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RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 3:44:13 PM   
lovmuffin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen



I never made such a comparison and never responded to a post of yours that mentioned Iran or China until you started making shit up about me.



The last time I'm going around with you on this. See Post #73. Before that there was nothing I responded to you about and I'm certainly not making shit up about you. Well except in secret, but I only whispered so how could you possibly know.



I even posted it for ya because if ya can't make it to 10 you'll never make it to 73.



quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

It's still comparing apples to oranges and I would still say it's a stretch. Here in the US it takes many years for a defendant to get to the point of execution with lawyers, appeals and all the rest of it. In Iran you don't have all of that. There is no presumption of innocence and people are put to death after the crime rather quickly, not to mention the absurd things that can get you a death sentence, hung in a public square, and sometimes in multiples, and if I'm not mistaken a crap load more per capita than here in the US. There is just no comparison.

I would call that barbaric.



quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Are you familiar with with the Iranian legal system.

I'm not.

So can you educate me?

Or are you just blowing smoke out your ass?




Liar!
Post #73 was by RML not me

quote:

ORIGINAL: rulemylife

quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin

It's still comparing apples to oranges and I would still say it's a stretch. Here in the US it takes many years for a defendant to get to the point of execution with lawyers, appeals and all the rest of it. In Iran you don't have all of that. There is no presumption of innocence and people are put to death after the crime rather quickly, not to mention the absurd things that can get you a death sentence, hung in a public square, and sometimes in multiples, and if I'm not mistaken a crap load more per capita than here in the US. There is just no comparison.

I would call that barbaric.



Are you familiar with with the Iranian legal system.

I'm not.

So can you educate me?

Or are you just blowing smoke out your ass?





ok Ken I take it all back.   Not a liar but certainly a major fuck up. I guess you can count after all.

Edited to add my apology and I now hereby direct all the previous shit directed at Ken over to Rulemylife. 

< Message edited by lovmuffin -- 9/10/2011 4:05:30 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 141
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 3:44:55 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Prove it



So your standard of proof is that there cannot be a standard of proof. 

Lovely.

You do realize that looks even worse than the other two options, right?

< Message edited by TheHeretic -- 9/10/2011 4:10:26 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 142
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 3:59:41 PM   
willbeurdaddy


Posts: 11894
Joined: 4/8/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
I stand by my statement, prove to me that the suspect is guilty and I'll do the killing myself. However you can't so I oppose the death penalty.



Here you go, Ken. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_Little_Rock_recruiting_office_shooting


Not even close to proven.

It is entirely possible the actual shooter escaped and this guy is a fall guy.


And its entirely possible that you'll actually take an intellectually honest position some day, it just has a very low probability.

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Profile   Post #: 143
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 4:11:57 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		still havent made it there have you wilbur, at least not here

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Profile   Post #: 144
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 5:05:54 PM   
DomKen


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From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin
ok Ken I take it all back.   Not a liar but certainly a major fuck up. I guess you can count after all.

Edited to add my apology and I now hereby direct all the previous shit directed at Ken over to Rulemylife. 

You intentionally edited someone else post to try and make it look like I wrote it? why?

(in reply to lovmuffin)
Profile   Post #: 145
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 5:50:39 PM   
JstAnotherSub


Posts: 6174
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen




As a minor quibble the appelate decision you quote includes a mistake that should at least grant the men a new trial. It is absolutely impossible to say with certainty a DNA sample comes from any single person.


I guess the fingerprints on the window, the neighbors who saw him, the print from his shoe that was on her stomach where he stomped her, the bragging he did at school for the next few days and the fact that he admitted everything when he was arrested made the appellate court feel ok with letting him rot.

If I recall you are from this area Ken.  His family went and got good old Jimmy Berry to defend him.  Tony Elam's family had enough sense to hug us and tell us they were sorry for what their son did, then they left him to get what he had coming.

It may be revenge.  I don't know and I don't care. Two people in my life have been murdered and there is no doubt about who killed them both.  Killers should give up their right to live, once there is no doubt that they did it. 

My opinion, it won't change, as I know no one else will change their stance on this from reading my story.

It is what it is yanno?

< Message edited by JstAnotherSub -- 9/10/2011 5:52:27 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 146
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 7:02:41 PM   
lovmuffin


Posts: 3759
Joined: 9/28/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: lovmuffin
ok Ken I take it all back.   Not a liar but certainly a major fuck up. I guess you can count after all.

Edited to add my apology and I now hereby direct all the previous shit directed at Ken over to Rulemylife. 

You intentionally edited someone else post to try and make it look like I wrote it? why?


