LookieNoNookie
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quote:
ORIGINAL: DomKenNo, it's about you making claims that any halfwit can find to be false after about a minute of googling.
I just checked my High School records from 30 some years ago, and I'm at least a halfwit....so, since you've been unable to prove your case using your own above argument....here's what came up on Google...links provided. My comments in blue, at the bottom.
(There were some graphs in my post below...but because I don't rise to the level of a "full" wit, I can't figure out how to get them to show up...I screwed up some of the formatting as well):
http://www.jbhe.com/features/49_college_admissions-test.html
Explaining the Black-White SAT Gap
There are a number of reasons that are being advanced to explain the continuing and growing black-white SAT scoring gap. Sharp differences in family incomes are a major factor. Always there has been a direct correlation between family income and SAT scores. For both blacks and whites, as income goes up, so do test scores. In 2005, 28 percent of all black SAT test takers were from families with annual incomes below $20,000. Only 5 percent of white test takers were from families with incomes below $20,000. At the other extreme, 7 percent of all black test takers were from families with incomes of more than $100,000. The comparable figure for white test takers is 27 percent.
But there is a major flaw in the thesis that income differences explain the racial gap. Consider these three observable facts from The College Board's 2005 data on the SAT:
• Whites from families with incomes of less than $10,000 had a mean SAT score of 993. This is 129 points higher than the national mean for all blacks.
• Whites from families with incomes below $10,000 had a mean SAT test score that was 61 points higher than blacks whose families had incomes of between $80,000 and $100,000.
• Blacks from families with incomes of more than $100,000 had a mean SAT score that was 85 points below the mean score for whites from all income levels, 139 points below the mean score of whites from families at the same income level, and 10 points below the average score of white students from families whose income was less than $10,000.
Other Explanations for the Racial Scoring Gap on the SAT
Clearly, one of the main factors in explaining the SAT racial gap is that black students almost across the board are not being adequately schooled to perform well on the SAT and similar tests. Public schools in many neighborhoods with large black populations are underfunded, inadequately staffed, and ill equipped to provide the same quality of secondary education that is offered in predominantly white suburban school districts.
Data from The College Board shows that 57 percent of white students who took the SAT were ranked in the top 20 percent of their high school classes. This compares to 37 percent of black test takers. Some 45 percent of white students who took the SAT report that their high school grade point average was in the A range. This compares to only 22 percent of black test takers. The mean high school grade point average for all white students who took the SAT was 3.37. For blacks the figures was 2.99. These figures alone explain a large portion of the racial scoring gap on the SAT.
A major reason for the SAT racial gap appears to be the fact that black students who take the SAT have not followed the same academic track as white students. It is true that 97 percent of both blacks and whites who take the SAT have studied algebra in high school. But in higher level mathematics courses such as trigonometry and calculus, whites hold a large lead. In 2005, 47 percent of white SAT test takers had taken trigonometry in high school compared to 35 percent of black test takers. Some 28 percent of white test takers had taken calculus in high school. Only 14 percent of black students had taken calculus, one half as many as whites. Thirty-two percent of white SAT test takers had taken honors courses in mathematics compared to 19 percent of black SAT test takers.
Similar discrepancies appear in the level of instruction in English, the other major component of the SAT. Some 87 percent of white test takers had completed coursework in American literature compared to 75 percent of black test takers. For whites, 67 percent had taken high school courses in composition compared to 50 percent of blacks. Some 70 percent of whites and 59 percent of blacks had completed coursework in grammar. A full 40 percent of all white test takers had completed honors courses in English compared to 29 percent of black test takers.
The late John Ogbu (note: A black guy), professor of anthropology at Berkeley, believed that broad cultural attributes among blacks — such as parental style, commitment to learning, and work ethic — bear a heavy responsibility for the black-white educational gap. Ogbu wrote in his recent book, Black American Students in an Affluent Suburb: A Study of Academic Disengagement, that black students in the affluent homes of doctors and lawyers are looking at rappers in ghettos as their role models. Students talk the talk about what it takes to be a good student, Ogbu wrote, but few put forth the effort required to get good grades. This type of behavior is typical, Ogbu said, of racial minorities adapting to oppression and the lack of opportunity. Ogbu, much as Bill Cosby has done recently, also placed the blame on black parents. He believed that many black parents are not offering sufficient guidance, do not spend enough time helping with homework, and do not pay adequate attention to their children's educational progress.
