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RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 6:41:37 AM   
truckinslave


Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
Status: offline
quote:

My suggestion is establish an insurance pool like workers' comp.   If a person is shot unlawfully, their costs are paid out of the insurance pool.   The funds come from taxing firearms transfers at variable rates - the dealers and makes that the actuaries say are most likely to be used in an illegal shooting pay the most.   


Great idea. Then we could do it for cars. And knives. And for those nasty books (paper cuts, eye strain). And homes. And computers. And idiots.

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to jack8007)
Profile   Post #: 41
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 6:48:37 AM   
truckinslave


Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
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quote:

Forget banning sales and transfers, all that shit. I doesn't work. How long any of you lived in the UK ? Give me a place to stay there and a decent job for about three months and I'll get some guns. With just a little bit of operating capital I can meet the right people almost anywhere. Crack is illegal and my boss'll tellya that the guy who doesn't work there anymore could find crack on the moon.


That puts me in mind of what I consider to to be the absolutely stupidest political/legal argument I have ever heard advanced seriously by seemingly otherwise intelligent people:

"We have to get guns out of the hands of drug dealers"

I so enjoy the confusion when I ask them: "Given that guns have their own Amendment, and the drugs we're talking about are illegal in all 50 states, wouldn't it be easier just to take the drugs away from them"?

Duh.

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to Termyn8or)
Profile   Post #: 42
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 6:58:12 AM   
truckinslave


Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
Status: offline 		No such thing.
I do not know how a licensee could mistake an FFL for an FFDL.

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 43
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 7:33:17 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		While these are by the great unwashed and colloquially referred to as FFLs:

I hold a Federal Firearms Dealers License. (type two: pawnshop)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_Firearms_License  

as opposed to an FFIL  Federal Firearms Importer License.
or a FFML  Federal Firearms Manufacturers License.

Each according to their abilities, each according to their needs.

But thank you for your laser like insight into the program, that you've shared so fully and knowledgeably with us, truck.

One of us stands corrected, and I will leave it to the obvious auspices of your office to determine which of us that might be.


< Message edited by mnottertail -- 3/2/2011 7:50:15 AM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 44
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 7:46:25 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Mea culpa: I didn't know that. Always thought they wouldn't arse about with that...


businesses who possess or otherwise control guns whether theirs or others (like gunsmiths, pawnbrokers, auctioneers, sporting goods places (when the auction sale is substantially based on firearms) must hold at least an FFDL. And you will have to pass a NICS (National Instant Criminal Background Check) via FBI to buy or get your gun back and serial numbers and nomenclatures are recorded and held 20 years FOR EACH TRANSACTION, 3 separate pawns, 3 NICS.  There is a loophole for private sales, and by that loophole gunshows, but if you show up at several gunshows with a table full of weapons for sale, the ATF (in my area, the agent guy I deal with is Kurt Goering, and yes he is related) will see if they cant set you up for skinning your knickers for Jesse and his big white friend Beh'na'd at our equivalent of your Durham.

< Message edited by mnottertail -- 3/2/2011 8:04:33 AM >

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Moonhead)
Profile   Post #: 45
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 7:49:01 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		Best not to go upsetting them, then.

(I always thought that the Bureau of Alcohol Firearms and Tobacco was an off license in Texas, to be honest...)

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 46
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 7:50:20 AM   
jack8007


Posts: 392
Joined: 8/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

If it's useful as a militia weapon.......


Show me a militia that doesn't have crew-served weapons.   Mortars, AT & AA rockets, and machine guns out the ass.

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 47
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 7:52:21 AM   
jack8007


Posts: 392
Joined: 8/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

And idiots.


Yep.  We could start with the idiots who can't tell the difference between  a car and a gun.    Those are definitely the ones who need AKs the most.



(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 48
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 7:56:04 AM   
jack8007


Posts: 392
Joined: 8/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

confusion when I ask them: "Given that guns have their own Amendment, and the drugs we're talking about are illegal in all 50 states, wouldn't it be easier just to take the drugs away from them"?


