RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (Full Version)

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slvemike4u -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/30/2011 11:13:38 AM)

To repeat an earlier post...heads (figuratively speaking) will roll over this incident.We,the public,can not abide,nor tolerate abuse of power so blatant and inexcusable.
Off with their heads( now let us see how long it takes for a rightwing nut to show up and claim I have advocated violence...lol).



DarqueMirror -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/30/2011 6:14:51 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle
Although she WASN'T breaking the Law, since the United States Supreme Court declared the Alabama and Montgomery laws requiring segregated buses to be unconstitutional, right?


After the fact, yes. At the time she was still in violation.



DarqueMirror -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/30/2011 6:19:12 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
You mean the LEO incorrectly used lethal force i.e. violated the law.


No. I said exactly what I meant to say. The round is manufactured with a specific purpose. The purpose of the round is not to kill. Therefore the did not use lethal force. At worst, he had an accident.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
BTW the law allows someone to refuse to comply with an illegal demand and the order to disburse was illegal.


No it wasn't.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
OPD may try to whitewash it, as you have so poorly tried to do here, but the fact remains one of their officers fired a tear gas canister at a mans head from no more than 20 feet away in violation of numerous laws and police procedures.


I'm still waiting to see your evidence of 1) where the round originated and 2) what the intended target of the round was. Until you can provide that, you're talking out of your ass.



Hippiekinkster -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/30/2011 7:14:45 PM)

The Iraq veteran seriously wounded Tuesday night at “Occupy Oakland” sustained minor brain damage and has been rendered unable to speak, doctors said Friday, adding that he will likely be able to make a full recovery in time.
Scott Olsen, 24, was said to be otherwise lucid and able to communicate with his family by writing notes, but his ability to spell is also damaged, according to sources who spoke with The Guardian. He is, however, able to understand what’s being communicated to him.
Keith Shannon, Olsen’s roommate who served with him in Iraq, explained that “He cannot talk right now, and that is because the fracture is right on the speech center of his brain,” the paper added. “However, they are expecting he will get that back.”
Olsen is believed to have been struck in the forehead by a police projectile, and many speculate it was either a tear gas canister or a beanbag full of lead fired from a shotgun. Both can be lethal at close range, although many police departments use them as “non-lethal” weapons. Video from the scene seems to show him being struck by a tear gas canister fired from just a few feet away, but the image is not clear.
The blow was so severe that doctors were forced to place Olsen in a medically-induced coma to help fight swelling on his brain.
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/10/28/doctors-scott-olsen-suffered-brain-damage-and-is-unable-to-speak/



farglebargle -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/31/2011 4:59:05 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle
Although she WASN'T breaking the Law, since the United States Supreme Court declared the Alabama and Montgomery laws requiring segregated buses to be unconstitutional, right?


After the fact, yes. At the time she was still in violation.


You can't be in violation of an Unconstitutional Law.



DomKen -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/31/2011 12:18:20 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
You mean the LEO incorrectly used lethal force i.e. violated the law.


No. I said exactly what I meant to say. The round is manufactured with a specific purpose. The purpose of the round is not to kill. Therefore the did not use lethal force. At worst, he had an accident.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
BTW the law allows someone to refuse to comply with an illegal demand and the order to disburse was illegal.


No it wasn't.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
OPD may try to whitewash it, as you have so poorly tried to do here, but the fact remains one of their officers fired a tear gas canister at a mans head from no more than 20 feet away in violation of numerous laws and police procedures.


I'm still waiting to see your evidence of 1) where the round originated and 2) what the intended target of the round was. Until you can provide that, you're talking out of your ass.

Bullshit and more bullshit.

Tear gas canisters and bean bag rounds are not made to be non lethal, they could be but aren't. Both rounds are correctly classified as less lethal. IOW if used in the way the manufacturer intends the rounds are unlikely to be lethal. Neither round is less lethal if fired at close range directly at someone's head.

The order to disburse was illegal. The 1st amendment guarantees the right to free assembly. Since the crowd was pecefull besides apparently some isolated rock throwing, which could be legally dealt with by arresting the throwers, it was a clear violation of the law to attempt to disburse the crowd.

