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RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 4:02:22 AM   
Musicmystery


Posts: 30259
Joined: 3/14/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Yep. This has been my main gripe with the law. If it had been in place five years ago, the cost of not simply doing without health insurance for half a year, would have been a dealbreaker for me taking a leap of faith towards a better life for myself and my family.

The next guy in the spot I was in, is just going to be fucked, and stuck in the dead ender.

There's an army of 50 something workers hanging onto their jobs only because they provide health insurance. Providing affordable alternatives (which COBRA is not) means those jobs will be available to other/younger workers, and that more small businesses will be creating by people wanted to work, just not as employees, creating additional jobs.

Even better would have been national single payer, but one step at a time.

(in reply to TheHeretic)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 5:45:07 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: slvemike4u


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

This isn't new. Looks to me like the OP is grasping at straws.

Given the events of the last few days this is understandable.
I have a feeling the "oh my god there is a black man in the Oval Office" feeling is going to stick for a few more years
Now I am not,for a moment suggesting that everyone who would like to see him out feels this way....just pointing out what should be obvious to most....there are indeed citizens of this great land who can not fathom the fact that a *gasp* black man sits behind that desk.
Not suggesting for a moment that our buddy Subrob is one of these folks....not suggesting that at all,I'm just saying


I would hope that all adults are aware that there is still racism is the us, if they aren't then then they have some serious issues. Having Obama in office didn't change that. But that won't stop some on the left from trying to use it to gain a few votes here and there. As to SR, of course you meant to imply he was one of those folks. You would say it outright if it wasn't for those pesky gold letters they hand out. So you tack it on to the end of your post knowing most people will figure out what you are trying to say.

_____________________________

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This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to slvemike4u)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 5:49:05 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

Or they could get insurance and not face the tax......



Are you suggesting that all the people without insurance actually have the money to buy it, but don't because there was never a law requiring them to? And now they are going to trot off and get some to avoid that tax?]

Interesting theory

_____________________________

"Sweetie, you're wasting your gum" .. Albert


This here is the boi formerly known as orfunboi


(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 6:57:55 AM   
LaTigresse


Posts: 26123
Joined: 1/15/2006
Status: offline 		I know quite a few people that do not have health insurance and say they cannot afford it........but they could.

If they gave up stuff like

Owning half a dozen or more horses
" " dogs
" " cats
" " kids

Going on vacations every year
Thinking they need a new car every couple of years
Owning and racing cars
" " motorcycles
Competing in Demolition Derbys
Eating out 3-10 times a week
Buying coffee at the coffee place rather than brew it at home
Buying crap magazines(People, Equirer, etc) by the armloads
Buying crap to put into their bodies that only cause them to become more unhealthy (soda, cigarettes, junk food)
Buying fancy cell phones, big screen televisions, etc.

And the list goes on and on.

The above list are things that I have seen, with my own eyes, from people I know personally. People that say they cannot afford to pay for health insurance. People that go running to the ER when they get sick and blow off paying anything for the services they've gotten. People that dive for the paperwork to get Title 19, or whatever it is, to help pay the bill......then welch on whatever is left. People that would sooner file bankruptcy than try to pay off a few thousand dollar (or more) medical bill.

Hell, I know someone that bought a $30,000.00 motorcycle, then totalled it a month or so after it was purchased. He had no health insurance and had a $65,000.00 medical bill (last I heard......still not finished) Guess how much he will end up paying........ZERO!!!!!!!! Because he still qualifies for government aid.

Yay for the current system!!! Booo for a system that forces people to take some personal responsibility. Ya.......cuz yanno, we just gotta hate on those people that don't pay taxes. Well, the person with the $65,000.00 and counting medical bill does pay taxes. But I seriously doubt the taxes he pays will hit the $65,000.00 mark anytime soon.

In a lot of ways I get the old school Repub ideals......unfortunately they've gone so far off the rails there isn't a one of them left I would vote for. They have fucked themselves by refusing to be realistic.

_____________________________

My twisted, self deprecating, sense of humour, finds alot to laugh about, in your lack of one!

Just because you are well educated, articulate, and can use big, fancy words, properly........does not mean you are right!

