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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 1:45:19 AM   
tweakabelle


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From: Sydney Australia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


No they aren't only Hamas believes in genocide.

You are wrong on this point.
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/08/01/israeli-newspaper-when-genocide-is-permissable/

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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 3:39:58 AM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

Actually fundamentally NI has nothing in common with Israel/Palestine.
In NI the IRA was responsive to the people. In 1972 when the Provisionals kidnapped and killed a Derry man home on leave from the British Army it outraged the people so much it forced the IRA bring down the barricades and let the police back into Free Derry.
Can you imagine any such incident happening with Hamas?


No Ken, the baracades were torn down by the army, not the IRA nor the people of Londonderry. The point is both sides needed unconditional talks before there was any hope of peace.

Tweakable..... I stand corrected I confused the SDLP with the UDP. John Hulme of the SDLP and Gerry Adams of the IRA did indeed do much for the peace talks in the early days. From memory the first talks on the subject were with Labour Government in the mid 70s.

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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 4:09:32 AM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Germany must be so proud

Anti-Semitism Rises in Europe





It is just a shame you can neither read nor comprehend the article you have linked too.

(in reply to Sanity)
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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 4:15:25 AM   
Politesub53


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

Sheesh! It really ain't rocket science.



Yeah it is




Lmfao........ Ever heard of photoshop ?

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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 4:30:33 AM   
freedomdwarf1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

But, as I have demonstrated (and provided links) when Bama made this claim, the fact that daily rocket attacks didn't start happening until Egypt and Israel between them made the total blockade of Gaza.
Israel alone are the ones that are vehemently and doggedly enforcing the blockade on land and sea.
I do not see you providing any creditable links to refute this position.


In one paragraph you admit that both the Egyptians and Israelis are blockading Gaza then pretend that it is only the Israelis. Is this because if they are being treated as the prime threat to stability by Arabs your view of the situation falls apart like a house of cards?

Because, dumbass, only Israel swallows about 90% of the border of Gaza.
Egypt has a tiny little bit (about 6-7 miles) that borders with North Sinai. The rest is with Israel.

I don't pretend it is just Israel - that's your spin on my words.
If you read what I actually typed: "Israel alone are the ones that are vehemently and doggedly enforcing the blockade on land and sea".
Egypt have opened the border several times but only Israel blocks just about everything going through, including people.
This one act alone, that Israel will not budge on despite promises, has brought the Palestinian economy down.



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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 4:39:07 AM   
freedomdwarf1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

Sheesh! It really ain't rocket science.



Yeah it is




Lmfao........ Ever heard of photoshop ?


Interesting.... did you note the caption in the top-left of the picture??

"....inside a residential building"... Oh really??
I wonder how many people live inside their homes (even out there) where their living room looks like a piece of waste land with no roof and trees growing!!
It's next to a wall of some sort, yes. But "inside", really?? Pull the other one - the bells are bigger!!
That looks very much like a 'shopped pic released by the Israeli propaganda machine.


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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 5:11:59 AM   
freedomdwarf1


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Joined: 10/23/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: tweakabelle


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


No they aren't only Hamas believes in genocide.

You are wrong on this point.
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/08/01/israeli-newspaper-when-genocide-is-permissable/

Just to save Bama et al from looking it up, I'll reproduce the salient bits -

The Times of Israel, a leading Israeli newspaper, today published an article entitled: When Genocide is Permissable – in the context of the nation’s bombardment of Gaza which has killed 1,400 Palestinians, more than 80% of which are civilian and one third children.

[Excerpt from the article they published -]
"...News anchors such as those from CNN, BBC and Al-Jazeera have not missed an opportunity to point out the majority of innocent civilians who have lost their lives as a result of this war..."
"If political leaders and military experts determine that the only way to achieve its goal of sustaining quiet is through genocide is it then permissible to achieve those responsible goals?"

It concludes with: "After a wave of uproar from the international social media community, the post was taken down."
[emphasis mine]
I wonder how many of those protesting on social media were Americans??
Not many I'm guessing - because the US backs Israel to a fault and they don't want to lose face in the eyes of the international community.

The newspaper, in another article, also reports -
"Prime Minister Netanyahu announced earlier Saturday that the IDF would redeploy when it completes demolishing Hamas tunnels, but that the operation in Gaza would continue for as long as needed to ensure sustained calm for Israel. He indicated that Israel would not seek ceasefire agreements with Hamas..."

Those two reports, from an Israeli newspaper, tell me that Israel is hell-bent on genocide until it has smashed Gaza to a pulp and completely obliterated it from the face of the earth.
This is not allowed under any circumstances in international law and is just as vile and contemptible as any Hamas extremist.


