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Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 5:18:26 AM   
rose442


Posts: 60
Joined: 5/26/2004
Status: offline 		How can anyone have trust in a relationship. When honesty is 1 sided. When you have a sub that tells all that she does, everyone she talks to, and everything that is said in her life.
 
But then you have a Dom that hides stuff, tells you it is none of your business what He does, or who He does it with. Who He talks to or what He says to them. Keeps secrets. How is that a trusting relationship? As far as I am concerned there cannot be a trusting relationship in this lifestyle if a Dom doesn't have to be honest with His sub/slave and hide stuff.
My rant is done for the moment.
rose442

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This slave is Masters, heart, mind, soul, and body. To use as Master wishes, when Master wishes to do so.
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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 5:22:22 AM   
darkinshadows


Posts: 4145
Joined: 6/2/2004
From: UK
Status: offline
There is a difference in dishonesty and not needing to be told everything.
Peace and Rapture


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...i surrender to gravity and the unknown...

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 5:23:19 AM   
sharainks


Posts: 499
Joined: 12/13/2004
Status: offline 		Rose,  
A liar is a liar no matter their sexual proclivities.  You can't develop trust with someone who lies to you. Its not a dom thing its a people thing.  What you have to decide now is how much time you want to spend with a liar and without trust.

(in reply to rose442)
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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 5:25:07 AM   
mistoferin


Posts: 8284
Joined: 10/27/2004
Status: offline 		I would suggest that the problem is not with the lifestyle but with the individual.

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~erin~

There are no victims here...only volunteers.

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(in reply to rose442)
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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 5:25:16 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		Dont know about the BDSM World not in it, but trust is vital in a Gorean relationship...

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Master of Bruin Cottage

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Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 6:07:04 AM   
LotusSong


Posts: 6334
Joined: 7/2/2006
From: Domme Emeritus
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rose442

How can anyone have trust in a relationship. When honesty is 1 sided. When you have a sub that tells all that she does, everyone she talks to, and everything that is said in her life.
 
But then you have a Dom that hides stuff, tells you it is none of your business what He does, or who He does it with. Who He talks to or what He says to them. Keeps secrets. How is that a trusting relationship? As far as I am concerned there cannot be a trusting relationship in this lifestyle if a Dom doesn't have to be honest with His sub/slave and hide stuff.
My rant is done for the moment.
rose442

I  assume (please correct me if I am wrong here) that you are the person you speak of?  If so...

What do you expect when you, yourself, tout this as your signature? 

" This slave is Masters, heart, mind, soul, and body. To use as Master wishes, when Master wishes to do so. " 

and when he behves as he does, you seems so surprised?

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I'm not your type.
I'm not inflatable.


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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 6:43:37 AM   
KnightofMists


Posts: 7149
Joined: 7/29/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: darkinshadows

There is a difference in dishonesty and not needing to be told everything.
 
I very much agree.... only thing is many equate it as the same....  And because of the belief in this equation they come out with statements like rose does.  However, as LotusSong has pointed out rose's signature line is seems to be a contradiction.
 
Rose maybe you should change your signature line to:
 
"This slave is masters, heart, mind, sould and body.  to use as Master wishes, when Master wishes to do so as long as I am told everything that he does"


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An Optimal relationship is achieved when the individuals do what is best for themselves and their relationship.

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 6:46:11 AM   
smilezz


Posts: 2156
Joined: 6/18/2004
Status: offline 		Sounds like a break down of communication to start with.  I do agree with erin though, it has nothing to do with the style of life you lead.  It has to do with individual(s).
Sounds like it's re-negotiating time.  If you can't live with the way he does things....there's your answer.

~smilezz~

< Message edited by smilezz -- 7/15/2006 6:47:49 AM >

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 6:46:22 AM   
CrappyDom


Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		Why do you keep choosing liars?

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 6:49:17 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		I honestly don't know but I immagine that a high maintainance sub/slave requires most of her Master's attention and need to know every thought to stop that lil paranoia from spreading?? I'm genuinly curious if some one would care to enlighten me.