The round hit him over an eye. The video from immediately before shows him looking straight ahead. Therefore it was not a ballistic arcing shot that hit him, futher proven by the fact the helicopter footage shows no one behind the line of OPD that could have fired such a shot. If it was a bean bag round or rubber round that had been fired into the ground in front of him the rounds are designed to lose enough energy to be only painful not deadly on ricocht. so basic physics and knowledge of the rounds in question rules out everything but a direct shot.



Edwynn -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/31/2011 7:26:26 PM)



~FR~

Oh Lord, ask someone who was held up for forty minutes of questioning by Police ( 6 years b/f OWS) because he was WALKING to and fro from the grocery store as opposed to driving to same purpose, and was essentially told this much as ersatz generic probable cause, no actual crime under consideration, both during the interrogation and in my follow-up call to the police department, then held aside and questioned on more than four other occasions because I was walking barefoot, in a Southern city, in the middle of Summer ...

All my life I walk barefoot when the weather allows, but this has apparently made its way into the modern Police book manual as some generic 'probable cause,' a potential 'danger.'



Why do I not trust these guys, certainly not their 'judgment', as to what might constitute an actual threat or not, when it comes to anything serious?


PS


I can assure you that the Charlotte PD don't hire dummies. They have to pass the math and written tests above HS level, and more than a few perform well beyond that.

But they are f*cking Androids, and have no clue of their own social environment, no clue as to how to talk to their own citizens. That's what they are hired for.







DarqueMirror -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/31/2011 8:32:33 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle
You can't be in violation of an Unconstitutional Law.


Sure you can. It happens all the time.



DarqueMirror -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/31/2011 8:46:46 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
Tear gas canisters and bean bag rounds are not made to be non lethal, they could be but aren't. Both rounds are correctly classified as less lethal.


But they are referred to in both ways.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
IOW if used in the way the manufacturer intends the rounds are unlikely to be lethal. Neither round is less lethal if fired at close range directly at someone's head.


And when you find some evidence that the round was intentionally, directly fired at the guy's head at close range, perhaps you'll have a point. Since the only "evidence" available is shaky at best, you can't say from where the round was fired, at what range, or with what intent.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
The order to disburse was illegal. The 1st amendment guarantees the right to free assembly. Since the crowd was pecefull besides apparently some isolated rock throwing, which could be legally dealt with by arresting the throwers, it was a clear violation of the law to attempt to disburse the crowd.


No, it wasn't illegal. The 1st amendment isn't a catch-all rule any more so than the 2nd amendment is. I can't own my own heavy machine gun without permits and background checks, so a city can decide where and when it's legal to protest and what permits are required. To do so in areas where ordinances prohibit protest or without required permits makes it illegal. You can fly your 1st amendment flag all you like, but that doesn't change the facts.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
The round hit him over an eye. The video from immediately before shows him looking straight ahead. Therefore it was not a ballistic arcing shot that hit him, futher proven by the fact the helicopter footage shows no one behind the line of OPD that could have fired such a shot. If it was a bean bag round or rubber round that had been fired into the ground in front of him the rounds are designed to lose enough energy to be only painful not deadly on ricocht. so basic physics and knowledge of the rounds in question rules out everything but a direct shot.


Wow, you can tell where it hit him by where he was facing in a crappy video? You're amazing. Even people on the scene watching it happen couldn't say where he was hit or even if he was hit directly vs. simply having one go off "by" his head. Don't presume to be some sort of video forensics expert because you can see where he was facing for a brief moment. If the people who witnessed it aren't even sure, there's no way you can be. Any attempt to claim otherwise is spewing a little of the first three words you started your post with.



DomKen -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/31/2011 8:56:17 PM)

You're saying the bloody mark over one eye isn't the impact wound? You've spun a whole lot of bullshit but that takes the cake. WTF was it a giant mosquito that just happened to bite him at the same time as he was shot?

The rest of your post is utter and complete crap as well but claiming the obvious wound isn't a wound is just too fucking much.



