quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

quote:

Here you go my friend, when I'm wrong I will admit it but in this case, I'm not.

This from your cite

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For example, Drevna noted that expansion projects at the nation's existing refineries have had the effect of adding the equivalent of a brand new refinery every year. That increase came despite mandates for cleaner gasoline and diesel fuel, which take longer to make.

So by your own cite you have been proved wrong...how long will we hold our collective breaths till you admit it?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Edwynn

Yes, and that being the indication that the EPA requirements are not the limiting factor in any significant way.


We hear the crying from the oil industry that they can't afford to do as every single other industry is required to do in meeting EPA standards where that comes in to play.

Please.

The 15 highest net profit companies in 2009 are crowded around the $12 billion to $14 billion mark, a good many of them being oil companies.

ExonMobil dwarfed them all in having more than double the net profits ($29 + billion) of the next closest company. But they can't build a refinery because it's all the EPA's fault. In reality just saying that they don't want to pay for it, even in the midst of  year after year record breaking profits. Except it wasn't the EPA's fault for the oil companies themselves shutting down all those refineries as soon as they bought them.

Right.


Lots of companies with far less market capitalization and net profits have to play by the rules.


The oil companies have been given a free ride far more than other industries for decades. You can argue for more of the same if you like, but some of us are actually paying attention here and have had enough already.

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More refining capability will mean more supply and it will drive down prices. That was my point. The EPA restrictions are keeping or perhaps a better way to phrase it would be, have help keep this from happening.

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And it still has not kept up with demand...

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In 2009 through 2010, as revenue streams in the oil business dried up and profitability of oil refineries fell due to lower demand for product and high reserves of supply preceding the economic recession, oil companies began to close or sell refineries.

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ORIGINAL: thompsonx
Do you just open your mouth to change feet?

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ORIGINAL: thompsonx

Yet u.s. refineries refine crude oil for iran and venezuela. How could that be unless there was excess refining capacity?
Since you have decided to asign me a nick name how bout I give you one too. You may feel free to refer to me as skippy and I will refer to you as punk ass mother fucker. Any time you would like to act like an adult and use my posted name I will be glad to do the same for you.

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ORIGINAL: Mezrem

I get called worse on a daily basis so if you feel you must, then you will. Hell if you enjoy it do it anyway I sure as hell wont lose sleep.What I do regret is that I let your attack make me slip down to a level where people are more likely to dismiss me rather then listen to what I am trying to say.


Act like a punk ass mother fucker and get treated like one...act like an adult and get treated like one.



I will offer you this though, if you want to come and tell me how I'm wrong.

I did...you said the u.s. needed to build more refineries and I pointed out that the u.s. has excess refining capacity as evidenced by the fact that the u.s. reifnes oil for iran and venezuela.

then asking me the question quoted below was not a good choice.

Intelectual courtesy demands that one aquaint themselves with the facts before forming an opinion

If you want my respect out of the gate Thompsonx, treat me the way you would like to be treated.

I do and will continue to do so

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx
Do you just open your mouth to change feet?

As to your point lets assume it is true and I dont know if it is or is not.


Then look it up for fucks sake.

If they are refining oil for either of those places on a business level it means they are paying more.

They are not paying anything they are charging for a service


It is a business not a goverment run industry. They answer to thier share holders and not the American public.

What the fuck does this have to do with anything?

On a personal level I find that repulsive even if it is good business. That does not change the fact there is a greater demand then a supply both in crude oil and the products it is used to make.


If that were true then they would stop refining for iran and venezuela and start refining for the u.s.

You can see this in many different areas of business. I have seen basic construction materials from cement to liquid asphalt rise in price over the last ten years because the market is multinational. Cocnrete that cost a contractor 40 to 50 dollars per yard ten years ago is now costing 90 to 100 dollars per yard.


So you feel that inflation has nothing to do with that?

This point has been the crux of this disagreement with you the entire time.

Nope the crux of our disagreement is the level of u.s. refiing capacity...You say there is not enough and the facts say that we have excess capacity

quote:

ORIGINAL: thompsonx

Yet u.s. refineries refine crude oil for iran and venezuela. How could that be unless there was excess refining capacity?
Since you have decided to asign me a nick name how bout I give you one too. You may feel free to refer to me as skippy and I will refer to you as punk ass mother fucker. Any time you would like to act like an adult and use my posted name I will be glad to do the same for you.

