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Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:02:51 AM   
Proprietrix


Posts: 756
Joined: 7/15/2005
From: Ohio/West Virginia
Status: offline
I see a lot of people coming into the lifestyle saying they are looking for a good trainer or proper training.
It makes me very curious.

Aren’t relationships more a "learn as you go" kind of thing? We get a little bit older. We try out different relationships. We date people. It works out. Or it doesn’t work out. We go have a good time. Or we get bored. We learn what we like and what we don’t like by exploring and experiencing the world around us.
Some people realize somewhere along the way, that they have a taste for something kinky or a taste for a bit of power exchange in their relationships. And then, out of the blue, comes this notion that they are unable to have a relationship until they’ve undergone this mysterious ‘training’.

To be clear, I’m not talking about someone who is currently in a relationship with their Dominant and the Dominant is training them to a particular kind of service. I’m also not talking about someone who has a specific goal in mind of an activity they’d like to learn (i.e. "I’m looking for someone to teach me the safe way to throw a whip.")
I’m talking about single people, usually those new to the lifestyle, and more often than not, submissives, that come into the lifestyle and say "I’m new and looking for a trainer."
It baffles me.

Where/why is it that you’ve gotten the impression that you need training?
What type of training/trainer exactly are you looking for? Are you looking for someone who is going to teach you how to date other kinky people? Do you not know how to go out and make friends and date?
Have you been informed that there is a "School of BDSM" in which people become certified kink teachers and you have to pass their class before you’re allowed to go out and have an adult relationship?
Do you doubt your own ability to pursue and maintain relationships?

I also wonder…
Did you receive a good trainer and proper training in your vanilla relationships?
I seriously can not ever recall hearing the gals in school saying "My mom says I’m old enough to date now, so I’m looking for a boyfriend who will make a good trainer."
I don’t hear women at the bar saying they are there to pick up a trainer.

I’m very curious why a person would believe they need training or a trainer to pursue a non-vanilla relationship.
Anyone have any insight on this?

_____________________________

IMO, IMHO, YMMV, AFAIK, to me, I see it as, from my perspective, it's been my experience, I only speak for myself, (and all other disclaimers here).
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RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:11:17 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		I am wholly concerned with this as well.  Excellent Post.  It's same for me that everyone has to go back to school to get a BA in everything that comes along........

Is it just a comfortable way to say I wanna play around?  (You know, like girls do........rather than say "Fuck me in the ass...." they say "Put it in my bottom")

It is unlikely much more than some overromanticized deal......cause I double goddamn guarentee you... whatever "House in Europe"  or "Vietmanese Spin Fuck Chair MegaMaster" trained you, it:

A. Ain't the way I want a blowjob.
B.  Is something I want to hear about.
C.  Is anything useful when dealing with me

LOL,
Ron.



_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to Proprietrix)
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RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:16:55 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline 		In my experience possibly the school of thought that you need training comes from some of the messages you recieve on here. Even now when i have been here a few months i still get several msgs a day asking if  i require training, mentoring etc.
 
I think that possibly because when you are collared the fact your Master does tend to give you training would also come into it. Perhaps it is looked at like a basic course before you get into the real thing!
 
I certainly know how to go out and make friends and date but would be terrified at the thought of going to a munch or bdsm occasion on my own, where as i would go to a pub, club in the nilla world anytime by myself. We all grew up with nilla dating around us but few of us would have grown up with open bdsm relationships to learn from. I don't know about others but i certainly felt very lost and in need of a friend when i first began to explore my submissive side. I never felt lost in nilla dating due to the fact its all around you and you learn from watching others.
 
I personally have learnt lots from Dom's who have become my friends and i suppose in a way you could call it basic training - laying the foundations for a relationship i may or may not find in the future.

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to Proprietrix)
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RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:17:01 AM   
KatyLied


Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		I agree.  Training is a concept that I will never understand.  How can someone "train" you for another person?  I only want to be "trained" by the Dom who I am in a relationship with. 
So, call it "play" call is "scening" but don't call it "training".  There are no universal accepted training requirements for sub/slaves.

_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to mnottertail)
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RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:19:02 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline 		It's an online relationship novice frenzy thing.

According to the advice that they get, getting actual COLLARS are verbotten for novices- but mentors and trainers are "safe and fair game."