• Black students in predominantly white schools who study hard are often the subject of peer ridicule. They are accused of "acting white" by other blacks. This so-called ghetto chic in the form of peer pressure to shun academic pursuits undoubtedly has a dragging effect on average black SAT scores.
• Black students may be subject to what Stanford psychology professor Claude Steele calls "stereotype vulnerability." Steele contends that black students are aware of the fact that society expects them to perform poorly on standardized tests. This added pressure put upon black students to perform well in order to rebut the racial stereotype in fact makes it more difficult for them to perform well on these tests.
http://professionals.collegeboard.com/data-reports-research/sat/cb-seniors-2011/tables#
HS GPA Math Reading Writing
4.0 599 621 596
3.5 563 584 558
3.0 531 550 525
2.5 473 483 462
2.0 418 424 405
1.5- 411 422 399
http://nces.ed.gov/programs/digest/d10/tables/dt10_153.asp
http://www.usatoday.com/community/profile.htm?UID=ca617b94859be53c&plckController=PersonaBlog&plckScript=personaScript&plckElementId=personaDest&plckPersonaPage=BlogViewPost&plckPostId=Blog%3aca617b94859be53cPost%3aa2525f6c-9912-4d98-8ccf-ee16d426a492
USA Today article (date not given):
Why are Asian-Americans outperforming everybody else on SAT?
Here’s what struck me first about this year’s SAT scores, released today: Only one racial category came close to matching average score increases for Asian, Asian-American and Pacific Islander students.
That group comprised 10% of SAT takers this year, and its total score was up 13 points.
The next highest increase? A category called "no response." It was up 12 points and represented 4% of test takers.
College Board officials said the increases in the Asian category this year (up 3 points in critical reading, 6 points in math and 4 points in writing) were nothing noteworthy (reading scores increased 7 points in 2003, for example).
But I wasn’t the only one to notice them. Bob Schaeffer, who crunches SAT data for FairTest, said he rechecked his numbers for accuracy when he first saw them. And Seppy Basili, senior vice president of Kaplan, called the increases "significant" and "remarkable."
Disparities in scores among all races over 10 years are just as striking. Here’s what Kaplan Test Prep came up with when looking at 10-year changes in combined math and critical reading scores:
Race 1999 2009 +/-
• Asian 1058 1103 +45
• White 1055 1064 +9
• Latino 927 916 -11
• Black 856 855 -1
Nothing wrong with a healthy increase, but it raises the question: Why are Asian-American students outperforming everybody? I’d be interested in thoughtful comments from readers on this subject.
Basili says sociological factors can’t be ignored. "There’s this strong history in Asian cultures, the notion of preparing for tests and preparing for school," he says. And whether the model minority stereotype is fair or not, those high aspirations are reflected in College Board data, which show, basically, that Asian-American students share many of the characteristics that predict high SAT scores, especially compared with other populations. For example:
• 63% of Asian-American students took four years of science and 80% took four years of math, while among Latinos, 50% took four years of science and 68% took four years of math.
• 47% of Asian-American students enrolled in one or more course in AP or honors math, vs. a 35% of the total population and 23% of blacks. And 43% of Asian students took AP or honors courses in science vs. 33% for total population and 22% for black students.
• Almost 63% of Asian Americans said their parents have at least a bachelor's degree compared with 55% for the total population.
This doesn’t explain everything, of course. It might be interesting to see, for example, how Asian-American scores look when sliced by income levels, for example.
Comments from readers of the above article:
“As a non-Jewish Caucasian, I find this statement offensive. Why the Asian/Jewish score comparison? How is the homelife of Jewish test takers any different from that of Christian, Agnostic, or Atheist test takers? I am Christian and scored much higher than many of my Jewish friends...while other Jewish friends of mine scored better than I did.”
(Clearly someone who was offended by the fact that Asian culture and work ethic seems to impute a stronger belief in the value of education).
