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RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/24/2011 12:14:08 AM

SailingBum

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From: Sailin the stormy sea
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Firebirdseeking

I really am not concerned about whether you or anyone else here thinks I am a sub or slave or a master, mistress, domme, dominant or switch. I did not post with insecurities about who I am. I posted as I stated before, as trying to understand a reaction I had. A lot of assumptions could be made about others' preferences and willingness to do things as well, but I am not doing so.

If your definition of a sub is that s/he be willing to be fucked anywhere, anytime, anyhow without regard for anything that might be going on for (her) then ok fine, I do not meet your definition of sub. That does not mean I am not a sub. I just dont meet your definition, which BTW, I think is a shallow definition. Some people here think that if a woman speaks her mind, she is not a sub.

In that case, I am DEFININTELY not a sub. Because I surely speak my mind.

uh what a fucking minute YOU are putting words in my mouth. I never said most of the trash your implying. You attempt to come across as trying to understand the issue and fail miserably.
I have no clue what your agenda is ..but is sure as hell is not to foster understanding of this issue.

For some reason you get all defensive n shit when someone doesnt agree with you.

BadOne

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(in reply to Firebirdseeking)

Post #: 61

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/24/2011 4:46:28 AM

ChatteParfaitt

Posts: 6562
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From: The t'aint of the Midwest -- Indiana
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I'm very sexually sub and admit to loving a great grunge fuck. What's in it for me? It's about being taken, being used for HIS pleasure, being objectified as a hole to fuck b/c HE wants/needs to get off. I love it all.

I've never encountered a female who was *sexually* sub who didn't. That's doesn't mean it's not possible, just that I have not encountered it.

Now, if all he ever wanted was a grunge fuck, yeah I'd have a problem with it. I love all sex, and all types of sexual foreplay, from a slow careful sensual seduction to a brutal rape roleplay. Using me only for a grunge fuck would be, NOT using me to my full sexual potential.

Now that I've got all that out of the way, I have known or known about from other females many male doms who are not capable of what I consider sensual foreplay. You know, kissing, touching, gentle fondling, whisper soft caresses, more kissing, more touching, a slow lovely buildup that makes your entire body scream for the next touch.I think most females (sub or not), if they are honest with themselves, want and need that from time to time. I know I do.

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Post #: 62

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/24/2011 5:06:39 AM

Firebirdseeking

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That last paragraph in your post troubles me. Doms not capable of what you call foreplay, is what I call sexual intimacy..to me, that is simply sexual dominance, and since it got brought up, I dont consider that dominance. If he cannot be tender, he is not capable of leading me.

(in reply to ChatteParfaitt)

Post #: 63

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/24/2011 5:10:02 AM

Firebirdseeking

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Your last paragraph troubles me. A "Dom" not capable of "kissing, touching, gentle fondling, whisper soft caresses, more kissing, more touching, a slow lovely buildup that makes your entire body scream for the next touch..." to me, that is an individual who has serious intimacy issues. Fortunately, my dominant/husband is not like that. What you described - well, I don't consider that dominance.

(in reply to ChatteParfaitt)

Post #: 64

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/24/2011 5:40:30 AM

DesFIP

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From: Apple County NY
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I don't think they're incapable of it, they just tend to go straight to the bottom line. Which for them, is fucking or a blow job. They forget that women sometimes need foreplay and remember only when they aren't getting the response they desire. Or when the woman tells them she needs it.

I'm talking about a committed relationship, not casual play. Because I agree that men are less likely to do sensual play with someone they have no intimate relationship with. I don't think that means they're incapable of it, just that they reserve it for important partners in their lives.

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Post #: 65

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/24/2011 5:48:02 AM

ClassIsInSession

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Joined: 7/26/2010
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I think really the bottom line here is that while we may find it convenient to label ourselves, Dominant, Submissive, Slave, Master, or whatever, there are nuances in interpretation, coupled even further with particular kinks, habits, turn ons and turn offs that make each of us unique. I think that is why it is so very critical to have open and honest communication with one another in this type of relationship. And there too, every relationship I've had has been a bit different simply because. I've been involved with submissives and slaves, one on one and poly at various times of my life, and each relationship had it's own parameters, that were set and negotiated prior to fully engaging in the relationship. Because I've always been more of a "lone wolf" and a "non-conformist" I never let anyone try to nail me down with terminology, nor would I care if they did... it just doesn't have any bearing on my reality.