Guns have their own amendment?  Here I was thinking the constitution had amendments.

The confusion you're enjoying is in your own mind, sonny.   I suppose it saves you the cost of a few beers on Saturday night, but it ain't easy on the rest of us.

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 49
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 7:59:45 AM   
TheMooose


Posts: 3
Joined: 7/20/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

Myself I would favour banning all firearms


Uh, but you are Canadian...I am guessing you do not think even your police, or army, should have weapons and from the looks of your defense budget that day is coming fast.

(in reply to Arpig)
Profile   Post #: 50
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 8:01:34 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline 		Maybe we could have some sort of ongoing game to spot sockpuppet accounts? On spotting one, the spotter could post some sort of slogan and derive great kudos from doing so...

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to TheMooose)
Profile   Post #: 51
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 8:03:51 AM   
truckinslave


Posts: 3897
Joined: 6/16/2004
Status: offline 		Dude. You should stop digging.
5 of the first 10 entries for FFL on Google refer to Federal Firearms Licenses.
0 of the first 30 entries for FFIL on Google refer to firearms in any way.
0 of the first 30 entries for FFML on Google refer to firearms.
0 of the first 30 entries for FFDL on Google refer to firearms in any way (one hit includes a reference to Fat Factor Deer Lick, however, which sounds to me like something you should TIVO.

I myself have held both a Class 1 FFL and a Class 7 FFL, which is the only way I've ever heard anyone refer to them: "Class 1" and "Class 7".

_____________________________

1. Islam and sharia are indivisible.
2. Sharia is barbaric, homophobic, violent, and inimical to the most basic Western values (including free speech and freedom of religion). (Yeah, I know: SEE: Irony 101).
ERGO: Islam has no place in America.

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 52
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 8:04:21 AM   
jack8007


Posts: 392
Joined: 8/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

And idiots.


One of the things I like most about NRA idiots is how aggressively stupid they are.   Got a problem?  They can't deal with it, on principle.  The only way to relate to the world is hoard guns.

You want to hoard guns, join the Army and see if they'll let you into the armory.     Don't count on it, though.   Guys as bright as that usually wound up sweeping the parade deck.

Did your momma ever teach you the difference between a KNIFE and a SHEET OF PAPER?   Why exactly do you think you have the brains to be trusted with a deadly weapon?    You're the fellow who needed the junior DI standing over your shoulder to make sure you could chamber a round without putting it thru your boot.

Jeezus!



(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 53
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 8:07:00 AM   
Moonhead


Posts: 16520
Joined: 9/21/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave
I myself have held both a Class 1 FFL and a Class 7 FFL...

No you haven't.

< Message edited by Moonhead -- 3/2/2011 8:08:32 AM >

_____________________________

I like to think he was eaten by rats, in the dark, during a fog. It's what he would have wanted...
(Simon R Green on the late James Herbert)

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 54
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 8:12:36 AM   
jack8007


Posts: 392
Joined: 8/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

assuming of course, that the 2nd Amendment implies


Good explanation of good points!

What I want to see is the time when any of these NRA boys actually *use* any of their weapons.   That will be mightily amusing, no matter what happens.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 55
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 8:15:57 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		I won't join the NRA because they are not extreme enough.

I am sure I will be contradicted for that, saying 'Yes, you will.' 

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to jack8007)
Profile   Post #: 56
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 8:39:37 AM   
Aynne88


Posts: 3873
Joined: 8/29/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

quote:

Forget banning sales and transfers, all that shit. I doesn't work. How long any of you lived in the UK ? Give me a place to stay there and a decent job for about three months and I'll get some guns. With just a little bit of operating capital I can meet the right people almost anywhere. Crack is illegal and my boss'll tellya that the guy who doesn't work there anymore could find crack on the moon.