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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 5:21:24 AM   
freedomdwarf1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Germany must be so proud

Anti-Semitism Rises in Europe



It is just a shame you can neither read nor comprehend the article you have linked too.


Sanity only looks at the pic then spins it to fit their agenda.

So... Germany had a protest march which was anti-semitic.
All sorts of protests are allowed in countries that have true free speech.
But, that doesn't mean the country, as a whole or it's government, support it.

But of course, Sanity likes to believe it's like that over here. lol.


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“If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.”
George Orwell, 1903-1950


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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 6:25:22 AM   
DomKen


Posts: 19457
Joined: 7/4/2004
From: Chicago, IL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Germany must be so proud

Anti-Semitism Rises in Europe



It is just a shame you can neither read nor comprehend the article you have linked too.


Sanity only looks at the pic then spins it to fit their agenda.

So... Germany had a protest march which was anti-semitic.
All sorts of protests are allowed in countries that have true free speech.
But, that doesn't mean the country, as a whole or it's government, support it.

But of course, Sanity likes to believe it's like that over here. lol.


Anti Semitic marches aren't legal in Germany. So the police must have turned a blind eye toward it.

(in reply to freedomdwarf1)
Profile   Post #: 589
RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 6:29:51 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53

It is just a shame you can neither read nor comprehend the article you have linked too.



quote:

“We have all always felt the latent anti-Semitism here,” Ms. Melchert-Arlt said. “But what we have experienced in recent weeks and days, not only in Germany but across Europe, is a prevailing mood of outward anti-Jewish sentiment in the streets.”


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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 6:40:35 AM   
freedomdwarf1


Posts: 6845
Joined: 10/23/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DomKen

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Politesub53


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Germany must be so proud

Anti-Semitism Rises in Europe



It is just a shame you can neither read nor comprehend the article you have linked too.


Sanity only looks at the pic then spins it to fit their agenda.

So... Germany had a protest march which was anti-semitic.
All sorts of protests are allowed in countries that have true free speech.
But, that doesn't mean the country, as a whole or it's government, support it.

But of course, Sanity likes to believe it's like that over here. lol.


Anti Semitic marches aren't legal in Germany. So the police must have turned a blind eye toward it.


I quite agree - someone wasn't on the ball when this protest march happened.
But even in the UK, sometimes a protest march (for a different group and a different reason) gets hi-jacked by another bunch of assholes and it hits the media before it gets broken up.

But the pic that Sanity posted wasn't from Germany although the headlines and Sanity's comment of "Germany must be so proud" seemed to indicate it stemmed from there (my bad for not reading it properly).

The caption under the pic says "Protesters in support of Palestinians in Gaza last weekend displayed a swastika at a Paris rally. The demonstration had been banned by the government and prompted deployment of police."
So, the protest that this particular pic shows was in Paris (France), not Germany; although apparently there have been many protests across Europe along similar lines. Interestingly, none that I know of in the UK.


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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 6:52:45 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline 		And you are a moron because I did not write that the swastika was in Germany

What I wrote is that Germany must be proud

The two sentences have different meanings







< Message edited by Sanity -- 8/3/2014 6:53:16 AM >

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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 9:46:26 AM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

But, as I have demonstrated (and provided links) when Bama made this claim, the fact that daily rocket attacks didn't start happening until Egypt and Israel between them made the total blockade of Gaza.
Israel alone are the ones that are vehemently and doggedly enforcing the blockade on land and sea.
I do not see you providing any creditable links to refute this position.


In one paragraph you admit that both the Egyptians and Israelis are blockading Gaza then pretend that it is only the Israelis. Is this because if they are being treated as the prime threat to stability by Arabs your view of the situation falls apart like a house of cards?

Because, dumbass, only Israel swallows about 90% of the border of Gaza.
Egypt has a tiny little bit (about 6-7 miles) that borders with North Sinai. The rest is with Israel.

I don't pretend it is just Israel - that's your spin on my words.
If you read what I actually typed: "Israel alone are the ones that are vehemently and doggedly enforcing the blockade on land and sea".
Egypt have opened the border several times but only Israel blocks just about everything going through, including people.
This one act alone, that Israel will not budge on despite promises, has brought the Palestinian economy down.



Egypt relaxed the blockade while the brotherhood was in charge, but then they too believe in genocide.

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Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 10:49:45 AM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967


quote:

ORIGINAL: Zonie63


quote:

ORIGINAL: subrob1967

Oil, the region supplies a shitload of oil to the world Zonie.