No Ken it wasn't intentional. Why would I intentionally embarrass myself then apologize for it ? I was going too fast and that last time when I went back to the original, I only was noticing the post, I didn't read the name. I mixed you up with RML  It was unintentional.   If you can't accept that then too bad.


_____________________________

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank. Give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Unknown

"Long hair, short hair—what's the difference once the head's blowed off." - Farmer Yassir

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 147
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 7:05:43 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		you should count to ten...
wasnt that your advice earlier.....
need some nitro?

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Profile   Post #: 148
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 7:22:31 PM   
lovmuffin


Posts: 3759
Joined: 9/28/2007
Status: offline 		I should have done that earlier.

_____________________________

"Give a man a gun and he can rob a bank. Give a man a bank and he can rob the world." Unknown

"Long hair, short hair—what's the difference once the head's blowed off." - Farmer Yassir

(in reply to Lucylastic)
Profile   Post #: 149
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 7:23:36 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline 		works for repubs too nyar nyar:)

_____________________________

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<) )╯SUCH
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\(•_•)
( (> A NASTY
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(•_•)
<) )> WOMAN
/ \

Duchess Of Dissent
Dont Hate Love

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Profile   Post #: 150
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 8:23:40 PM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline 		There is a claim here that the death penalty in the US is somehow 'different' to the death penalty in Iran or China. This claim is clearly false.

The death penalty - the execution of a person by the State - is precisely the same no matter where it is carried out. The person is put to death at the behest of the State in all instances. The crime(s) the person is convicted of may vary. The legal processes preceding the imposition of the death penalty may vary. The manner of execution may vary.

But the penalty - death - is precisely the same in all instances. Therefore there is no merit in the claim the death penalty in the US is different to the death penalty in other jurisdictions. Therefore comparisons of the death penalty between the US, China and Iran are valid. Comparisons of penal codes, legal processes, manner of execution etc are not necessarily valid.

Also, why are so many "pro-life' people so enthusiastic about being 'pro-death-penalty' (and often anti-gay love/marriage too)? Is there anything other than the dictates of a narrow interpretation of fanciful non-rational ideology linking these positions?

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Profile   Post #: 151
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 8:28:40 PM   
tolovetolaugh


Posts: 648
Joined: 4/30/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

Also, why are so many "pro-life' people so enthusiastic about being 'pro-death-penalty' (and often anti-gay love/marriage too)? Is there anything other than the dictates of a narrow interpretation of fanciful non-rational ideology linking these positions?


I don't find that related except maybe conservatives have those views all jumbled up. I am pro death penalty, but also pro choice, believe anyone who wants it deserves marriage and feel that you trying to link me to those assholes who try to impose their views on others a bit sad. I feel the death penalty is very rational.

Maybe i will retype this all in the morning- i got the gist of it out, but I don't feel I put it out right.


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Profile   Post #: 152
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 8:32:56 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle
Also, why are so many "pro-life' people so enthusiastic about being 'pro-death-penalty' (and often anti-gay love/marriage too)? Is there anything other than the dictates of a narrow interpretation of fanciful non-rational ideology linking these positions?



This is something I've wondered about myself, Tweak.  Granted, I had the polarity swapped, and wondered why many lefties place so much value on the lives of murderers and rapists and psychopaths, and none whatsoever on innocent life, ripped from the womb on the abortionists table, but, we aren't going to see completely eye-to-eye very often, anyway.

_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 153
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 8:48:17 PM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
Status: offline 		Okies Heretic I'll bite.

I am pro- a woman's right to choose. No one other than the mother is in a position to make fertility decisions and live the consequences. As far as I'm concerned, life - in the legal sense - begins at birth.

I cannot see how taking a life can be justified other than it is the sole viable option left after all others are exhausted. This is the case with self-defence. This is never the case with the death penalty.

If society is going to have an institution of marriage, it should be a choice made on the basis of love, not who or how you bonk.

Having addressed your end of the polarity, kindly return the favour.

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Profile   Post #: 154
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 8:55:59 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

innocent life, ripped from the womb on the abortionists table


(If they're innocent, then why would they need to be baptized?)


< Message edited by farglebargle -- 9/10/2011 9:01:18 PM >

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(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 155
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 8:57:01 PM   
tweakabelle


Posts: 7522
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: Sydney Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tolovetolaugh

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

Also, why are so many "pro-life' people so enthusiastic about being 'pro-death-penalty' (and often anti-gay love/marriage too)? Is there anything other than the dictates of a narrow interpretation of fanciful non-rational ideology linking these positions?