They want that RELATIONSHIP so much that they skip over and completely lose their heads.  They mistake a few hot scenes for an actual relationship.  They mistake a few hot whispered words as actual wisdom and understanding.

And I myself have yet to figure out how to stop them once they go on that path.  It's so maddening to take a novice to the side, personally explain to them your own mistakes, your own problems, and that they should just take it easy and enjoy.  Have them nod at everything, thank you SO profusely for helping them and that they feel much more relieved and ready and ok with things.

Then the next week they show up in a locked collar to a guy they met from a website.  Sigh.

If I knew how make them slow down and realize what was going on without taking away their adult responsibilities and consent, I would.  But I haven't figured out an effective way to do that yet.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to Proprietrix)
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RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:20:34 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied
I agree.  Training is a concept that I will never understand.  How can someone "train" you for another person?  I only want to be "trained" by the Dom who I am in a relationship with. 
So, call it "play" call is "scening" but don't call it "training".  There are no universal accepted training requirements for sub/slaves.

Well I understand the idea of training or being trained for someone else.  If I were sent to cooking school to learn French style sauces and cooking, that would be an example of being trained by someone to serve someone else.

However, what most novices rush into is exactly what you say- playing and kinky fucking, with no real conception of their ultimate goal.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to KatyLied)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:20:49 AM   
missturbation


Posts: 8290
Joined: 2/12/2006
From: another planet
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mnottertail



Is it just a comfortable way to say I wanna play around?  (You know, like girls do........rather than say "Fuck me in the ass...." they say "Put it in my bottom")






Don't ya just love generalisation??????????/
If this girl wants fucking in the ass she will say 'fuck me in the ass' 

_____________________________

What you don't witness with your eyes, don't witness with your mouth. Proverb.

If it fit's in a toaster, i can cook it.

Buying 10 item's or less is not shopping !!

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:21:18 AM   
mnottertail


Posts: 60698
Joined: 11/3/2004
Status: offline 		Well for fuck's sake LA, don't include links in anything you write them.............


LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL,
Ron

_____________________________

Have they not divided the prey; to every man a damsel or two? Judges 5:30


(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:21:37 AM   
zumala


Posts: 1121
Joined: 6/16/2005
Status: offline 		Good question.  I guess vanilla relationships don't require 'training' because there isn't nearly as much protocol or skilled activities that can be involved.  Boyfriends and girlfriends don't really specify 'you must do this and this in this way or I will whip you'.  Any nilla that did that would get dumped on their ass.
 
Just from hanging around on the boards, I've seen that a lot of people are:
A) Looking for different things (activities, actions, skills, beliefs, etc)
B) Expecting different things
 
Some feel they are dominant, but have no practical skills or experience, so they seek training.  Submissives know they must 'act' submissive to be acceptable, but what one Dom wants another might not OR they aren't sure what actions a submissive should take, so they want training.
 
BDSM relationship dynamics look to be pretty different from nilla in some respects.  A newbie just doesn't know what's going on.  I still don't.  So far all I've figured out is that I'm married to another submissive, we're monogamous, but probably would like to find a Dom couple for a non-sexual D/s relationship.  So we hang around in hopes of learning how to discern a good Dom from a bad Dom.  What we might expect in that type of relationship.  Things like that.
 
zuma

< Message edited by zumala -- 6/8/2006 10:25:11 AM >

(in reply to mnottertail)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:24:14 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		I thought I was the weird one in that I always thought I needed my dominant to train me to what he wanted me to do. I never had much interest in being trained by someone I wasnt actively being kinky with. I think the idea comes from CastleRealm on one page where jade speaks of being "trained" before she met her "One".  Although it could have other roots for all I know.

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 6/8/2006 10:25:11 AM >

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to Proprietrix)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:34:13 AM   
amayos


Posts: 1553
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: New England
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Proprietrix


I see a lot of people coming into the lifestyle saying they are looking for a good trainer or proper training.
It makes me very curious.

Aren’t relationships more a "learn as you go" kind of thing?

To be clear, I’m not talking about someone who is currently in a relationship with their Dominant and the Dominant is training them to a particular kind of service. I’m also not talking about someone who has a specific goal in mind of an activity they’d like to learn (i.e. "I’m looking for someone to teach me the safe way to throw a whip.")
I’m talking about single people, usually those new to the lifestyle, and more often than not, submissives, that come into the lifestyle and say "I’m new and looking for a trainer."
It baffles me.