“micheleisfree wrote:
I agree with the Asian/Jewish correlation. It's culture. Both Asian and Jewish parents focus on their kids' educations in the first ten years, when the human brain is most conducive to learning. The Jews have their kids studying Judaism very young. That's not a racist statement. It's by-and-large a fact. White and black parents let their kids run wild playing when Asian and Jewish parents are having their kids study. That's why the Jews are very successful and the Asians are smarter. Their parents' focus. And when white and black parents do the same, they come out with smart kids too.
BTW, I'm a nonJewish Caucasian.”
(Clearly a racist…has to be).
And of course, here’s a teacher commenting on decades of experience with students of all races (he/she must be a racist too):
“traneman wrote:
Asians do better on the SAT because of cultural differences, as several people here have stated.. Period. I have worked in academia for over 25 years, at 5 different campuses. Just walking around campus you will see that Asian students are more focused on their education. They are not partying, hanging out talking about sports, celebrities, fashion, or wasting time on non-academic matters. They highly respect and get to know their faculty members and are quick to engage in research with them. Their on-campus lives may seem boring to the average non-Asian, but hey, they get the job done. It is also very important that they never let their families down by doing poorly in school. Compare that to many students who are still "finding themselves." Asian students know where they are and what they need to do to get to the next level. An advanced degree is normal to them., particularly for those who are international students. And yes, I hear many of them talk about how non-Asian students waste their time and parents' money while in college. I have had much more success with the Asian students I have hired to work in my office. They show up on time, love to stay busy, and they are always talking about their studies and look forward to their next class.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States
See also: Race and crime in the United States and Racial inequality in the American criminal justice system
On June 30, 2006, an estimated 4.8% of black non-Hispanic men were in prison or jail, compared to 1.9% of Hispanic men of any race and 0.7% of white non-Hispanic men. U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics.[40]
________________________________________
Midyear 2010 Incarceration rates by race and gender per 100,000 US residents of the same race and gender.[41]
Ethnicity Male Female Total
White non-Hispanic 678 91 -
Black non-Hispanic 4,347 260 -
Hispanic of any race 1,775 133 -
All inmates 1,352 126 732
According to the US Bureau of Justice Statistics (BJS) non-Hispanic blacks accounted for 39.4% of the total prison and jail population in 2009.[42][not in citation given] According to the 2010 census of the US Census Bureau blacks (including Hispanic blacks) comprised 13.6% of the US population.[43][44][45]
Hispanics (of all races) were 20.6% of the total jail and prison population in 2009.[42] Hispanics comprised 16.3% of the US population according to the 2010 US census.[43][46] The Northeast has the highest incarceration rates of Hispanics in the nation.[47] Connecticut has the highest Hispanic-to-White ratio with 6.6 Hispanic males for every white male. The National Average Hispanic-to-White ratio is 1.8. Other states with high Hispanic-to-White ratios include Massachusetts, Pennsylvania, and New York.[48]
Unlike other ethnic groups, the Hispanic community is not monolithic, and thus there are variations, even with incarceration rates. Among the Hispanic community, Puerto Ricans have the highest incarceration rate, and are up to six times more likely to be incarcerated than whites, and may explain the higher incarceration rates for Hispanics in the Northeast region.[49][50][51][52][53][54][55][56][57] Illegal Immigrants, usually of Mexican origin, also make up a substantial number of Hispanics incarcerated.[58][59][60]
In 2010 black non-Hispanic males were incarcerated at the rate of 4,347 inmates per 100,000 U.S. residents of the same race and gender. White males were incarcerated at the rate of 678 inmates per 100,000 U.S. residents. Hispanic males were incarcerated at the rate of 1,755 inmates per 100,000 U.S. residents.[41][61] For female rates see the table below.
However, black majority cities have similar crime statistics for blacks as do cities where majority of population is white. For example, white majority San Diego has a slightly lower crime rate for blacks than does Atlanta, a city which has black majority in population and city government.[62]
Census data for 2000, which included a count of the number and race of all individuals incarcerated in the United States, showed for each state that the proportion of blacks in prison populations exceeded the proportion of whites among state residents in every state.[63]
In twenty states, the percent of blacks incarcerated was at least five times greater than their share of resident population. Estimated number of inmates held in custody in state or federal prison, or in local jails, by sex, race, and Hispanic origin, June 30, 2009.[42]
Male Female
Year Totala Whiteb Blackb Hispanic Totala Whiteb Blackb Hispanic
2009 2,096,300 693,800 841,000 442,000 201,200 92,100 64,800 32,300
Note: Detailed categories exclude persons who reported two or more races. All totals include persons under age 18.
