RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants with her own body"

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RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:04:34 AM

tweakabelle

Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

quote:

It seems important to be clear about we consider success in this area

The goal should only be to stop harmful drug use period...in this the programs are failures. Just not putting people in jail and giving them treatment that is not working is not an answer...It is sweeping the problem under the rug.... Like paying off a problem to leave the good citizens alone.

I like the idea of mandatory treatment but don't we have that here in the US for first offenders?

I still think education is the best defense.

Butch

I'm afraid that the goal you identify might be unattainable. Do you feel it can be achieved? Has it ever been achieved anywhere?

Treatment is seen as a waste of time and money unless an addict wants to change their ways. The research on why people consume drugs seems light. Some clarity on the motivating factors would seem to me to necessary before we can begin to attempt to prevent drug use across the board. But there's not even agreement on what addiction is in the literature.

The one thing that almost everyone seems to agree upon is that prevention is better than cure - so education is an essential feature of any strategy.

My feeling is that we need to accept that some people, for reasons we don't understand fully, are going to use drugs/alcohol or whatever-they-fancy no matter what is tried to stop it. I'm unaware of any way of preventing that. Most users will not encounter chronic problems, but some will.

According to the literature, most long term heroin addicts deal with the issue themselves (with or without intervention) after roughly 10 years of addiction. Minimising the damage that these people do to themselves and society at large until they reach the point when they can quit seems a more realistic goal to me.

It's achievable. Sorry but totally preventing drug use isn't.

_____________________________

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 301

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:07:54 AM

kdsub

Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline

Not too many years ago they were hammering drug use on the airwaves...remember the fried eggs for brains. It worked...drug use dropped. Where has this media campaign gone?

Just because there is information on the net does not mean children will go there to read it...We need to constantly be showing the results of long term use of harmful drugs and putting it in the children’s faces.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to tazzygirl)

Post #: 302

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:09:17 AM

tazzygirl

Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
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quote:

Let me go further,had the OP not started,and deliberately so IMO,with such a preposterous proposition(legalizing Crack) I would probably have come down on her side in this argument.....for I feel most drugs should and could be legalized.Crack does not fall into that category....Crack is not per se a drug...it is a bastardization of a drug,namely Cocaine...and intended,deliberately intended to addict the user in record times.

Could not agree more mike. I dont recall anyone dying or killing anyone as a result of smoking pot... as a result of driving under its influence is another story.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 303

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:10:33 AM

tazzygirl

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Joined: 10/12/2007
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Such as infomercials showing a crack addict looking for rocks or picking off insects?

Might work. Dont know who would run them.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 304

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:20:14 AM

kdsub

Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline

tazzy I think the only problem with pot is not the drug itself but the message it sends to children who see their parents breaking the law but expecting them to mind it.

I am not against the legalization of pot...although it is a change in my recent thinking...I still find the weakness in using drugs abhorrent...but I would rather see it legalized than see parents breaking the trust with their children.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to tazzygirl)

Post #: 305

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:23:10 AM

kdsub

Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline

quote:

It's achievable. Sorry but totally preventing drug use isn't

I understand and somewhat agree with your view on drugs...just so long as we keep trying not giving up like some European countries. If we can't stop people from using drugs we can keep the numbers as low as we can and attack the real reasons for drug use...economics and mental illness.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to tweakabelle)

Post #: 306

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:34:00 AM

tazzygirl

Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline

quote:

tazzy I think the only problem with pot is not the drug itself but the message it sends to children who see their parents breaking the law but expecting them to mind it.

There are more problems with pot than that.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 307

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:41:51 AM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

I still think education is the best defense.

This generation coming up has the best information at their fingertips, literally.

Funny you should say that Tazz,I often told my son that the one thing I never wanted to hear from him was "I was just experimenting"...I pointed out to him that my generation ,and those preceding ,had conducted all of the tests....and the results were in....lol.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to tazzygirl)

Post #: 308

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:51:20 AM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

quote:

tazzy I think the only problem with pot is not the drug itself but the message it sends to children who see their parents breaking the law but expecting them to mind it.

There are more problems with pot than that.

Gateway....or so the story goes...The trick there is parenting.Pot as a gateway is most effective the younger the person is.As a parent I saw my goal as being a speed bump on what the world was going to throw at my child.My own experience with pot led me to believe that it seriously hampered the ability to absorb new information....as such it slowed down the learning process .So the path I took with my son was to try mightily to convince him that granting himself the time to fully develop and realize his potential prior to muddying up the waters ,so to speak would stand him in good stead in the future .
Everything I know about my son tells me I was very effective on this front...so much so that he states he still hasn't dabbled...and isn't sure if he feels the need to do so in the future...he is 22 well adjusted and well on his way to a successful and happy life.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to tazzygirl)

Post #: 309

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:51:27 AM

tazzygirl

Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline

lol... i experimented with all sorts of things.. cocaine was freely available, at least till you got hooked. I learned that from a club owner when I was just a babe of 16. ( yes, I was getting into night clubs at 16 and knew most of the owners

). I wanted to try, but he liked me enough to stop me, pointed out some hard facts, and turned me off to the possibility of ever wanting too again.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 310

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:52:54 AM

RacerJim

Posts: 1583
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Its a statement used only when discussing abortion rights. Its not a blanket statement used to garner rights for drug use, bank robberies or other illegal acts.

Abortion is still legal. In that aspect, a woman does have the right to do what she wants with her own body.

Abortion is still murder. In that aspect, a woman does not have the right to do what she wants to someone else's body.

