RE: Memorial Day /Is health care a Privilege or a Right? pro's/con's (Full Version)

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tazzygirl -> RE: Memorial Day /Is health care a Privilege or a Right? pro's/con's (5/30/2012 6:59:39 PM)



quote:

Forcing my participation via government edict (removing my right to choose) because you can't get my participation any other way? Have you no Right to my participation that you must resort to legal coercion?


The problem is.... you, at this time, have the right to choose... health care providers do not in cases of emergency.

quote:

A man hearing voices walked into the emergency room of downtown's California Hospital Medical Center on a recent night and said he wanted to hurt somebody. Doctors gave him medication, put him in a hospital bed and called the Los Angeles County Mental Health Department.

A mental health worker placed the patient — who had a history of schizophrenia — on a psychiatric hold. But despite multiple attempts to find somewhere to treat him, he spent 3 1/2 days in the emergency room.


With a sharp decrease in psychiatric beds and with mental health staffs spread thin across the state, emergency rooms increasingly have become costly and ineffective baby-sitting services for mentally disturbed patients in crisis.

The economic downturn and budget cuts are exacerbating a chronic problem, creating added safety risks at hospitals and placing a burden on already crowded emergency rooms. Meanwhile, hospitals are increasingly facing a dilemma: They can't find proper facilities to care for the patients yet can't release them to the streets.

"We are inundated with these patients," said Marc Futernick, California Hospital's director of emergency services. "The design of the system is that everyone gets taken care of in a timely fashion. The system is broken."

That breakdown can be costly. Hospitals get stuck caring for uninsured psychiatric patients; the public has fewer emergency room beds available; and the mentally ill often do not get the therapy and medication they need.

"It's a public safety, a public health and a humanitarian issue," said Brian Johnston, director of emergency services at White Memorial Medical Center. "This has been going on for years, but it has become more acute because there are even fewer beds and even fewer dollars."


http://articles.latimes.com/2011/sep/05/local/la-me-mentally-ill-20110906

Now, granted, this man may never have taken his meds... or he may very well have been medically compliant if he had access to medications.

You wish to see this as only what it costs you out of pocket.

Why is it so hard for people to understand that EVERYONE pays regardless?

EVERYONE pays because its federally mandated that you do so.

Please, dont make me explain why.... you all should know this by now.




Real0ne -> RE: Memorial Day /Is health care a Privilege or a Right? pro's/con's (5/31/2012 8:43:34 PM)

yes just like property taxes EVERYONE PAYS AND PAYS AND PAYS AND PAYS AND PAYS for unrealized gains.

it prejudices the healthy and takes away their right to choose as well as those who use herbals and home remedies.

fuck your commie agenda.




erieangel -> RE: Memorial Day /Is health care a Privilege or a Right? pro's/con's (5/31/2012 9:50:28 PM)

One thing about this story is that when people like the man depicted in this story were locked away in the state hospital system, taxpayers didn't seem to mind so much about "supporting" them. "Out of sight, out of mind". But Reagan, while governor, began the push to close the state hospitals, the mentally ill now largely live in the community, have apartments, support themselves via SSI or SSDI and part time jobs, they walk the streets talking to themselves and frightening their neighbors. Many of them are homeless. Many of them have co-occurring drug and alcohol problems.

One of the biggest industries that is almost always hiring, even in this economy, is that of social work, particularly in the field of psychiatric rehabilitation.




Marini -> RE: Memorial Day /Is health care a Privilege or a Right? pro's/con's (5/31/2012 10:02:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: erieangel

One thing about this story is that when people like the man depicted in this story were locked away in the state hospital system, taxpayers didn't seem to mind so much about "supporting" them. "Out of sight, out of mind". But Reagan, while governor, began the push to close the state hospitals, the mentally ill now largely live in the community, have apartments, support themselves via SSI or SSDI and part time jobs, they walk the streets talking to themselves and frightening their neighbors. Many of them are homeless. Many of them have co-occurring drug and alcohol problems.

One of the biggest industries that is almost always hiring, even in this economy, is that of social work, particularly in the field of psychiatric rehabilitation.



I never thought I would live to see America slide into such a state of decline.
These days, I often think of that quote from a Tale of 2 cities.
"It was the best of times and it was the worst of times."

For ME, this describes the current climate/and the future climate we live in.
Sort of covers everything.




tazzygirl -> RE: Memorial Day /Is health care a Privilege or a Right? pro's/con's (6/1/2012 12:38:07 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Real0ne

yes just like property taxes EVERYONE PAYS AND PAYS AND PAYS AND PAYS AND PAYS for unrealized gains.

it prejudices the healthy and takes away their right to choose as well as those who use herbals and home remedies.

fuck your commie agenda.


Who is "healthy"?

Should only the "healthy" not have to pay?

You can be perfectly healthy this minute... get into your car... get t-boned by some blue hair old lady... and end up in an ER.

How, at that point, do they decide if you have health insurance before treating you?

Here is what I want you to explain to me.

Do we get rid of the law that requires ER's to treat emergency patients regardless?

If no, then your argument that the healthy dont need insurance is a fallacy.

If yes, then you are saying you are fine with them holding up emergency care for you or your loved ones to determine if you have insurance or the ability to pay before even scraping you, or them, up off the street.

Can you give a guarantee that people will never need to access health care, or always have the ability to pay for that health care out of pocket?

The reality is, you cant. The reality is, you, R0, would sue the hell out of a hospital that denied you care in an emergency (though I dont doubt you would deny that)

One or the other has to go. Which is it?




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