I see. So, the Israelis and Palestinians are fighting over oil?


No, they're fighting over their religious beliefs, the rest of the world cares because of the potential disruption of oil out of the region. You DID ask why the rest of the world gives a fuck, right?


I think that's true in part.

As with any conflict in any part of the world there are competing and sometimes conflicting interests in a situation.

Some people do actually think they are in a position to save the world, and as such they see themselves as missionaries; what's really happened is that their minds have led them astray and they've forgotten that they're human beings with the same limitations, weaknesses and self-interest as anyone else.

Nevertheless, there are people in countries such as Britain and the United States who genuinely believe this is their cause, without any hint of an economic or foreign policy argument.

I'm not sure they're fighting over their religious beliefs anymore than the catholics and protestants in Northern Ireland were fighting over their religious beliefs. For a long time Northern Ireland was about two gangs attempting to impose their will at the expense of the other.


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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 12:23:41 PM   
freedomdwarf1


Posts: 6845
Joined: 10/23/2012
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
And you are a moron because I did not write that the swastika was in Germany

And I didn't say that you did

The article you linked to also started off by saying "BERLIN — Across Europe, the conflict in Gaza is generating a broader backlash against Jews, as threats, hate speech and even violent attacks proliferate in several countries. Most surprising perhaps, a wave of incidents has washed over Germany, where atonement for the Holocaust and other Nazi crimes is a bedrock of the modern society"

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
What I wrote is that Germany must be proud

Yeah - immediately followed by a link you entitled "Anti-Semitism Rises in Europe" with a link to a report that started with a reference to Germany.

You were clearly called out on something that you obviously intended to link together: Germany+Swastikas and anti-semitism in Europe.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity
The two sentences have different meanings

But it wasn't clear from your two-line post that they were distinctly separate.

And your reading comprehension missed the main point where I stated "...and Sanity's comment of "Germany must be so proud" seemed to indicate it stemmed from there"


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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 12:43:12 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline 		And your reading comprehension missed the main point where I stated "...and Sanity's comment of "Germany must be so proud" seemed to indicate it stemmed from there"

So of course you chose the meaning that meant he was wrong.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 1:09:41 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
The meaning was, Germany must be proud that Naziism / antisemitism is bubbling up throughout Europe

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Profile   Post #: 597
RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 1:11:22 PM   
freedomdwarf1


Posts: 6845
Joined: 10/23/2012
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


The meaning was, Germany must be proud that Naziism / antisemitism is bubbling up throughout Europe

If you actually took the trouble to read what you linked to - that is precisely the opposite PoV!!

ETA: From your link -
Most surprising perhaps, a wave of incidents has washed over Germany, where atonement for the Holocaust and other Nazi crimes is a bedrock of the modern society. A commitment to the right of Israel to exist is ironclad. Plaques and memorials across the country exhort, “Never Again.” Children are taught starting in elementary school that their country’s Nazi history must never be repeated

< Message edited by freedomdwarf1 -- 8/3/2014 1:17:54 PM >

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“If liberty means anything at all, it means the right to tell people what they do not want to hear.”
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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 2:05:46 PM   
BitYakin


Posts: 882
Joined: 10/15/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


The meaning was, Germany must be proud that Naziism / antisemitism is bubbling up throughout Europe

If you actually took the trouble to read what you linked to - that is precisely the opposite PoV!!

ETA: From your link -
Most surprising perhaps, a wave of incidents has washed over Germany, where atonement for the Holocaust and other Nazi crimes is a bedrock of the modern society. A commitment to the right of Israel to exist is ironclad. Plaques and memorials across the country exhort, “Never Again.” Children are taught starting in elementary school that their country’s Nazi history must never be repeated


comprehension skills have been questioned here, I guess YOU didn't COMPREHEND the SARCASM in the statement!

meaning Germany is most likely VERY EMBARESSED by it!

YOU SAID, "Sanity only looks at the pic then spins it to fit their agenda."

you on the other hand read a CLEARLY sarcastic remark and pretend its meant in its LITERAL sense. POT MEET KETTLE

we are supposed to believe you understand COMPLEXE issues, and you don't get SIMPLE SARCARSM????

OOOOOOOOOOK

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RE: The current middle eastern crisis is Israels fault... - 8/3/2014 3:22:26 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline 		He has admitted that he doesn't get sarcasm at all, I forgot that when I replied

My bad, in a way

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Inside Every Liberal Is A Totalitarian Screaming To Get Out

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Profile   Post #: 600
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