BTW: I don't know whether infanticide is legal or illegal, but your hero Obama/Soetoro/Sabarkrah supports it.

(in reply to tazzygirl)

Post #: 311

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:53:09 AM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline

Yeah,well I'm still running certain tests...I feel the need to make sure all of the information available is collected and collated properly....I hate to leave an experiment unfinished.....lol.

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to tazzygirl)

Post #: 312

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:53:52 AM

HannahLynHeather

Posts: 2950
Joined: 4/4/2011
From: where it's at
Status: offline

quote:

You can't make someone want to quit and if they don't want it, it's not going to happen.

this is true. you can get them clean by force, but unless they are committed to staying clean, it's not going to happen. hell just look at lindsay lohan

hannah lynn

_____________________________

clique? i don't need no stinking clique!

fuck a duck ~w. disney

My Twitter: http://twitter.com/HannahFuck

i hope you enjoyed the post, and as always my friends....have a nice day

(in reply to thishereboi)

Post #: 313

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:55:20 AM

slvemike4u

Posts: 17896
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: United States
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: HannahLynHeather

quote:

You can't make someone want to quit and if they don't want it, it's not going to happen.
this is true. you can get them clean by force, but unless they are committed to staying clean, it's not going to happen. hell just look at lindsay lohan

hannah lynn

I'd rather not....train wrecks hold no appeal for me

_____________________________

If we want things to stay as they are,things will have to change...Tancredi from "the Leopard"

Forget Guns-----Ban the pools

Funny stuff....https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNwFf991d-4

(in reply to HannahLynHeather)

Post #: 314

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 8:57:37 AM

tazzygirl

Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline

quote:

Gateway....or so the story goes

I dont buy into the gateway theory as a whole. Many people stop at pot... some do go on to harder drugs.

I discovered my own son was smoking pot. I chewed his ass out for hours... not over pot, but over his asthma and his health issues. He started to tell me how I didnt understand, since I never knew the pleasant effects of pot. At that point, my brother started laughing, then told my son how, back in the day, I was a major pot head.... lol... true enough, I was.

For me, there came a time to put away the "toys of my youth" and "grow up". Im not saying others who still use arent grown, thats just how I saw it for my own life.

I work with a pot head, and he is adorable... but lazy as all get out. He smokes before work, doesnt deny it, even brags about it. He has no get up and go about himself. And doesnt want too. I cant seem to find that enjoyment anyone of walking around life in a haze.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 315

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 9:00:09 AM

tazzygirl

Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline

quote:

Abortion is still murder. In that aspect, a woman does not have the right to do what she wants to someone else's body.

BTW: I don't know whether infanticide is legal or illegal, but your hero Obama/Soetoro/Sabarkrah supports it.

Infantcide is the death of an infant after a live birth. Hmmm... care to support your claim?

Abortion has been legal in this country since 1973. You are welcome to view it in any way you wish. Until it becomes illegal, it is still a legal procedure and not much you can do about it.

Until it becomes illegal, a woman has that right.

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to RacerJim)

Post #: 316

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 9:01:19 AM

HannahLynHeather

Posts: 2950
Joined: 4/4/2011
From: where it's at
Status: offline

quote:

Abortion is still murder. In that aspect, a woman does not have the right to do what she wants to someone else's body

as long as its physically attached to me and contained within me its part of my body. just as surely as my gall bladder. you're moral position is admirable, but your assumption that your personal ethical position should be forced on the rest of us is not. tell you what, the next time YOU get pregnant, you can have it, but kindly allow the rest of us who actually might get pregnant to make that decision for themselves. either that or start supporting those unwanted children. just how many have you adopted?

hannah lynn

_____________________________

clique? i don't need no stinking clique!

fuck a duck ~w. disney

My Twitter: http://twitter.com/HannahFuck

i hope you enjoyed the post, and as always my friends....have a nice day

(in reply to RacerJim)

Post #: 317

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 9:01:33 AM

tazzygirl

Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline

quote:

Yeah,well I'm still running certain tests...I feel the need to make sure all of the information available is collected and collated properly....I hate to leave an experiment unfinished.....lol.

I have heard that a good scientist wont stop until he has a definitive answer.

Study On!!!

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 318

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 9:08:41 AM

HannahLynHeather

Posts: 2950
Joined: 4/4/2011
From: where it's at
Status: offline

quote:

I pointed out to him that my generation ,and those preceding ,had conducted all of the tests....and the results were in....lol

quote:

Yeah,well I'm still running certain tests...I feel the need to make sure all of the information available is collected and collated properly....I hate to leave an experiment unfinished.....lol.

ok, i know that both these remarks ( especially the 2nd) were made somewhat in jest, but don't they point out a certain hypocrisy? a "my drug of choice is ok, but yours is not" attitude? from what you have posted, it's apparent you have tried/used various drugs, and yet you would deny that same freedom to experiment to others. why is that?

hannah lynn

_____________________________

clique? i don't need no stinking clique!

fuck a duck ~w. disney

My Twitter: http://twitter.com/HannahFuck

i hope you enjoyed the post, and as always my friends....have a nice day

(in reply to slvemike4u)

Post #: 319

RE: "A woman has the right to do what she wants wi... - 4/18/2011 9:09:37 AM

kdsub

Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline

Yes there are...now stop tazzy...I don't want to swing back and forth on this issue...I'm getting dizzy.

I'm just setting here waiting for the alcohol argument to pop up...and I may need a few brews to deal with it.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to tazzygirl)

Post #: 320

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