< Message edited by IronBear -- 7/15/2006 6:52:54 AM >

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 6:51:46 AM   
JohnWarren


Posts: 3807
Joined: 3/18/2005
From: Delray Beach, FL
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rose442

How can anyone have trust in a relationship. When honesty is 1 sided. When you have a sub that tells all that she does, everyone she talks to, and everything that is said in her life.
 
But then you have a Dom that hides stuff, tells you it is none of your business what He does, or who He does it with. Who He talks to or what He says to them. Keeps secrets. How is that a trusting relationship? As far as I am concerned there cannot be a trusting relationship in this lifestyle if a Dom doesn't have to be honest with His sub/slave and hide stuff.
My rant is done for the moment.
rose442


In short, you have a bad relationship with your dominant, so you try to invalidate everyone else's trust based relationships?

Dump him, move on but don't criticize every else.

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www.lovingdominant.org

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 6:58:42 AM   
gypsyssoul


Posts: 127
Joined: 5/19/2006
From: Balti., Maryland, living in Summerville SC
Status: offline
i agree with what has been said so far  Rose ..
a few good points have been made ...
Lotus Song and Knight of Mist ...
 
i have strugged with my own trust in this ...
but
still believe it has to be here
perhaps the key ... is with the right person ...
you won't need to know ... and you will just
trust him ....
mayhap this rant come out of some certain
emotional event that has caused you to feel this way suddenly?? ...
 
~~bright blessings
:: goes back to her corner to watch more


< Message edited by gypsyssoul -- 7/15/2006 7:00:30 AM >

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~~ blessed be

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 7:06:29 AM   
CrappyDom


Posts: 1883
Joined: 4/11/2006
From: Sacramento
Status: offline 		IB,

Do you believe more Goreans are trustworthy than are those who do BDSM? 

As for high maintenance women, well they are always just that regardless of whether they are kajira, vanilla, slaves, or bottoms in my opinion.  Women that are low maintenance are low maintenance regardless of whether they are kajira, vanilla, slaves, or bottoms in my opinion.

(in reply to IronBear)
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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 7:08:53 AM   
Caretakr


Posts: 1221
Joined: 6/24/2006
Status: offline 		Lies come from defending  the unreal. Or the unworthy.

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 7:09:10 AM   
IronBear


Posts: 9008
Joined: 6/19/2005
From: Beenleigh, Qld, Australia
Status: offline 		No really CD I can only judge by those I know and all those slaves are low maintance. I can't think of a single Gorean Master who has or would keep a high maintainance slave. logically there are some and even possibly quite a few.

_____________________________

Iron Bear

Master of Bruin Cottage

http://www.bruincottage.org

Your attitude, words & actions are yours. Take responsibility for them and the consequences they incur.

D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F.

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 7:14:06 AM   
juliaoceania


Posts: 21383
Joined: 4/19/2006
From: Somewhere Over the Rainbow
Status: offline 		Trust between two people has to be established before one can move into a successful dynamic between two individuals. To me this means at some point there needs to be complete transparency so that even a slave may determine consensually if they want to be a slave to a particular master. I am answering this as though it is a general question to the board, and not a specific case, I do not think that sowing seeds of distrust by hiding things is a very good example of transparency to the slave/sub. There is a difference between omission and hiding... If a master hides things from a slave then it is nothing but human nature but to wonder why. The master already has all the control and power he wishes in this situation, he is even denying the right of the slave to remain consensually in a situation that may indeed be life threatening in the case of some STDs. The master also has the ability to tell a slave to "shut yer piehole" if the master does not like the slave's reaction to information they may acquire.

I have a strong opinion about hiding information from me, even a lowly submissive such as myself has the right to know many things to remain consensually within a dynamic, especially since the information that is being hidden might go against the very fabric of our contract (if i was in such a relationship, which is almost impossible to conceive as this level of Ms is just not for me). Take my view with a grain of salt, because as I said, Im not "slave" material... there ya go!

