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RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/27/2014 7:17:29 PM   
Sanity


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From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

I never said one word about reverse racism. I merely pointed out a clearly racist comment.
If Brown didn't attack Wilson were did the injuries come from.
You are so bigoted (white guilt) that you actually believe that if someone pushed into a home and attacks the homeowner the only explanation for shooting him is that he was black. The whole world is to the sane side of that.


There is no such thing as "reverse racism."

Someone or something, policy etc, is either racist or it isn't. People who use that term are only making excuses for their own atrocious attitudes and behavior.

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Profile   Post #: 1221
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/27/2014 7:22:00 PM   
BamaD


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Joined: 2/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD

I never said one word about reverse racism. I merely pointed out a clearly racist comment.
If Brown didn't attack Wilson were did the injuries come from.
You are so bigoted (white guilt) that you actually believe that if someone pushed into a home and attacks the homeowner the only explanation for shooting him is that he was black. The whole world is to the sane side of that.


There is no such thing as "reverse racism."

Someone or something, policy etc, is either racist or it isn't. People who use that term are only making excuses for their own atrocious attitudes and behavior.

I would have pointed that out but he can't wrap his head around the idea that the prime source in his story would be in the Klan if she was white.
The concept of blacks being racist is beyond his comprehension.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

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Profile   Post #: 1222
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/27/2014 7:28:28 PM   
AQRMZ


Posts: 147
Joined: 10/12/2013
Status: offline 		Just read this on AOL can't get the url.

By RYAN GORMAN

An explosive new lawsuit filed in St. Louis seeking the release of Michael Brown's juvenile criminal record alleges the slain teen was a gang member and faced a second degree murder charge.

The citizen journalism website GotNews took St. Louis County authorities to court Wednesday to secure the release of the records because it believes they do not need to be kept private since he is no longer alive.

The unarmed Brown was fatally shot earlier this month by white Ferguson police officer Darren Wilson. He has no criminal record as an adult, but only because he had recently turned 18, claims GotNews Editor-in-chief Charles Johnson.

The citizen journo wrote in a Wednesday afternoon post to his site and on Twitter that he was told by law enforcement sources the black teen has a juvenile arrest record that is being kept private.
Johnson also claims cops told him that Brown's juvenile arrest record contains a second-degree murder charge and that he is a member of the notorious Crips street gang.

"To find out if those police officers are correct requires seeing Brown's juvenile arrest record, which ought to be freely available given that he is dead and therefore has no right to privacy remaining," insists Johnson.

"Knowing the truth about Brown's past will help us gauge the credibility of his parents and family who have called him a 'gentle giant.'"

Johnson cites the previous instance of William L. Halstead, a white 18-year-old who stole a packet of cigarettes.
Halstead was beaten by a security guard until his neck was broken and he was paralyzed, Johnson recalls. The teen died 19 days later.

"Halstead's juvenile arrest record was released as part of a wrongful death suit filed by his family, much to their protestation."

AOL News was not immediately able to reach St. Louis County authorities for comment on the lawsuit or its claims.

---------------------------------------------------------
Should be an interesting few days coming up.

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Profile   Post #: 1223
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/27/2014 7:33:44 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AQRMZ

Just read this on AOL can't get the url.

By RYAN GORMAN

An explosive new lawsuit filed in St. Louis seeking the release of Michael Brown's juvenile criminal record alleges the slain teen was a gang member and faced a second degree murder charge.

The citizen journalism website GotNews took St. Louis County authorities to court Wednesday to secure the release of the records because it believes they do not need to be kept private since he is no longer alive.

The unarmed Brown was fatally shot earlier this month by white Ferguson police officer Darren Wilson. He has no criminal record as an adult, but only because he had recently turned 18, claims GotNews Editor-in-chief Charles Johnson.

The citizen journo wrote in a Wednesday afternoon post to his site and on Twitter that he was told by law enforcement sources the black teen has a juvenile arrest record that is being kept private.
Johnson also claims cops told him that Brown's juvenile arrest record contains a second-degree murder charge and that he is a member of the notorious Crips street gang.

"To find out if those police officers are correct requires seeing Brown's juvenile arrest record, which ought to be freely available given that he is dead and therefore has no right to privacy remaining," insists Johnson.

"Knowing the truth about Brown's past will help us gauge the credibility of his parents and family who have called him a 'gentle giant.'"

Johnson cites the previous instance of William L. Halstead, a white 18-year-old who stole a packet of cigarettes.
Halstead was beaten by a security guard until his neck was broken and he was paralyzed, Johnson recalls. The teen died 19 days later.