Personally, I like foreplay, and while I don't do it every time I am sexual, just as well, sometimes I have foreplay without having sex. The same is true with other particulars like discipline, sometimes it goes with sex, sometimes not. There isn't a hard and fast rule. If you want to know "real" torture, trying spending a whole afternoon in bed with your lover just passionately kissing like you did before you lost your virginity, with no expectation of going further than that. Another thing on my end is I won't be involved with anyone sexually unless I do have feelings for them, even in the Master/Slave dynamic. I know that might not be the usual for Dominants, but it's the way I'm wired. But with the reciprocity of feelings, anything from D/S to totally objectified slave with Master is possible, just depends on the particular dynamic with the particular person.

To a large degree too, it really does come down to how much you care or don't about the partner/s you're involved with. And that varies with the particular people concerned as well. I can be incredibly affectionate, or down right sadistic regardless of how much I might actually love someone because I'm 100% internally ok with being wired differently that the vanilla people of the world, and I don't tend to involve myself in anything resembling a vanilla relationship.

As to Men are From Mars, Women are From Venus....I often thought of writing a parody, Men Are From Mars, Women Want My Penis....))) No, I'm not that arrogant, but you have to admit, it is pretty funny.

(in reply to Firebirdseeking)

Post #: 66

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/24/2011 7:56:46 AM

ChatteParfaitt

Posts: 6562
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From: The t'aint of the Midwest -- Indiana
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Firebirdseeking

Your last paragraph troubles me. A "Dom" not capable of "kissing, touching, gentle fondling, whisper soft caresses, more kissing, more touching, a slow lovely buildup that makes your entire body scream for the next touch..." to me, that is an individual who has serious intimacy issues. Fortunately, my dominant/husband is not like that. What you described - well, I don't consider that dominance.

Oh, let's be very clear, I don't consider it dominance, either.

But then I think there are people who use "dominance" as a vehicle to avoid intimacy and other relationship issues they don't like or have time for. I'm sure there are submissives who do the same (use submission to avoid emotional issues), it's just I have more subs (predominantly female) complain to me.

As far as not liking what I call a grunge fuck, you appear to not like to be objectified in that way. That most subs do like doesn't make you not sub (at least not to me). It makes you not a sub who is a good match for someone with a strong need to objectify you in that way.

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Post #: 67

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/24/2011 9:47:47 AM

tazzygirl

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quote:

Personally, I like foreplay,

Again, your definition of foreplay probably wont match mine.

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Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
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Post #: 68

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/24/2011 5:41:11 PM

Firebirdseeking

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Agree totally, Chatte. I agree with what you said about avoidance of intimacy - however, I was vanilla for most of my life, and intimacy avoidance is by no means a D/s issue. (Men do not have, for the most part, role models that teach them to lead in the intimacy department, and I am not talking about initiating sex. Many women, also, have intimacy difficulties and low expectations for themselves. )

You are correct, objectification is not a turn on for me, and when I was actively seeking a partner here, that did not attract me in the least.

(in reply to ChatteParfaitt)

Post #: 69

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/24/2011 6:51:31 PM

MasterSlaveLA

Posts: 3991
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Define foreplay.

Two hands grabbing your nekkid waist, being positioned doggie-style, and a squirt of lube just moments prior to a world class ass-raping?!!

Yep... lube equals LOVE, dammit!!!

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Post #: 70

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/27/2011 6:04:41 AM

xtwoofusx

Posts: 4
Joined: 8/27/2011
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"I think it is a commonly held belief here that a dominant get sex when he (or she) wants it, how he wants it and where he wants it. That sounds all about him, doesnt it? I would think that also sounds like disregard."

It sounds dominant, while what you want sounds vanilla.

(in reply to MyVision)

Post #: 71

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/27/2011 6:07:28 AM

GreedyTop

Posts: 52100
Joined: 5/2/2007
From: Savannah, GA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Define foreplay.

Two hands grabbing your nekkid waist, being positioned doggie-style, and a squirt of lube just moments prior to a world class ass-raping?!! Yep... lube equals LOVE, dammit!!!

ooh.. that SO works!!

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Post #: 72

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/27/2011 6:54:49 AM

coookie

Posts: 541
Joined: 10/25/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Firebirdseeking

Agree totally, Chatte. I agree with what you said about avoidance of intimacy - however, I was vanilla for most of my life, and intimacy avoidance is by no means a D/s issue. (Men do not have, for the most part, role models that teach them to lead in the intimacy department, and I am not talking about initiating sex. Many women, also, have intimacy difficulties and low expectations for themselves. )

You are correct, objectification is not a turn on for me, and when I was actively seeking a partner here, that did not attract me in the least.