What type of training/trainer exactly are you looking for? Are you looking for someone who is going to teach you how to date other kinky people? Do you not know how to go out and make friends and date?
Have you been informed that there is a "School of BDSM" in which people become certified kink teachers and you have to pass their class before you’re allowed to go out and have an adult relationship?
Do you doubt your own ability to pursue and maintain relationships?

I also wonder…
Did you receive a good trainer and proper training in your vanilla relationships?
I seriously can not ever recall hearing the gals in school saying "My mom says I’m old enough to date now, so I’m looking for a boyfriend who will make a good trainer."
I don’t hear women at the bar saying they are there to pick up a trainer.

I’m very curious why a person would believe they need training or a trainer to pursue a non-vanilla relationship.
Anyone have any insight on this?


I suppose this all hinges upon that relative word "relationship." Any form of interaction is a relationship to one degree or another. Do you seek to hone your abilities as a servant or are you merely looking for a dating partner with a sprinkle of kink? Are you looking for a Master / Mistress or a mate—or that elusive, all-in-one panacea entity? I think it speaks well of a newcomer who searches in terms of training first rather than making the dating/mating concept a priority; it shows they are open to learning without necessarily stepping into a form of deeper relation that may be above their heads. There is often nothing illegitimate about seeking training at all, in my opinion.

(in reply to Proprietrix)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:37:51 AM   
kisshou


Posts: 2425
Joined: 2/11/2005
Status: offline 		Way before I met the Owner, I was the girl that LuckyA was talking about.

It is because you have this part of yourself that you have never told anyone about. You know it is there and you know you have those feelings but you feel separated from everyone else in the world , thinking you are the only one. All the stuff you are feeling is against everything on tv, in magazines and the media. Then you go online and you realize you are not alone in these feelings. It is overwhelming and you go into that crazy frenzy. Then you think to find the best Master you need to be the best submissive possible. In school you study to become the best so it seem logical to be trained to become the best. It is like when people fall in love , not that they are totally irrational but also their feet are not touching the ground. You are somewhere in the middle. The only thing that brings you back to earth is time and the eventual realization that being trained for it is not the same as living it. I also think during this time you do not view dominants as people more as some ubar God like persona.

Thankfully you grow up and out of it though!

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:39:29 AM   
marieToo


Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline 		Fast reply:

BDSM relationships, in my view, are no different than any others in most aspects except the power exhange and some of the play.  Its not a "position" to "train" for, any more than its about going on an "interview".  Yet I see these words all the time.  Mentor, lifestyle, trainer, interview, yada yada yada.  Its about trial and error, finding chemistry, seeking what we want and all the other basics that other relationships are founded on, sometimes its about being left fucked up, or heartbroken, or in love, or with a soulmate.  I believe that some levels of bdsm can be dangerous for a vulnerable mind, but then so can some vanilla leave you messed up afterwards, if you chose the wrong partner.  I have never understood and never will understand the level of  'snobbiness or self-importance'  that I see in these types of forums that speak to the fact that somehow we are 'special' or different than anyone else.  Im sorry, for me thats just not the case.

The only place I could see where any training of any kind should come in, is with regards to certain implements and types of play.  ie...suspension, violet wand, bullwhip etc.  I would hope that most would seek out some type of information with regards to usage and safety and of course practice before using on a human being.

(in reply to zumala)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:44:24 AM   
marieToo


Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied
I agree.  Training is a concept that I will never understand.  How can someone "train" you for another person?  I only want to be "trained" by the Dom who I am in a relationship with. 
So, call it "play" call is "scening" but don't call it "training".  There are no universal accepted training requirements for sub/slaves.

Well I understand the idea of training or being trained for someone else.  If I were sent to cooking school to learn French style sauces and cooking, that would be an example of being trained by someone to serve someone else.

However, what most novices rush into is exactly what you say- playing and kinky fucking, with no real conception of their ultimate goal.


If you take the word kinky out of the above statement, the same sentence could be said for any young or immature (novice) vanilla girl who is embarking on her first sexual parternship or relationship. 

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:46:53 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo
If you take the word kinky out of the above statement, the same sentence could be said for any young or immature (novice) vanilla girl who is embarking on her first sexual parternship or relationship. 