aIncludes American Indians, Alaska Natives, Asians, Native Hawaiians, and other Pacific Islanders, and persons identifying two or more races.
bExcludes persons of Hispanic or Latino origin.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racial_inequality_in_the_American_criminal_justice_system
Factors contributing to people going to prison
Blacks have a higher chance of going to prison especially if they dropout of high school. If a Black male drops out of high school, he has a 32.4% chance of going to prison while his White and Hispanic counterparts have a 6.7% and 6% chance, respectively.[4] Bruce Western and Becky Pettit use the example of the age cohort that grew up during the Great Depression. These men had to learn to value economic security because of the mass unemployment during the 1930s. They delayed marriage and fatherhood in order to establish themselves with economic security to provide for their families and became the “Greatest Generation” in America. [4]
In the latter part of the 20th century the age cohorts born in this time period never experienced a major event in their lives like the Great Depression and therefore underestimated their roles in society which has led to less educated individuals especially among minorities. Less education in urban areas tend to lead to negative influences on children growing up in this situation. Children who have a parent in prison are easily influenced by older children in their neighborhoods. They are then exposed to the life of drugs and violent crime that can lead them to join gangs and follow the same path as those adults in their neighborhood who are incarcerated.
http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/cats/births_deaths_marriages_divorces.html
Table 110. Death Rates by Race: 2008
[Rates per 100,000 population]
Characteristic 15 to 24 years 25 to 34 years 35 to 44 years 45 to 54 years
MALE
White:
2008 \2 103 133 214 501
Black:
2008 \2 159 225 348 828
Asian or Pacific
Islander \3:
2008 \2 50 55 88 223
American Indian,
Eskimo, Aleut \3:
2008 \2 151 199 315 618
http://theybf.com/2011/02/15/where-is-the-love-new-report-suggests-black-marriage-rates-falling-dangerously-low (an online magazine for black issues).
Although Valentine's Day is over, we still have a few "love and marriage" issues to tackle. A recent study by the U.S. Census Bureau released some pretty depressing statistics about Black marriage rates in America. Yes, it's what you thought. Deets inside...
The good news: Black LOVE isn't the problem. Folks are actually falling and basking in love more than ever.
Bad news: Black MARRIAGE now comes few and far between. While 70 percent of black families were headed by married couples in 1963, by 2002, it was down to 48 percent. And sadly, the new statistics don't show any signs of improvement. New data released by the U.S. Census Bureau paints a dreary picture about marriage in Black communities.
The report states:
(1) Forty-two percent of black adults have never been married, compared with just 26 percent of all American adults.
(2) By the time most black Americans reach their early 30s, half have never married, compared with 31 percent or less for other racial and ethnic groups.
(3) Black women ages 35 to 44 are the only group of American women of child-bearing age with lower rates of marriage than men of the same race or ethnicity.
(4) By their early 40s, 31 percent of black women have never been married, compared to 9 percent of white women, 11 percent of Asian women and 12 percent of Hispanic women.
http://iontheworld.wordpress.com/2010/02/16/the-color-of-crime-race-crime-and-justice-in-america/
The Color of Crime: Race, Crime and Justice in America
Major Findings
• There is more black-on-white than black-on-black violent crime.
• Of the approximately 1,700,000 interracial crimes of violence involving
blacks and whites, 90 percent are committed by blacks against whites.
• Blacks are therefore up to 250 times more likely to do criminal violence to whites than the reverse.
• Blacks commit violent crimes at four to eight times the white rate.
• Hispanics commit violent crimes at approximately three times the white rate,
and Asians at one half to three quarters the white rate.
• Blacks are twice as likely as whites to commit hate crimes.
Hispanics are a hate crime victim category but not a perpetrator category.
• Hispanic offenders are classified as whites, which inflates the white
offense rate and gives the impression that Hispanics commit no hate crimes.
• Blacks are as much more dangerous than whites as men are more
dangerous than women.
A fairly old publication from 1999, which is based on the FBI crime statistics, and which is technically accurate. It was written in response to earlier use of the information that glossed over the black on white crime rate and focused almost exclusively on the black on black crime rate- amazing how the same set of information can be used to push different agendas. I’ve snipped out a few of the more memorable quotes- remember the numbers are completely correct and verifiable from the FBI crime stats.