I think now you are getting to where you want this thread to go...

i dont like what most people call foreplay .. it bores me. I do not have intimacy issues however. There are many ways to be intimate and i think the definition that you are defaulting to is very limited.

(in reply to Firebirdseeking)

Post #: 73

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/27/2011 9:36:18 AM

JanahX

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Joined: 8/21/2010
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How about this concept. Take away the words dominance and submissive and try: two people that dont like or WANT foreplay. The "guy is a walking hard-on" and the "girl had better have some K-Y jelly available". -(enter whatever gender here that suits you) Not sure what the words dominance and submissive have to do with people not wanting, needing or liking forplay.

Now if it is a D/s situation, then I would think that there is an agreement before hand that the D has made arrangements with the s that she/he is nothing but a fuckhole. This would indicate to me that that is satisfying to him/her. It brings them both satisfaction.

Somewhere down the line ... using peoples bodies/and being used as a cumhole became satisfying during the ego building stage in their lives. Who knows how it develops- but it does.

Lots of people dont want intamacy to enter their lives. They have no need or want it.
Its a wham bam thank you mam.

Somehow it brings great satisfaction to their lives. It makes them HAPPY.

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Post #: 74

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/27/2011 11:09:04 AM

Awareness

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Joined: 9/8/2010
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You're dancing around the real issue. To me, the problem seems to be trying to reconcile growing up in an egalitarian, politically correct society with your desire to submit. You desire submission on your terms, which strongly suggests your dominant is having control issues.

Understand. D/s does not imply that the normal factors which contribute to the establishment of a relationship are absent. Rather, they are accentuated by the power exchange. You keep postulating scenarios in which a sub is unfulfilled because she's being fucked in a way which doesn't match her desires. To me, this demonstrates a comprehensive misunderstanding of a D/s interaction and a clear indication you're still thinking about yourself as the most important member of it.

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(in reply to Firebirdseeking)

Post #: 75

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/27/2011 11:15:51 AM

0ldhen

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From: Henhouse in Trolltopia, Harleyville USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: MasterSlaveLA

quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

Define foreplay.

Two hands grabbing your nekkid waist, being positioned doggie-style, and a squirt of lube just moments prior to a world class ass-raping?!! Yep... lube equals LOVE, dammit!!!

OH HELL YEAH!!!!!!

_____________________________

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Za'beeta Regal, Et Vogo O' Lurwadra'd Wyka Go Abosh Inunsey.

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Post #: 76

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/27/2011 2:41:47 PM

Firebirdseeking

Posts: 477
Joined: 9/3/2006
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Sailing Bum, I dont think I responded defensively, because I dont feel I need to defend myself, nor does anyone else here. I do think I answered with a strong opinion, which I do have, and many. Awareness, I do indeed have a very strong dominant side, like many subs, especially professionally. I long ago reconciled that one can be strong and dominant in one's professional life and submissive in one's personal life. Having said that, I am submissive to MY husband/dominant, because we give each other what we need. I dont think there is a "most important person" in any healthy relationship, be it vanilla or D/s. Over the years I have heard many Dominants/Masters speak of how important their "s" was to them, equally as important as any "D" or "M" is to an "s". A relationship is about 2 people, a D/s relationship is about a diferent power dynamic, not about one person being more or less important.

I dont now, nor did I ever think, that dominance is about sex only. Its about being able to lead, about being in control in his/her life. Sexual dominance alone strikes me as just that - bedroom dominance.

Just sayin'. Not wanting to get into a pissing contest with anyone about who we are or what we need.

(in reply to 0ldhen)

Post #: 77

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/30/2011 12:30:10 PM

ElBorba

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Joined: 4/9/2005
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The over-analysis of such matters by some of the earlier posters makes me want to spend several hours very slowly and lovingly, with lots of foreplay and affection, welting up everyone's ass with a broom-handle!!

< Message edited by ElBorba -- 8/30/2011 12:42:59 PM >

(in reply to Firebirdseeking)

Post #: 78

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/30/2011 6:07:01 PM

Firebirdseeking

Posts: 477
Joined: 9/3/2006
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LOL, I like your style.

(in reply to ElBorba)

Post #: 79

RE: Genuinely puzzled - 8/30/2011 6:38:09 PM

ElBorba

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Joined: 4/9/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Firebirdseeking

LOL, I like your style.

Why thank you

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Post #: 80

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