(in reply to thishereboi)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 7:42:41 AM   
DomYngBlk


Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi


quote:

ORIGINAL: DomYngBlk

Or they could get insurance and not face the tax......



Are you suggesting that all the people without insurance actually have the money to buy it, but don't because there was never a law requiring them to? And now they are going to trot off and get some to avoid that tax?]

Interesting theory


Not suggesting that. But if you read the bill you will see those that can't afford will be offered help so that it is affordable. Quite the contrary to RomneyCare which will repeal what is law now and return people to the good old days of worrying about their health care

(in reply to thishereboi)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 7:46:25 AM   
DomYngBlk


Posts: 3316
Joined: 3/27/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I know quite a few people that do not have health insurance and say they cannot afford it........but they could.

If they gave up stuff like

Owning half a dozen or more horses
" " dogs
" " cats
" " kids

Going on vacations every year
Thinking they need a new car every couple of years
Owning and racing cars
" " motorcycles
Competing in Demolition Derbys
Eating out 3-10 times a week
Buying coffee at the coffee place rather than brew it at home
Buying crap magazines(People, Equirer, etc) by the armloads
Buying crap to put into their bodies that only cause them to become more unhealthy (soda, cigarettes, junk food)
Buying fancy cell phones, big screen televisions, etc.

And the list goes on and on.

The above list are things that I have seen, with my own eyes, from people I know personally. People that say they cannot afford to pay for health insurance. People that go running to the ER when they get sick and blow off paying anything for the services they've gotten. People that dive for the paperwork to get Title 19, or whatever it is, to help pay the bill......then welch on whatever is left. People that would sooner file bankruptcy than try to pay off a few thousand dollar (or more) medical bill.

Hell, I know someone that bought a $30,000.00 motorcycle, then totalled it a month or so after it was purchased. He had no health insurance and had a $65,000.00 medical bill (last I heard......still not finished) Guess how much he will end up paying........ZERO!!!!!!!! Because he still qualifies for government aid.

Yay for the current system!!! Booo for a system that forces people to take some personal responsibility. Ya.......cuz yanno, we just gotta hate on those people that don't pay taxes. Well, the person with the $65,000.00 and counting medical bill does pay taxes. But I seriously doubt the taxes he pays will hit the $65,000.00 mark anytime soon.

In a lot of ways I get the old school Repub ideals......unfortunately they've gone so far off the rails there isn't a one of them left I would vote for. They have fucked themselves by refusing to be realistic.


Not sure where you live but here you can't do anything of the sort. The Hospital comes after you for each and every dime up to and including garnishing wages.......

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 2:41:57 PM   
papassion


Posts: 487
Joined: 3/28/2012
Status: offline
What makes you think Romney won't replace Obamacare with a better, more streamlined healthcare system? Didn't Romney's state have a healthcare delivery system BEFORE Obama's 10,000 page fuckup? And whats with the worry about penalties for not having healthcare? Didn't Obama crow about and PROMISE the insurers cannot refuse you for "preexisting" conditions? So if you have, or do not have, insurance, they must insure you when you need it and apply. Ain't america great!

(in reply to DomYngBlk)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 2:45:44 PM   
OttersSwim


Posts: 2860
Joined: 9/1/2008
Status: offline 		Romney will do nothing positive for anyone earning less than $250,000 a year.

NOTHING

_____________________________

I am on a journey of authenticity and self.

(in reply to papassion)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 2:54:55 PM   
papassion


Posts: 487
Joined: 3/28/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen


quote:

ORIGINAL: atursvcMaam

This one's a piece of cake actually. the real beartrap of taxes go into effect in january of 2013. It'll be a blast.
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/taxmageddon_in_KeiGQ2lz9pDtsBQfSoCxpJ

The horror, tax rates would return to the levels we enjoyed during the 1990's when the economy expanded and so did the number of jobs and the average salary.

What ever will we do?


well, a LOT of the jobs that existed in the 90's are now in China, India, etc., etc. and won't likely return. And every day, the jobs that are still here are being replaced with automation. Robotics that don't ask for vacation, sick days, raises, healthcare and pensions. Dreaming about the "ole days" is nice, but not relavent in todays economy.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:11:17 PM   
tazzygirl


Posts: 37833
Joined: 10/12/2007
Status: offline 		And who sent those jobs overseas? hmm?