DarqueMirror -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (10/31/2011 10:00:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
You're saying the bloody mark over one eye isn't the impact wound? You've spun a whole lot of bullshit but that takes the cake. WTF was it a giant mosquito that just happened to bite him at the same time as he was shot?


You don't suppose that damage sufficient enough to fracture a skull could make someone fall down and...*gasp*...hit their head...do you? I know this information could rock the world of video forensics experts like yourself, but just think about it. It "might" be possible.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
The rest of your post is utter and complete crap


Just like all of yours have been so far.



DomKen -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (11/1/2011 6:02:08 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: DarqueMirror

quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen
You're saying the bloody mark over one eye isn't the impact wound? You've spun a whole lot of bullshit but that takes the cake. WTF was it a giant mosquito that just happened to bite him at the same time as he was shot?


You don't suppose that damage sufficient enough to fracture a skull could make someone fall down and...*gasp*...hit their head...do you? I know this information could rock the world of video forensics experts like yourself, but just think about it. It "might" be possible.


It might be possible if he had fallen forward onto his face. The video makes it quite clear he fell onto his side.

Let me know when you're done making shit up.



Hillwilliam -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (11/1/2011 8:36:09 AM)

Sooo, according to Darque, it was a giant mosquito that made him fall forward and fracture his skull.

Reminds me of an earlier post I put here. It's like a kid explaining to his mom why her favorite vase got broken whiloe he was playing ball inside the house.

"But MOMMM. It coulda been Martians"

[sm=rofl.gif][sm=rofl.gif][sm=rofl.gif]

Hey Darque. How do you feel about those guys in NYC with the 1500 indictments and their compatriots calling the prosecuters "Scum"? Do you support them as well?

While you're at it, go find a marine and tell him you think one of his compatriots is a dirtbag. They like that. Especially if they havent had any exercise in a while.



Lucylastic -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (11/1/2011 8:36:57 AM)

Gonna have to start calling you Rip Van Winkle then Ken, supposition is exactly that.. and its not easy coming up with that much BS at once..give him a couple of days at least



SternSkipper -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine...Updated (11/1/2011 7:51:22 PM)

Here is an updateon Scott Olson's condition as of today:
"We just got an update from the Public Affairs person at the hospital Scott Olsen was in.

As of Friday evening, Scott was moved to another facility, which will remain anonymous at the family's request.

He is in fair condition but still cannot speak due to the swelling in his brain. He can, however, write and respond "quickly and accurately," according to the hospital spokesperson.

You can continue to send cards and letters, but please, no flowers or perishables, to the same address as before, Highland Hospital, 1411 E. 31st St., Oakland CA 94602"



SternSkipper -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (11/1/2011 8:14:01 PM)

quote:

You're saying the bloody mark over one eye isn't the impact wound? You've spun a whole lot of bullshit but that takes the cake. WTF was it a giant mosquito that just happened to bite him at the same time as he was shot?
The rest of your post is utter and complete crap as well but claiming the obvious wound isn't a wound is just too fucking much.


Ken... the dude is a chain puller... the Hospital Spokesman confirmed  on the news that Scott has a 2 inch skull fracture due  blunt force trama consitent with a blow from a teargas grenade.




tazzygirl -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (11/1/2011 8:16:36 PM)

The city will be sued. Why else did both the Mayor and the Chief apologize.



SternSkipper -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (11/1/2011 8:31:15 PM)

quote:

The city will be sued. Why else did both the Mayor and the Chief apologize.


Probably, and why wouldn't they be? But right now, it's been what? 6 days? and the kid still can't talk? Fuck... I hope Scott doesn't spend a few years getting back to where he was a week ago.




tazzygirl -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (11/1/2011 8:33:13 PM)

Hopefully its related to just the swelling... the brain is a remarkable organ... look at Giffords. With luck, the swelling with go down and his ability to speak will return.

I wonder if the city is picking up the tab.



DissolvedGuy -> RE: USMC joins #OWS after OPD takes a headshot at Marine... (11/1/2011 8:51:05 PM)

.



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