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ORIGINAL: thompsonx



Act like a punk ass mother fucker and get treated like one...act like an adult and get treated like one.

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Do you just open your mouth to change feet?

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ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

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Do you just open your mouth to change feet?

Time to work on a new insult.

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ORIGINAL: Mezrem

I see and may have bothered to read more of what you posted had you managed to be the adult you you asked me to be. I see your mind will not be changhed and your words about behaving as adults were rather worthless.

Perhaps if you were to reread my last post to you you would note that I did not call you a punk ass mother fucker. I reiterated my position that if one acts like one one will be treated as such and if one acts as an adult then they will be treated as such. Since my admonition you have acted like and adult and as long as you do so will I.


http://www.thepriceoffuel.com/whataffectsfuelpricing/
here is another and part of it selcted below

Regulatory steps to reduce air pollution have also influenced gasoline markets. Many states require the use of various blends of cleaner-burning gasoline, often called "boutique fuels," that are specially formulated to meet federal and state emissions regulations. Gasoline sold in California is not the same as gasoline sold in Arizona or Las Vegas. Creating these different fuels results in "island" markets and inhibits the ability of refiners and marketers to move supplies from one region to another to meet local or regional demand. There are currently 18 separate formulas of gasoline mandated for different regions.

Another significant influence on gasoline prices are taxes, which can vary dramatically across different markets. Differences in state and local sales and excise taxes can add as much as 40 cents per gallon (cpg) in certain areas. The American Petroleum Institute reports the national average for gasoline taxes is 45 cpg. Alaska has the lowest gasoline taxes in the country at 18.4 cpg, while New York and California have the highest, at 60.9 cpg and 58.3 cpg, respectively. Washington is third highest at 55.9 cpg.

Permitting requirements for petroleum infrastructure can also affect gasoline markets. Although demand for gasoline in the United States has grown over the years, no new refineries have been constructed since the 1970s. In order to meet demand, the U.S. must import large volumes of gasoline and other petroleum products.


This is interesting but not related to our original discussion as to the excess refinery capacity or it's lack there of.
If you were to look at the new addition to the port arthur refinery you might reevaluate your position.

http://www.citizen.org/cmep/article_redirect.cfm?ID=11829
http://www.bizjournals.com/houston/stories/2007/09/17/daily47.html


PS: thanks for remembering my pet name ThompsonX

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ORIGINAL: thompsonx



Act like a punk ass mother fucker and get treated like one...act like an adult and get treated like one.

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ORIGINAL: Mezrem

I will consead that the first link will require me to look more in depth at it's claims to find out the source of it's facts. I don't take things at face value any longer. The second link though there is this.


"He said demand for oil is growing in the U.S., exceeding current demand, which is why the country imports roughly 1 million barrels of gasoline daily, or 60 percent of the country's oil and gas supply. "

This seems to rather prove my point. As you stated though it is off topic.

Your point was that there was not enough refining capacity in the u.s.
This article which was written in 2007 states that the u.s. has a growing demand for oil and that we import at that time 1 million bbls daily...not that we lacked refining capacity.
The fact that this facility was built in 2007 kinda knocks the shit out of the "no new refineries built since the 70's.

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ORIGINAL: Mezrem

I will consead that the first link will require me to look more in depth at it's claims to find out the source of it's facts. I don't take things at face value any longer. The second link though there is this.


"He said demand for oil is growing in the U.S., exceeding current demand, which is why the country imports roughly 1 million barrels of gasoline daily, or 60 percent of the country's oil and gas supply. "

This seems to rather prove my point. As you stated though it is off topic.

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Our very government is conspiring to choke off the energy we need to live functional modern lives and to compete on an even keel with the rest of the world for industry and jobs.

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ORIGINAL: Sanity
Our very government is conspiring to choke off the energy we need to live functional modern lives and to compete on an even keel with the rest of the world for industry and jobs.

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ORIGINAL: thompsonx

Yet u.s. refineries refine crude oil for iran and venezuela.

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ORIGINAL: Mezrem

the most recent numbers I can find rake us at the top at total. when you view it on a per capta basis that number falls to 22nd. when viewed over all the number of gallons is roughly double.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/ene_oil_con_percap-energy-oil-consumption-per-capita

As the rest of your post I find myself in agreement. There needs to be prudent medical reform. There needs to be govermental reform as well.