_____________________________

Telling me to take Midol wont help your butthurt.
RIP, my demon-child 5-16-11
Duchess of Dissent 1
Dont judge me because I sin differently than you.
If you want it sugar coated, dont ask me what i think! It would violate TOS.

(in reply to papassion)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:12:59 PM   
SternSkipper


Posts: 7546
Joined: 3/7/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Class Americans


Yeah but "middle class" is people making $250,000/year -- Romney 'splained it to me.


Hey you think Rob will know how I can get back some of that $28k Romney SAYS I HAVEN'T BEEN PAYING IN TAXES THE PAST FEW YEARS since I went solo?
Cause it would be nice if I could get it back if I am going to have a President who says I am "not his concern".

_____________________________

Looking forward to The Dead Singing The National Anthem At The World Series.




Tinfoilers Swallow


(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:17:34 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

The story Obama doesn't want you to read...

quote:

WASHINGTON (AP) — Nearly 6 million Americans — most of them in the middle class — will face a tax penalty for not carrying medical coverage once President Barack Obama's health care overhaul law is fully in place, congressional budget analysts said Wednesday.

The new estimate amounts to an inconvenient fact for the administration, a reminder of what critics see as broken promises.

The numbers from the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office are significantly higher than a previous projection by the same office in 2010, shortly after the law passed.

The earlier estimate found 4 million people would be affected in 2016, when the penalty is fully in effect. The difference — 2 million people— represents a 50 percent increase.


By RICARDO ALONSO-ZALDIVAR Associated Press


Subrob....I know you're ultimately on the right side of this argument but...this is old news....more importantly, unless and until we can get these pricks to quit spending more than they take in....someone (we all) need to pay more.

That's just simple math.

Whether it's via new insurance edicts or (other) taxes....

We owe a fuckload of money...and EVERYONE (contrary to those in the 47%) needs to pay more to make it go all away.

(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:19:29 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

This isn't new. Looks to me like the OP is grasping at straws.


He's making a substantial (and unbelievably valid) point...he just didn't finish it.

(in reply to DomKen)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:19:31 PM   
subrob1967


Posts: 4591
Joined: 9/13/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Class Americans


Yeah but "middle class" is people making $250,000/year -- Romney 'splained it to me.


Hey you think Rob will know how I can get back some of that $28k Romney SAYS I HAVEN'T BEEN PAYING IN TAXES THE PAST FEW YEARS since I went solo?
Cause it would be nice if I could get it back if I am going to have a President who says I am "not his concern".



You can hop in your dinghy and float on off to Cuba Skippy

_____________________________

http://www.extra-life.org/

(in reply to SternSkipper)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:21:19 PM   
SternSkipper


Posts: 7546
Joined: 3/7/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tazzygirl

And who sent those jobs overseas? hmm?


Silly Tazzy ... You had the power to get those jobs back all along. All you had to do is click your ruby slippers together and repeat " There's no place like India,theres no place like India".

_____________________________

Looking forward to The Dead Singing The National Anthem At The World Series.




Tinfoilers Swallow


(in reply to tazzygirl)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:22:00 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

quote:

Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Class Americans


Yeah but "middle class" is people making $250,000/year -- Romney 'splained it to me.


Interesting....I'm pretty sure that's the very same number Obama used as "middle class", "not going to get a tax increase" because of....(etc.).

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:24:46 PM   
SternSkipper


Posts: 7546
Joined: 3/7/2004
Status: offline 		Or just become a moral reprobate like Mitt Romney, and fuck everybody you run into. It's the NEO-American way.

_____________________________

Looking forward to The Dead Singing The National Anthem At The World Series.




Tinfoilers Swallow


(in reply to SternSkipper)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:28:40 PM   
SternSkipper


Posts: 7546
Joined: 3/7/2004
Status: offline 		w
quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967


quote:

ORIGINAL: SternSkipper


quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery

Jabber
quote:

Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Class Americans


Yeah but "middle class" is people making $250,000/year -- Romney 'splained it to me.