Of the approximately 1,700,000 interracial violent crimes involving blacks and whites reported every year, blacks commit 90 percent and whites commit only ten percent. Blacks are therefore more than 50 times more likely than whites to commit interracial crimes of violence. The differences are even greater for multiple-offender interracial crimes, with blacks 100 to 250 times more likely to be involved in gang attacks on whites than the reverse. Some people may argue that blacks attack whites because they expect them to be carrying cash or valuables. However, fewer than 20 percent of black attacks on whites are robberies; rape and assault do not usually have economic motives.
For virtually all crimes, there are consistent and pronounced differences in arrest rates for violent crime by race and ethnicity. Blacks are five to ten times more likely to be arrested than whites, Hispanics are approximately three times more likely, American Indians are about twice as likely, and Asians are only one half to two-thirds as likely to be arrested for violent crimes as whites. The very high rates for blacks means that the single best independent predictor of crime rates for an area is the percentage of the population that is black.
This is too large to print, but is a fascinating dissertation on victimization rates by race, marital status, income, age, homeownership, etc.:
http://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/vvr98.pdf
******************************
The above clarifies pretty much everything I said in multiple and previous posts.
If you study and stay in school, you’re more likely to have a better job, make a good income and not die or be killed. If you save for a down payment instead of buying a new car every 4 years and buy a home as opposed to renting, your chances of assault are about half that of renters. The same thing happens if you get married or stay married. If you do those things….statistically….regardless of race, your chances dramatically improve as to having a longer life due to less crime and likely higher income.
Interestingly, the two groups that do better on SAT scores (Asians and Whites) have lower crime statistics than most as well. Why is that? Are they smarter genetically? Highly unlikely, indeed, multiple studies have proven that’s not even remotely the case, but Asians more than any other group out there are well known for sticking their heads in their books, they understand the value of a good education…which is why they outshine pretty much everyone on damn near every graph….marriage stats, divorce stats, SAT scores, finishing college, likelihood of becoming a doctor, lawyer or some other higher paying employment.
Which is also why they can on the whole, also afford to move to areas where there is less crime, improving their general lot in life.
Of 100 people throwing baseballs at a bunch of milk bottles, someone’s GOING to come out on top of that list and someone is GOING to come out on the bottom. If life was all about knocking over milk bottles, I can absolutely guarantee you that the guy on the very bottom could absolutely, with practice (“study”) become better. He may ALWAYS suck at milk bottle toppling, but if he wanted to, he could improve. The guy at the top, cocky, sure of himself, might just be toppled in the rankings himself by some young buck out to prove himself if he didn’t keep honing his game…but after 5 – 10 matches, when you still have several of the top 10 remaining in the top 10….doesn’t that suggest that just maybe there’s something to be said about giving a shit enough to prepare yourself for a better future?
Is that racist? It must be because that’s all most can respond with when these kinds of stats are brought forward.
It’s not about Whites, or Blacks or Hispanics or Asians, it’s about effort. And the stats prove it.
Everyone that had an argument with the things I said above, did so because we're not supposed to talk about this stuff any more. It's not PC, so if anyone dares to suggest that statistics point to a scenario where one group does something we don't like, is harmful to others or ourselves, if someone suggests that one group over another does better in life...well, that's just horrible and of course...racist.
These stats don't have to be true, they just are.
I hire people of all races because I hire people who can do the task I pay them for. Whether they're Black or White, Latino or Asian, male or female, the ones that do well get promoted and earn raises, the ones who attempt to better themselves through company paid classes or (god forbid) on their own time even, almost always do better than those who just show up and "phone it in".
None of these stats would cause me to seek out more Asians, although clearly, the stats show that if I did, I'd have far smarter workers than if I hired Whites. And none of these stats will cause me to shun Blacks or Latino's even though their crime statistics are off the charts.
Every race has worked for me and all have done poorly and exceptionally well.
The ones that did exceptionally well, got to stay. The ones that didn't got booted.
Regardless of race.
< Message edited by LookieNoNookie -- 7/8/2012 10:17:21 AM >
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RE: Unemployment rate for blacks jumps to 14.4% - 
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