I don't find that related except maybe conservatives have those views all jumbled up. I am pro death penalty, but also pro choice, believe anyone who wants it deserves marriage and feel that you trying to link me to those assholes who try to impose their views on others a bit sad. I feel the death penalty is very rational.

Maybe i will retype this all in the morning- i got the gist of it out, but I don't feel I put it out right.


I'm sorry you got the impression I was lumping all pro-death penalty people together. My point is only directed at those who describe themselves as pro-life, pro-death penalty and anti-gay marriage. I had felt that was clear in the post I made but obviously not .....

As you are pro-choice and pro-gay marriage, then my post is clearly not directed at you. If my clumsy expression was responsible for your misapprehension, please excuse it.

< Message edited by tweakabelle -- 9/10/2011 9:02:36 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 156
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 8:58:13 PM   
TheHeretic


Posts: 19100
Joined: 3/25/2007
From: California, USA
Status: offline 		Oh, I'm pro-choice as well, Tweak, right up to the moment we can just adopt out a preemie.  I'm just not all fluffybunny-naive and politically correct towards any possible sensitivities about what the procedure involves.  It's the woman's body, her rights trump those of the life she carries.  That is quite consistent with my belief that society has the right, even the duty, to provide the ultimate penalty in pursuit of justice.



_____________________________

If you lose one sense, your other senses are enhanced.
That's why people with no sense of humor have such an inflated sense of self-importance.


(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 157
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/10/2011 9:01:12 PM   
tolovetolaugh


Posts: 648
Joined: 4/30/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle


quote:

ORIGINAL: tolovetolaugh

quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle

Also, why are so many "pro-life' people so enthusiastic about being 'pro-death-penalty' (and often anti-gay love/marriage too)? Is there anything other than the dictates of a narrow interpretation of fanciful non-rational ideology linking these positions?


I don't find that related except maybe conservatives have those views all jumbled up. I am pro death penalty, but also pro choice, believe anyone who wants it deserves marriage and feel that you trying to link me to those assholes who try to impose their views on others a bit sad. I feel the death penalty is very rational.

Maybe i will retype this all in the morning- i got the gist of it out, but I don't feel I put it out right.


I'm sorry you got the impression I was throwing all those people together. My question is only directed at those who describe themselves as pro-life, pro-death penalty and anti-gay marriage.

As you are pro-choice and pro-gay marriage, it is clearly not directed at you. If my clumsy expression was responsible for your misapprehension, please excuse it.

S'all good...


I think I just need sleep. A bit tired after a member of the boards kicked my butt in scrabble. ><
Twice.


_____________________________


That which yields, is not always weak. —
Jacqueline Carey (Kushiel's Dart)

I wrote a porn!
http://www.collarchat.com/m_3840531

(in reply to tweakabelle)
Profile   Post #: 158
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/11/2011 5:14:59 AM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JstAnotherSub

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen




As a minor quibble the appelate decision you quote includes a mistake that should at least grant the men a new trial. It is absolutely impossible to say with certainty a DNA sample comes from any single person.


I guess the fingerprints on the window, the neighbors who saw him, the print from his shoe that was on her stomach where he stomped her, the bragging he did at school for the next few days and the fact that he admitted everything when he was arrested made the appellate court feel ok with letting him rot.

If I recall you are from this area Ken.  His family went and got good old Jimmy Berry to defend him.  Tony Elam's family had enough sense to hug us and tell us they were sorry for what their son did, then they left him to get what he had coming.

It may be revenge.  I don't know and I don't care. Two people in my life have been murdered and there is no doubt about who killed them both.  Killers should give up their right to live, once there is no doubt that they did it. 

My opinion, it won't change, as I know no one else will change their stance on this from reading my story.

It is what it is yanno?

There may be plenty of other incriminating evidence but if the tech who tested the DNA said it was definitely from the victim then the tech lied. It's that simple.

As to the rest, of course you want revenge. Society has to be more than the base wants of the wronged in these cases. First of all there is the slippery slope problem. What if the case isn't as cut and dried as this one? Do we still execute those convicted who are less clearly guilty? What if a father is convicted of setting a fire that kills his children? What happens when it turns out that the fire investigators were using fairy tales and not science to determine that arson had been commited? Can we give Cameron Willingham hs life back?

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Profile   Post #: 159
RE: Perry on the death penalty cracked me up, how do yo... - 9/11/2011 5:27:51 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

Can we give Cameron Willingham hs life back?


Thank you for reminding us all of the essential issue.

In order to prove himself the biggest bully around, Perry went out of his way to ensure an innocent man was executed.

Real "Christian", eh?

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 160
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