Hey you think Rob will know how I can get back some of that $28k Romney SAYS I HAVEN'T BEEN PAYING IN TAXES THE PAST FEW YEARS since I went solo?
Cause it would be nice if I could get it back if I am going to have a President who says I am "not his concern".



You can hop in your dinghy and float on off to Cuba Skippy

That where you've been filing from?

_____________________________

Looking forward to The Dead Singing The National Anthem At The World Series.




Tinfoilers Swallow


(in reply to subrob1967)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:29:03 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Musicmystery


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheHeretic

Yep. This has been my main gripe with the law. If it had been in place five years ago, the cost of not simply doing without health insurance for half a year, would have been a dealbreaker for me taking a leap of faith towards a better life for myself and my family.

The next guy in the spot I was in, is just going to be fucked, and stuck in the dead ender.

There's an army of 50 something workers hanging onto their jobs only because they provide health insurance. Providing affordable alternatives (which COBRA is not) means those jobs will be available to other/younger workers, and that more small businesses will be creating by people wanted to work, just not as employees, creating additional jobs.

Even better would have been national single payer, but one step at a time.


I'll tell you what's going to happen (speaking as an employer, who by the way, pays 100% of its employees premiums....the average employer pays 70%).

I don't recall the exact numbers but it's something like "fewer than 25 employees" (someone will correct me, I'm sure)...that this doesn't (won't) apply to.

So...any successful restaurant/business, achieving local success, wanting (desirous of) expanding....either won't or...they'll open a totally different corporation to expand with....all under 25 employees.

Different names, same formats...probably even similar names with marketing innuendos to suggest the other (location).

All of which will raise the cost of doing business (separate bookkeepers/office staff), forcing an ever downward spiral of small corporations each held by a larger shell.....that shell being run by of course, fewer than 25 employees.

(It's actually fairly simple to do....just requires a lot of lawyers. Just what we need....more lawyers).

(in reply to Musicmystery)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Obama raises taxes on 6 MILLION uninsured Middle Cl... - 9/20/2012 3:30:37 PM   
LookieNoNookie


Posts: 12216
Joined: 8/9/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: LaTigresse

I know quite a few people that do not have health insurance and say they cannot afford it........but they could.

If they gave up stuff like

Owning half a dozen or more horses
" " dogs
" " cats
" " kids

Going on vacations every year
Thinking they need a new car every couple of years
Owning and racing cars
" " motorcycles
Competing in Demolition Derbys
Eating out 3-10 times a week
Buying coffee at the coffee place rather than brew it at home
Buying crap magazines(People, Equirer, etc) by the armloads
Buying crap to put into their bodies that only cause them to become more unhealthy (soda, cigarettes, junk food)
Buying fancy cell phones, big screen televisions, etc.

And the list goes on and on.

The above list are things that I have seen, with my own eyes, from people I know personally. People that say they cannot afford to pay for health insurance. People that go running to the ER when they get sick and blow off paying anything for the services they've gotten. People that dive for the paperwork to get Title 19, or whatever it is, to help pay the bill......then welch on whatever is left. People that would sooner file bankruptcy than try to pay off a few thousand dollar (or more) medical bill.

Hell, I know someone that bought a $30,000.00 motorcycle, then totalled it a month or so after it was purchased. He had no health insurance and had a $65,000.00 medical bill (last I heard......still not finished) Guess how much he will end up paying........ZERO!!!!!!!! Because he still qualifies for government aid.

Yay for the current system!!! Booo for a system that forces people to take some personal responsibility. Ya.......cuz yanno, we just gotta hate on those people that don't pay taxes. Well, the person with the $65,000.00 and counting medical bill does pay taxes. But I seriously doubt the taxes he pays will hit the $65,000.00 mark anytime soon.

In a lot of ways I get the old school Repub ideals......unfortunately they've gone so far off the rails there isn't a one of them left I would vote for. They have fucked themselves by refusing to be realistic.


OMG....someone using actual, real world facts to disseminate this argument.

(God forbid!).

(in reply to LaTigresse)
Profile   Post #: 40
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