That puts me in mind of what I consider to to be the absolutely stupidest political/legal argument I have ever heard advanced seriously by seemingly otherwise intelligent people:

"We have to get guns out of the hands of drug dealers"

I so enjoy the confusion when I ask them: "Given that guns have their own Amendment, and the drugs we're talking about are illegal in all 50 states, wouldn't it be easier just to take the drugs away from them"?

Duh.



Ah no. Legalize the drugs. Good luck with that whole war on drugs thing though, it's going swimmingly. . Taken a look at Mexico lately?

To the OP, I don't know. I'm a pro gun liberal, and I have a lot of friends that can't register a handgun or longgun here in Maine, and they just have their wives or kids go do it. A few of the guys I know were involved in a marijuana bust and so wifey registers the gun and she also gets the hunting license so they can still go on those buck and moose hunts. Yes of course if they go hunting and bag one, she better be there before you drag it to a tagging station, but my point is it's way easy to get a gun if you want one. Kind of like the war on drugs....

Everyone I know, regardless of criminal past, owns guns that want one. If they have the $$$ they have the gun.

_____________________________

As long as people will shed the blood of innocent creatures there can be no peace, no liberty, no harmony between people. Slaughter and justice cannot dwell together.
—Isaac Bashevis Singer, writer and Nobel laureate (1902–1991)



(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 57
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 9:57:58 AM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: truckinslave

Dude. You should stop digging.
5 of the first 10 entries for FFL on Google refer to Federal Firearms Licenses.
0 of the first 30 entries for FFIL on Google refer to firearms in any way.
0 of the first 30 entries for FFML on Google refer to firearms.
0 of the first 30 entries for FFDL on Google refer to firearms in any way (one hit includes a reference to Fat Factor Deer Lick, however, which sounds to me like something you should TIVO.

I myself have held both a Class 1 FFL and a Class 7 FFL, which is the only way I've ever heard anyone refer to them: "Class 1" and "Class 7".


Q: Does an importer or manufacturer of firearms also need a dealer’s license?

No, as long as the importer or manufacturer is engaged in the business of dealing in firearms at the licensed premises in the same type of firearms authorized by the importer’s or manufacturer’s license.


http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/licensing.html#dual-licensing

From the ATF web site. Seems they are seperate licenses.

You may want to check out the actual application from the ATF site.

Type 01/02

Dealer (01), Including Pawnbroker (02), in Firearms Other Than Destructive Devices (Includes: Rifles, Shotguns, Pistols, Revolvers, Gunsmith activities and National Firearms Act (NFA) Weapons)

06

Manufacturer of Ammunition for Firearms Other Than Ammunition for Destructive Devices or Armor Piercing Ammunition

07

Manufacturer of Firearms Other Than Destructive Devices

http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-5310-12.pdf

< Message edited by tazzygirl -- 3/2/2011 10:03:47 AM >

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to truckinslave)
Profile   Post #: 58
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 10:22:43 AM   
jack8007


Posts: 392
Joined: 8/14/2007
Status: offline
quote:

I won't join the NRA because they are not extreme enough


Good for you.   Is your interest your business, or your fear, or what combination?

Do you plan to hold a gun on the sheriff when he comes with his guns to drag you into court to answer some bullshit like why your car isn't insured?   Or do you just like to feel your guns?  Or just talk about them?

Guns are obviously the answer to these problems, and the more guns the better.  We need to get back to the traditional machine gun battalions of WW2.   You never have to worry about ammunition, because it will always be there, right?

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 59
RE: What kind of Gun Regulation Makes Sense? - 3/2/2011 10:23:41 AM   
rulemylife


Posts: 14614
Joined: 8/23/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheMooose

quote:

ORIGINAL: Arpig

Myself I would favour banning all firearms


Uh, but you are Canadian...I am guessing you do not think even your police, or army, should have weapons and from the looks of your defense budget that day is coming fast.


And from the looks of our defense budget the day is coming fast when we are going to have to reduce it or go further into debt.

(in reply to TheMooose)
Profile   Post #: 60
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