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RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 12:14:25 PM

GoddessManko

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I worked as a single parent... I knew where my kids were and what they were doing... and on the few occasions where they lied they paid the price. There is no substitute for good parenting. There are many working parents... in poverty... that make it a point of knowing where their kids are and what they are doing.. Those that don't need to face a penalty and I applaud the St. Louis government for doing it. It turns out at least one of the parents could not even be found.

It is not the schools place to raise our kids or be babysitters. They seem to find plenty of time to work and protest... maybe they could use that time to look after their children as well.

Butch

That's great...for you. My dad also was a single parent and my siblings and I needn't be micromanaged when we were younger. But then he also was Valedictorian of the top school in the country and was an executive. We also never dealt with violence or vcrime at all so I don't count my individual experience to attest to everyone else's. I try not to be so close minded. Does that make sense?

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Post #: 81

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 12:20:34 PM

Aylee

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I worked as a single parent... I knew where my kids were and what they were doing... and on the few occasions where they lied they paid the price. There is no substitute for good parenting. There are many working parents... in poverty... that make it a point of knowing where their kids are and what they are doing.. Those that don't need to face a penalty and I applaud the St. Louis government for doing it. It turns out at least one of the parents could not even be found.

It is not the schools place to raise our kids or be babysitters. They seem to find plenty of time to work and protest... maybe they could use that time to look after their children as well.

Butch

But that might take away their fun or whatever. That would seriously cramp their style.

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Post #: 82

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 12:41:08 PM

kdsub

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I do not believe that I am being close minded... what I am doing is NOT making excuses for bad parenting as you are. Why do people think only blacks have economic problems in St. Louis? There are white poor as well and their children are not driving around town shooting from car windows and beating up people on the street... Why is that? It is because they do pay attention to where their children are and what they are doing. It may have happened but I have never heard of a drive by shooting by whites in St Louis ever.

This new strategy of citing negligent parents is for all children...and parents of all colors not just blacks... so I don't see how it could be called racists... but it will.

Butch

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Post #: 83

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 12:52:12 PM

Exidor

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I live in a state that has entire counties that are close to 100% black. They're rural, and sit at the bottom of the crime statistics.

As in most places, the per-capita violent crime rate here follows population density. I don't know whether the crazies like cities, or cities make people crazy.

Back when the USA still had major cities that didn't have black urban cores, their per-capita crime statistics weren't much different from the ones that had already gone black.

My belief is that if the racial makeup of high crime areas were to shift to Asian or Latino, the crime rates would remain about the same, because high-density urban areas are bad places to live.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)

Post #: 84

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 1:04:01 PM

kdsub

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St. Louis is populated fairly evenly throughout the city area at least north and south...housing is generally of the same type and construction. I could search for and list various maps showing population and crime statistics... you can find them easily.

What they will show is high crime in areas dominated by African Americans as compared to the same population density of predominantly non- black areas. Does that jive with your theory? As others have said economics play a big part in crime...but there are many poor white areas of the city as well and they are not high crime areas.

Personally I think it is racists to say any race of people is more or less prone to violence and crime... I believe it is always circumstance and attitude of people in a particular area... Right now in the Ferguson area and St. Louis there is a attitude to go along with social issues that is fueling this violence. And to solve this the people of the area must change this attitude of disrespect for each other and the law just as social issues outside their control need to be addressed.

In my area at least I have never heard of more people demanding respect yet giving none than African American protesters in Ferguson.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 12/9/2014 1:29:36 PM >

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

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Post #: 85

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 4:51:33 PM

GotSteel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DesideriScuri
Integration of neighborhoods? How are you going to effect that? Are you going to dictate where people live now? If so, are you going to subsidize the cost of housing for those who can't afford their new neighborhood they just got moved to? How is it that a person can't decide where he/she wants to live?

It's already happening, it's called black flight. They way we've effected it is by not being so openly racist that black people are afraid to live in white suburbs.

(in reply to DesideriScuri)

Post #: 86

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 5:01:26 PM

kdsub

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I am making no claims but it seems to me there is nothing wrong with wanting to live among people that you have a lot in common with. I want to live close to my children and they reasonably close to me. I know this is not everyone but for many it is true. I also would like to live where others enjoy my music, dance, traditions, language and accent etc.

Otherwise I think you will find African American areas not because they are forced there... but want to live there... same with the Bosnians of St. Louis... same with many ethnic classes... It is not racists to want to do this is it?

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to GotSteel)

Post #: 87

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 5:38:53 PM

GoddessManko

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I do not believe that I am being close minded... what I am doing is NOT making excuses for bad parenting as you are. Why do people think only blacks have economic problems in St. Louis? There are white poor as well and their children are not driving around town shooting from car windows and beating up people on the street... Why is that? It is because they do pay attention to where their children are and what they are doing. It may have happened but I have never heard of a drive by shooting by whites in St Louis ever.

This new strategy of citing negligent parents is for all children...and parents of all colors not just blacks... so I don't see how it could be called racists... but it will.

Butch

Are you very seriously telling me white people do not commit shootings or beat people up in St Louis while saying you are not close minded? I just want to be clear about this, thank you.

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Happy consent is the name of the game. You are my perfect Mistress. - my collared.

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The Bird of Hermes is my name, eating my wings to make me tame.

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Post #: 88

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 5:40:29 PM

GoddessManko

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I can actually do a CIA factcheck on those stats kdsub. I love numbers.

I do that before making definitive statements to be sure I'm accurate.

