horrors" of "true slavery".


Pondering boi


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RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:34:24 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Nigerians being scammed and sold overseas?  Overseas from where?

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Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:36:30 PM   
BoiJen


Posts: 2608
Joined: 3/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
Perhaps we should have invented new words for everything, so as not to confuse anyone.



I know we're not gonna agree on this but I'm kinda fond of this idea. It makes language less confusing.

;-)

boi


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RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:39:53 PM   
myotherself


Posts: 7157
Joined: 3/9/2006
From: The cold bit of the UK
Status: offline 		ou est le popcorn??

Je demande le popcorn!!



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RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:41:02 PM   
Bravado


Posts: 87
Joined: 6/15/2010
Status: offline 		DesFIP, let's work together to draw a helpful line here.

As mentioned in the topic, let's set aside the fact that we're on CollarMe.com and consider the existence of a person from Nigeria who is forced into slavery as a maid in a different country, experiences no sexual pleasure in this, and is eventually killed by accident while the sadistic criminal who owned her was venting his daily rage. Is this person a "true slave," or do you have another word for to describe this person?

Now, compare this person to one of the partners of any dom who has criticized this thread as being an imperialist threat to their ideology. Their partner chose to be with them, enjoys the experience, and I would argue that they would leave if it became something that was constantly terrible. This, as many here seem to assert, is a "true slave."

Perhaps with this post we may reach the answer sooner than many of you expect!

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Profile   Post #: 29
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:42:19 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Mon Dieu!!!!!

We have had the french revolution ---several times.  Yet once again...........

Je m'appelle

Talleyrand.

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 30
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:49:25 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
Perhaps we should have invented new words for everything, so as not to confuse anyone.



I know we're not gonna agree on this but I'm kinda fond of this idea. It makes language less confusing.

;-)

boi



I am calling shotgun!!!!!!! boi=homosexual male slave.


LOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:49:25 PM   
Bravado


Posts: 87
Joined: 6/15/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Nigerians being scammed and sold overseas?  Overseas from where?


Nigeria. You know, where Nigerians are from?

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Profile   Post #: 32
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:52:36 PM   
Hotch


Posts: 267
Joined: 5/13/2004
Status: offline 		I agree whole heartedly with the OP's observation. While I understand what people mean when they say "true slave", I think it's a very poor choice of words because unlike the other definitions that have been adopted and bastardized to fit within the context of BDSM, true slavery is still very alive and well in this day and age. There really should be a better term for someone who gives themselves over 100% to another within the confines of the lifestyle and with the expectation that they will be treated within the scope of their expectations.

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Profile   Post #: 33
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:54:41 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bravado
As mentioned in the topic, let's set aside the fact that we're on CollarMe.com and consider the existence of a person from Nigeria who is forced into slavery as a maid in a different country, experiences no sexual pleasure in this, and is eventually killed by accident while the sadistic criminal who owned her was venting his daily rage. Is this person a "true slave," or do you have another word for to describe this person?


Dead like a motherfucker is what most of us would call 'em. 

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 34
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:55:58 PM   
BoiJen


Posts: 2608
Joined: 3/7/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyPact
Perhaps we should have invented new words for everything, so as not to confuse anyone.



I know we're not gonna agree on this but I'm kinda fond of this idea. It makes language less confusing.

;-)

boi



I am calling shotgun!!!!!!! boi=homosexual male slave.


LOLOLOLOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Mistress Ronne,

Dear,

The other lesbians beat you to it 30 years ago....

Shhh....it's a secret.


_____________________________


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Profile   Post #: 35
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:56:48 PM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Bravado

quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail

Nigerians being scammed and sold overseas?  Overseas from where?


Nigeria. You know, where Nigerians are from?



And being sold where?  Is this fuckin' bizzaro world?

Bizzaro-Master

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


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Profile   Post #: 36
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:57:44 PM   
crazyml


Posts: 5568
Joined: 7/3/2007
Status: offline 		J'ai beaucoup de pop-corn. Puis-je m'asseoir à côté de vous?

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Profile   Post #: 37
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:58:36 PM   
Bravado


Posts: 87
Joined: 6/15/2010
Status: offline 		BoiJen, it seems to me that the excerpts of slaves who were not only allowed to read and write but happy with their circumstance has made it difficult for you to see that the fact of the matter is that slaves didn't get to choose whether or not they are in a situation that permitted literacy and allowed for happiness.

Were those happy, literate, and apparently published slaves "true slaves?" Yes, in the sense that society deprived them of citizenship, rights, and if their owner should decide, any kind of freedom including the luxury of life itself.

In this lovely world of BDSM, does society or even the "owner" strip a formally privileged person of citizenship, rights, and if they should decide, any kind of freedom including the luxury of life itself?

No? Well, is that enough of a difference to suggest that the latter is not a TRUE slave, but only a person who wants to ACT as one? Or will there still be a pressing argument that omits choice as a factor in slavery?

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Profile   Post #: 38
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 1:59:13 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BoiJen
I know we're not gonna agree on this but I'm kinda fond of this idea. It makes language less confusing.

;-)

boi


No, we probably won't agree.  I think we're looking at it from two different sides.

Suppose we took every word that has more than one meaning and decided to create a new word for any secondary definition.  Knowing as we both do how it's impossible to get a consensus on darn near anything from all of us from all walks of BDSM, exactly how do we go about that?  I have to admit, the proposition alone makes My head hurt.

As always, the best suggestion in the vocabulary debate or most others is, if you don't like a term, don't use it.  Let others be to do their own thing.


_____________________________

The crowned Diva of Destruction. ~ ExT

Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to BoiJen)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: True Slavery, a delusional roleplay. - 9/29/2010 2:01:36 PM   
Hotch


Posts: 267
Joined: 5/13/2004
Status: offline 		Maybe we should start calling age players pedophiles?

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 40
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