"Halstead's juvenile arrest record was released as part of a wrongful death suit filed by his family, much to their protestation."

AOL News was not immediately able to reach St. Louis County authorities for comment on the lawsuit or its claims.

------------------------------------------------------
Should be an interesting few days coming up.


While this is alleged, not proven, publishing this story is as fair as the hit piece Cloud is so proud of.
Any bets on him calling this, if accurate, as decisive as his guilt by association piece?

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

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Profile   Post #: 1224
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/27/2014 7:42:11 PM   
Gauge


Posts: 5689
Joined: 6/17/2005
Status: offline 		Here is the URL:

http://www.aol.com/article/2014/08/27/lawsuit-to-release-michael-browns-juvenile-criminal-record/20953546/

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"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.

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Profile   Post #: 1225
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/28/2014 2:30:48 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		Some... none... or all may be true...but...What happened between Brown and the police officer is a separate incident that can and should stand against established law. The police officer evidently was not aware of Brown's record and even if he were that knowledge should have no effect on the officers actions.

It will, and should, all come down in the end to whether the officer feared for his life and defended himself from immediate harm... or after there was no immediate need to defend his life he took one.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 8/28/2014 2:31:53 PM >

_____________________________

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I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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Profile   Post #: 1226
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/28/2014 2:50:31 PM   
BitYakin


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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Some... none... or all may be true...but...What happened between Brown and the police officer is a separate incident that can and should stand against established law. The police officer evidently was not aware of Brown's record and even if he were that knowledge should have no effect on the officers actions.

It will, and should, all come down in the end to whether the officer feared for his life and defended himself from immediate harm... or after there was no immediate need to defend his life he took one.

Butch


while I agree the officer being unaware of previous actions has ZERO bearing on what he did at that moment in time, it does go to show a pattern of the deceased as being violent and prone to having done what the officer describes him as having done...

also this from a law site, California not Missouri, but I bet its similar in most states



http://www.attorneydickinson.com/2014/07/justifiable-homicide-by-police-officer.html



A police officer is not guilty of murder or manslaughter if he killed someone while acting as a police officer.

Such killing is justified, and therefore not unlawful, where he was a public officer, the killing was committed while performing a legal duty, the killing was necessary to accomplish that duty, and the officer had probable cause to believe the decedent posed a threat of death or great bodily injury to himself or another person, or that the decedent had committed a forcible and atrocious crime and that crime threatened the officer or others with death or great bodily injury.

Source:

Judicial Council of California Criminal Jury Instructions



the KEY BIT is bolded


IF brown did what the officer says he did (attacked him) it does fall under the last part

since so far no eyewitness other than MR I LIED to cops BEFORE has been able to see things from the very beginning, BEFORE brown as THREW the window and cannot say whether brown was PULLED in or REACHED IN, the only CREDIBLE witness is the police officer



and yes folks it REALLY IS just that SIMPLE!

< Message edited by BitYakin -- 8/28/2014 2:52:46 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 1227
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/28/2014 2:58:06 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

Some... none... or all may be true...but...What happened between Brown and the police officer is a separate incident that can and should stand against established law. The police officer evidently was not aware of Brown's record and even if he were that knowledge should have no effect on the officers actions.

It will, and should, all come down in the end to whether the officer feared for his life and defended himself from immediate harm... or after there was no immediate need to defend his life he took one.

Butch

This should have no bearing on the verdict just like Cloudboy's shouldn't.
And I do remember that you dissed that as well.


_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

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Profile   Post #: 1228
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/28/2014 5:42:20 PM   
PeonForHer


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quote:

the KEY BIT is bolded


Could you write the whole post again, BY, but this time putting the bolded bits in capitals? I can't treat anything as important unless it's written in capitals, I'm afraid. You just come across as a mumbling communist when you write in lower case, I have to say.

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Profile   Post #: 1229
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/28/2014 6:07:11 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline 		THIS is worth a read... it gives some insight into the likely outcome of this case.... And a few ideas about how small Police Departments can be made more accountable and forced to train for accreditation. Something like how school districts are graded.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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Profile   Post #: 1230
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/28/2014 6:33:27 PM   
cloudboy


Posts: 7306
Joined: 12/14/2005
Status: offline 		Yes, the more I read up on it, the more unlikely it seems Wilson can be convicted of anything. The outcomes I'm hoping for are a restructuring of the Furgeson police department and a move away from issuing citations to raise municipal revenue. I also want to to hear and see what Wilson's side of the story is, because that's being guarded like some kind of state secret.