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Happy consent is the name of the game. You are my perfect Mistress. - my collared.

http://submissivemale.blogspot.com/

The Bird of Hermes is my name, eating my wings to make me tame.

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Post #: 89

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 5:41:40 PM

kdsub

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I state facts ...all crime is comparable...in St. Louis the murder rate is almost exclusively black on black or black on white.. Now this is a fact and not close minded... it is honest... don't believe me do the research... it is not hard to do. This when the population is divided almost 50/50.

It is inescapable not to conclude there is an inordinate amount of violent crime being committed by blacks in proportion to the population.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 12/9/2014 5:46:48 PM >

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to GoddessManko)

Post #: 90

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 6:00:07 PM

GoddessManko

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

I state facts ...all crime is comparable...in St. Louis the murder rate is almost exclusively black on black or black on white.. Now this is a fact and not close minded... it is honest... don't believe me do the research... it is not hard to do. This when the population is divided almost 50/50.

It is inescapable not to conclude there is an inordinate amount of violent crime being committed by blacks in proportion to the population.

Butch

OK, this is easily debunkable because you don't read these very basic things before actually having a position on them. 90% of "white murder" is committed by other whites, 90% of "black murders" are committed by other blacks. Can you show me the link with your stats? I'd appreciate it. If you need mine, I'll gladly assist.

_____________________________

Happy consent is the name of the game. You are my perfect Mistress. - my collared.

http://submissivemale.blogspot.com/

The Bird of Hermes is my name, eating my wings to make me tame.

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 91

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 6:17:52 PM

kdsub

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This is a great link because when you click on a bubble it links to a Post story.

Have fun

Butch

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Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to GoddessManko)

Post #: 92

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 6:26:33 PM

kdsub

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Check here as well

< Message edited by kdsub -- 12/9/2014 6:27:36 PM >

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to GoddessManko)

Post #: 93

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 6:30:50 PM

kdsub

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How about THIS

I could go on and on with the links... but i hope you get the idea.

Butch

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to GoddessManko)

Post #: 94

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 6:40:33 PM

GoddessManko

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From: Dante's Inferno
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quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

How about THIS

I could go on and on with the links... but i hope you get the idea.

Butch

OK, I tried not to laugh too loudly because I have family over for the holidays. That pretty much states exactly what I stated, however, the issue with minorities it seems is the lack of prosecution or "special treatment" of police officers to my knowledge.

_____________________________

Happy consent is the name of the game. You are my perfect Mistress. - my collared.

http://submissivemale.blogspot.com/

The Bird of Hermes is my name, eating my wings to make me tame.

(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 95

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 6:43:39 PM

dcnovice

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Nm.

< Message edited by dcnovice -- 12/9/2014 7:00:55 PM >

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it's never enough to keep up.

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(in reply to kdsub)

Post #: 96

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 6:46:35 PM

dcnovice

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FR

It would be interesting to see "black vs. white" crime stats for folks in the same economic brackets.

I wonder if the data exist.

_____________________________

No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

(in reply to dcnovice)

Post #: 97

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 6:50:14 PM

kdsub

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It says nothing of the kind... it says for those not wanting to read it... that blacks kill blacks compared to police killings at a rate of 50 to 1 in st Louis... of the officers that did shoot blacks... the majority of them were blacks as well... so much for the get black cops stop black cop killings... It also says of the 1,265 murders in St. Louis 90 percent of the victims were black and 90 percent of the murderers were black... what the hell more proof do you need? Blacks make up 49 percent of the population of St Louis and commit 90 percent of the murders... what the hell other proof do you need.

In the whole state of Missouri not just St Louis blacks make up about 11 percent of the population and commit 58 percent of the murders and 55 percent of the robberies.. that in the other link... what the hell other proof do you need.

Butch

< Message edited by kdsub -- 12/9/2014 7:19:59 PM >

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to GoddessManko)

Post #: 98

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 6:50:40 PM

GoddessManko

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From: Dante's Inferno
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quote:

ORIGINAL: dcnovice

FR

It would be interesting to see "black vs. white" crime stats for folks in the same economic brackets.

I wonder if the data exist.

Good point, what are the crime stats in Baldwin Hills I wonder? We already know statistically speaking those lowest on the socioeconomic ladder as well as the education ladder come from red states. Statistically speaking of course, this is not a judgement on Republicans overall/categorically.

_____________________________

Happy consent is the name of the game. You are my perfect Mistress. - my collared.

http://submissivemale.blogspot.com/

The Bird of Hermes is my name, eating my wings to make me tame.

(in reply to dcnovice)

Post #: 99

RE: Is Ferguson happening in a vacuum - 12/9/2014 7:01:22 PM

kdsub

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dc... I could buy robberies I guess ... but being poor is no excuse for murder... Should I post the links again about the Bosnian neighborhood... it is just as poor as any black area in st Louis... They have little crime except from blacks and they are protesting... you just hear little about that.

South St Louis has plenty of poor majority white areas with comparatively low crime... but overall I will admit they are slightly better off economically and I'm not so sure about that. But let me guarantee you many out state counties that are majority white are just as poor if not worse off then blacks in Ferguson...especially Ferguson and St. Louis as well... and they have low murder rates. I just do not think poor is an excuse for murder.

< Message edited by kdsub -- 12/9/2014 7:22:10 PM >

_____________________________

Mark Twain:

I don't see any use in having a uniform and arbitrary way of spelling words. We might as well make all clothes alike and cook all dishes alike. Sameness is tiresome; variety is pleasing

(in reply to dcnovice)

Post #: 100

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