On Edit: If I am distrustful enough to spy on my Dom in my own personal relationship, I  would expect him to kick my ass to the curb.. by the same token, if he was minimizing windows on his PC when I walked into a room, acting shady, behaving as though he was hiding something, I would dearly wonder if he was lying to me.

< Message edited by juliaoceania -- 7/15/2006 7:17:54 AM >

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 7:14:21 AM   
Caretakr


Posts: 1221
Joined: 6/24/2006
Status: offline 		Degrees of maintanence tend to depend on inherent emotional states, and how well an owner conditions.

Needinness can be overcome, and focus aided, but only once the bottom works past the denial-and really wishes to be of more use. And there are going to be quite a few emotional and dramatic implosions on the path to overcoming it.

It requires a great deal of patience and consistency.

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 7:21:59 AM   
CreativeDominant


Posts: 11032
Joined: 3/11/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rose442

How can anyone have trust in a relationship. When honesty is 1 sided. When you have a sub that tells all that she does, everyone she talks to, and everything that is said in her life.
 
But then you have a Dom that hides stuff, tells you it is none of your business what He does, or who He does it with. Who He talks to or what He says to them. Keeps secrets. How is that a trusting relationship? As far as I am concerned there cannot be a trusting relationship in this lifestyle if a Dom doesn't have to be honest with His sub/slave and hide stuff.
My rant is done for the moment.
rose442

You've had good answers so far. 

As has been noted, there is a difference in someone being dishonest with you and someone feeling that you do not need to be told everything and let's face it rose...your signature line does imply that whatever your Master wishes...whether it is to tell you everything or tell you nothing at all in this example of his mastery over you...is O.K. with you.  Not only O.K. but agreed to and lived by.

So your rant is a bit of a contradiction to that, isn't it?  Perhaps you've discovered that you cannot live with what he is doing, whatever it is.  But then, you should hold off on your tag line, discuss it with him, and if you decide at the end of the discussion that you cannot live that way, then you need to go elsewhere...and as noted, change your signature line.  For it appears as if there are qualifications to your stated ideal of "whatever Master wishes".

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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 7:35:12 AM   
agirl


Posts: 4530
Joined: 6/14/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rose442

How can anyone have trust in a relationship. When honesty is 1 sided. When you have a sub that tells all that she does, everyone she talks to, and everything that is said in her life.
 
But then you have a Dom that hides stuff, tells you it is none of your business what He does, or who He does it with. Who He talks to or what He says to them. Keeps secrets. How is that a trusting relationship? As far as I am concerned there cannot be a trusting relationship in this lifestyle if a Dom doesn't have to be honest with His sub/slave and hide stuff.
My rant is done for the moment.
rose442


 Come on rose,

You're describing dissatisfaction in someone.......it's got nothing to do with bdsm/lifestyle/M/s etc.

agirl




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RE: Trust is a lie in the BDSM world - 7/15/2006 9:08:22 AM   
LadiesBladewing


Posts: 944
Joined: 8/31/2005
Status: offline 		Hon,

The best suggestion I can make for you is to get yourself into a relationship where you won't have to deal with these issues -- where transparency goes in both directions. They -do- exist. Some of the people here are even in those kinds of relationships.

As far as we're concerned, we are -not- totally transparent to our servants, but we do expect our servants to be totally transparent to us. It is a factor of hierarchy. If our servants can't trust us to do what is best for the whole family, including the servants, they don't belong in our household. Our servants may not understand why we're doing something, and we may not be in a position to have the time to explain it all... either they'll be a good fit with us, or they won't, and life will just have to go on.

If you can't trust the dominant that you've entrusted yourself to without complete transparency in both directions, make sure you ask for that up front. Then, if it turns out that there is something hidden or not fully explained to your satisfaction, you'll know it will be time to walk away.

ZWD

< Message edited by LadiesBladewing -- 7/15/2006 9:10:30 AM >

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"Should have", "could have", "would have" and "can't" may be the most dangerous phrases in the English language.
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(in reply to rose442)
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