The Supreme Court has made if very difficult to convict the police of anything:

In recent years, the court has made it very difficult, and often impossible, to hold police officers and the governments that employ them accountable for civil rights violations.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/08/27/opinion/how-the-supreme-court-protects-bad-cops.html?_r=0

< Message edited by cloudboy -- 8/28/2014 6:36:10 PM >

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Profile   Post #: 1231
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/28/2014 6:57:32 PM   
kdsub


Posts: 12180
Joined: 8/16/2007
Status: offline
quote:

I also want to to hear and see what Wilson's side of the story is


Now you are talking... and it had better come out and they had better sell it hard... or the rioting won't just be in Ferguson if he is not charged.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 8/28/2014 7:00:42 PM >

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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Profile   Post #: 1232
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/29/2014 1:28:08 PM   
BitYakin


Posts: 882
Joined: 10/15/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: PeonForHer

quote:

the KEY BIT is bolded


Could you write the whole post again, BY, but this time putting the bolded bits in capitals? I can't treat anything as important unless it's written in capitals, I'm afraid. You just come across as a mumbling communist when you write in lower case, I have to say.


WHAT A SURPIZE, nothing to say so attack the way its written...

WOWWWWW you WIN!

HAHAHAHAHAHAH

_____________________________

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Profile   Post #: 1233
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/30/2014 12:10:34 AM   
DaddySatyr


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Joined: 8/29/2011
From: Pittston, Pennsyltucky
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I saw a youtube video that was a news report where a young lady claims to be an eyewitness.

For what it's worth; she seems like she's being honest to me.

Anyway, her version is that Brown did lean into the window and assault Wilson.

However, she said that Wilson was firing at Brown as he was running away. If that is what happened: Game over as far as this guy being a cop.

I am unaware of any agency that allows shots to be fired at an unarmed person (even if they are a criminal) when they're running away.

If that tidbit turns out to be true, Brown may have felt that the only way to stop the gun fire aimed at him was to turn and remove the gun from the cop's hands. Self defense.







Screen captures still RULE! Ya feel me?

< Message edited by DaddySatyr -- 8/30/2014 12:11:23 AM >

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Screen captures (and pissing on shadows) still RULE! Ya feel me?

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Profile   Post #: 1234
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/30/2014 12:36:46 AM   
Gauge


Posts: 5689
Joined: 6/17/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr


I saw a youtube video that was a news report where a young lady claims to be an eyewitness.

For what it's worth; she seems like she's being honest to me.

Anyway, her version is that Brown did lean into the window and assault Wilson.

However, she said that Wilson was firing at Brown as he was running away. If that is what happened: Game over as far as this guy being a cop.

I am unaware of any agency that allows shots to be fired at an unarmed person (even if they are a criminal) when they're running away.

If that tidbit turns out to be true, Brown may have felt that the only way to stop the gun fire aimed at him was to turn and remove the gun from the cop's hands. Self defense.




Her story cannot be correct, the autopsy revealed that he was shot from the front, not from behind.

_____________________________

"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.

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Profile   Post #: 1235
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/30/2014 4:06:23 AM   
thishereboi


Posts: 14463
Joined: 6/19/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: AQRMZ

Just read this on AOL can't get the url.

By RYAN GORMAN

An explosive new lawsuit filed in St. Louis seeking the release of Michael Brown's juvenile criminal record alleges the slain teen was a gang member and faced a second degree murder charge.

The citizen journalism website GotNews took St. Louis County authorities to court Wednesday to secure the release of the records because it believes they do not need to be kept private since he is no longer alive.

The unarmed Brown was fatally shot earlier this month by white Ferguson police officer Darren Wilson. He has no criminal record as an adult, but only because he had recently turned 18, claims GotNews Editor-in-chief Charles Johnson.

The citizen journo wrote in a Wednesday afternoon post to his site and on Twitter that he was told by law enforcement sources the black teen has a juvenile arrest record that is being kept private.
Johnson also claims cops told him that Brown's juvenile arrest record contains a second-degree murder charge and that he is a member of the notorious Crips street gang.

"To find out if those police officers are correct requires seeing Brown's juvenile arrest record, which ought to be freely available given that he is dead and therefore has no right to privacy remaining," insists Johnson.

"Knowing the truth about Brown's past will help us gauge the credibility of his parents and family who have called him a 'gentle giant.'"

Johnson cites the previous instance of William L. Halstead, a white 18-year-old who stole a packet of cigarettes.
Halstead was beaten by a security guard until his neck was broken and he was paralyzed, Johnson recalls. The teen died 19 days later.