Or boy.

And it's just as stupid.

Rushing into something because your hormones are surging, because you finally feel FREE, because you are so desparate to HAVE SOMETHING...pretty much the worst reasons to act- doesn't matter what decision you are making in what arena.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to marieToo)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 10:55:36 AM   
KatyLied


Posts: 13029
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
Status: offline 		(fast reply)

My problem with the entire "training" scenario, beyond the silliness of it, is the real possibility that it can be used to take advantage of  those new to the lifestyle.  They think that "training" will help them be a better participant in the lifestyle.  Often the "trainer" is just a guise for taking advantage and having some fun.  And yes, adults should know better than to step into such a trap, but sometimes people are too caught up or wanting to experience that first "official" taste of the lifestyle.  I think there is a lot of danger there.


_____________________________

“If you want to live a happy life, tie it to a goal, not to people or things.”
- Albert Einstein

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 11:00:19 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: KatyLied
I think there is a lot of danger there.

There absolutely is.

Luckily MOST of the time it's emotional- it's what causes the "What do I do now?" posts or the griping "He promised me!" posts or the "I am so badly hurt and how do I trust again?" posts.

It is the rare case in which a person is physically damaged or has a real part of their life put into distress- although it does happen as well.

Like I said- if I KNEW how to smack the novices around and MAKE them slow down and listen without taking away their choice or coddling them (which is just as bad), I would.  Unfortunately this seems to be an arena in which people learn best by simply running into their own walls and learning how to stop slamming into them on their own.

_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to KatyLied)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 11:00:30 AM   
marieToo


Posts: 3595
Joined: 5/21/2006
From: Jersey
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LuckyAlbatross

quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo
If you take the word kinky out of the above statement, the same sentence could be said for any young or immature (novice) vanilla girl who is embarking on her first sexual parternship or relationship. 

Or boy.

And it's just as stupid.

Rushing into something because your hormones are surging, because you finally feel FREE, because you are so desparate to HAVE SOMETHING...pretty much the worst reasons to act- doesn't matter what decision you are making in what arena.


I agree, but its human nature and the way that we learn.  We do stupid things when we are young or inexperienced. The only problem is we dont realize it was stupid until 10 yrs later.  My point was it applies to bdsm or vanillas...and yes...boy or girl.   or 'novice'

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 11:01:56 AM   
timeoutgurlie


Posts: 588
Joined: 3/21/2006
Status: offline 		I still get tons of mails, clearly from people who never check any of the posts I've made here  asking if I have been trained already, and making offers to traint me if I haven't previously done so.  You know these fuckers write it in a way that it's meant to be like they're doing you a favor?  I even read once "There is usually a fee, but for you, seeing as you're so young and have never been into the scene, I'll train you free of charge" -- Yeah thanks you over the hill predatory asshole, I'm so impressed by your generosity that you'd actually get a 19 year old naked for free and touch her body, possibly having sex with her as you stated in your mail...you're almost a fucking saint, where do I sign?!?

**Disclaimer**  Depsite this post, I have no problems with dirty old men so long as they don't bother me with offers of 'kindness'

One even had the audacity to tell me I should be ashamed of myself and I'd never be a sub because I didn't reply to his mail or thank him for the offer.  I replied with, "Have not reached that lesson in training, scheduled to learn how to reply to junkmail in the near future"

(in reply to LuckyAlbatross)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Newbies who are looking for trainers... ??? - 6/8/2006 11:02:33 AM   
LuckyAlbatross


Posts: 19224
Joined: 10/25/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: marieToo
I agree, but its human nature and the way that we learn.  We do stupid things when we are young or inexperienced. The only problem is we dont realize it was stupid until 10 yrs later.  My point was it applies to bdsm or vanillas...and yes...boy or girl.   or 'novice'

Being young has nothing to do with it.  And luckily it only took me two weeks before I realized how stupid I was being.  Not that I stopped making mistakes then, but I stopped acting like the typical novice in frenzy.

But we agree- this is a life issue, not a bdsm issue.  Unfortunately, so many people see bdsm as "different/shiny/new/better" than they don't get it until after a few scraped knees.



_____________________________

Find stable partners, not a stable of partners.

"Sometimes my whore logic gets all fuzzy"- Californication

(in reply to marieToo)
Profile   Post #: 20
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