"Halstead's juvenile arrest record was released as part of a wrongful death suit filed by his family, much to their protestation."

AOL News was not immediately able to reach St. Louis County authorities for comment on the lawsuit or its claims.

---------------------------------------------------------
Should be an interesting few days coming up.




Nice bit of digging there. Such a shame that it doesn't mean jack shit. The cop had no way of knowing Browns history and it has no bearing on his actions that day. And as far as his mom is concerned of course she said he was a good boy. He was her son for fucks sake. What did you think she was going to say.

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RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/30/2014 5:31:50 AM   
igor2003


Posts: 1718
Joined: 1/1/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gauge


quote:

ORIGINAL: DaddySatyr


I saw a youtube video that was a news report where a young lady claims to be an eyewitness.

For what it's worth; she seems like she's being honest to me.

Anyway, her version is that Brown did lean into the window and assault Wilson.

However, she said that Wilson was firing at Brown as he was running away. If that is what happened: Game over as far as this guy being a cop.

I am unaware of any agency that allows shots to be fired at an unarmed person (even if they are a criminal) when they're running away.

If that tidbit turns out to be true, Brown may have felt that the only way to stop the gun fire aimed at him was to turn and remove the gun from the cop's hands. Self defense.





Her story cannot be correct, the autopsy revealed that he was shot from the front, not from behind.


I read it differently than you. I haven't seen the video DS mentions since no link was provided, but according to what he said Brown was being shot "at" while running away. Not that he was hit while running away. After hearing a bullet whiz by he may have stopped and turned. What happened then is what would be in question. Did he put his hands up to surrender, or did he charge Wilson?

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Profile   Post #: 1237
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/30/2014 9:38:50 AM   
DaddySatyr


Posts: 9381
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From: Pittston, Pennsyltucky
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quote:

ORIGINAL: igor2003

I read it differently than you. I haven't seen the video DS mentions since no link was provided, but according to what he said Brown was being shot "at" while running away. Not that he was hit while running away. After hearing a bullet whiz by he may have stopped and turned. What happened then is what would be in question. Did he put his hands up to surrender, or did he charge Wilson?



I swear I've been trying to re-find the video. A friend of mine brought it up on his I-Phone. Perhaps, Butch, who lives in the area could help with local station call letters? That would help with the search.

Igor got it right, though. Although the young lady says she thought that Brown got hit, she was not adamant.

To me, that's not really relevant.

If Wilson was shooting at an un-armed person as they were running away, he's OUT OF POLICY. Period.

Even if we accept that Brown wasn't hit in the back (and I do, since both autopsies said so), let me ask this: Would someone, firing a .40 at you put you in fear for your life?

While turning and running toward your assailant would be a poor tactical move, it's not criminal.

I am beginning to believe that this officer forgot his training/freaked out/whatever and committed an offense that should - at the very least - end his LE career.

quote:

ORIGINAL: igor2003

... What happened then is what would be in question. Did he put his hands up to surrender, or did he charge Wilson?



It doesn't matter one bit. If Wilson was firing at an un-armed person who was running away , he was no longer behaving the way a police officer is supposed to behave. At that moment, if Brown was in fear for his life, his actions (whether advisable or not) become self-defense.

Remember: no one has disputed that Brown was un-armed.

Now, if it turns out he was armed (doubtful), that changes things.







Screen captures still RULE! Ya feel me?

< Message edited by DaddySatyr -- 8/30/2014 10:11:29 AM >

_____________________________

A Stone in My Shoe

Screen captures (and pissing on shadows) still RULE! Ya feel me?

"For that which I love, I will do horrible things"

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Profile   Post #: 1238
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/30/2014 10:10:51 AM   
Gauge


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Joined: 6/17/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: igor2003

I read it differently than you.



I was bleary eyed and ready for bed. He did not say that he was shot while running away, but shot at. My mistake.

_____________________________

"For there is no folly of the beast of the earth which is not infinitely outdone by the madness of men." Herman Melville - Moby Dick

I'm wearing my chicken suit and humming La Marseillaise.

(in reply to igor2003)
Profile   Post #: 1239
RE: Rioting is the answer - 8/30/2014 10:40:32 AM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: thishereboi

Nice bit of digging there. Such a shame that it doesn't mean jack shit. The cop had no way of knowing Browns history and it has no bearing on his actions that day. And as far as his mom is concerned of course she said he was a good boy. He was her son for fucks sake. What did you think she was going to say.


Mothers are incapable of honesty then?

I never knew.

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Profile   Post #: 1240
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