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RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 1:30:43 PM   
BamaD


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quote:

ORIGINAL: blnymph

The trouble with mass shooters and mental illness is that all/most/many/some/few (I have no figures for that, and those that get shot can no longer be asked) obviously seem to be perfectly convinced that they are the truly mentally normal and sane ones when they walk around shooting ...

Some might remember Anders Brejvik in Norway who believed he was the only sane person in court even when he was locked away ...

And Denmark has as tough of gun laws as our gunaphobes say they would be satisfied.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to blnymph)
Profile   Post #: 21
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 2:09:00 PM   
LadyPact


Posts: 32566
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Do you mind if I trim a bit? I only want to address certain parts.

quote:

ORIGINAL: joether
Sooner or later, there will be so great a moment of death and destruction by one or more individuals with firearms, that the nation will get behind better and tougher laws.

Honestly, I see that working about as well as prohibition. You're going to have a lot of unsavory people making a heck of a lot of money because as soon as the market is created, somebody is going to cash in on it. How do you think all of the cocaine got here?


quote:

Given that most people, still reeling from the sight and sensation of the destruction will be opting for 'ban 'em all'.

I don't see this happening. If it didn't happen post Sandy Hook, I sincerely doubt it's going to. Gun control people jumped on that even before the families got a chance for the victims to be put in the ground. (Something I find distasteful, and I didn't exactly refrain either, so I'm just as bad as anybody else.) I don't have a clue what tragedy people would consider "big enough".


quote:

But blaming all the shootings in American on someone whom is mentally and/or emotionally compromised is a weak argument. There have been many instances of people with guns having 'anger management issues' towards their loved ones. Brian Short, recently killed his daughters and wife before turning the gun on himself. Yes, someone could say he might have been suffering from some sort of mental/emotional illness. The problem is diagnosing such a thing.

Yes and no. Anger management stuff tends to be the area where somebody targets a specific person. People do the suddenly snap thing when it's directed towards somebody who is linked to their life or they have the obsession that the other person is linked to them.

Obsession with categories of people work a little differently. It's kind of a different slant. While the obsession/resentment thing is similar, it's diagnosed differently.


quote:

Diagnosing such a thing takes...A LONG TIME....

Yes, and this is part of the problem. Unless somebody walks in under their own power *OR* has committed a crime that results in physical harm, there is one hell of a challenge. We kind of screwed this up for our own selves because a) it used to be entirely too easy to have someone committed and b) our institutions were cesspools. Funding? You might as well hang that up. Not only have we reduced the number of beds, we also don't seem to want to pay for them.


quote:

Likewise, there is no such thing as 'mental screening' to determine if someone is suffering a mental/emotional problem, or a physical one that can mask itself as a mental/emotional issue.

There is, but most people don't know how to work the system. Don't walk in there saying you are the reincarnation of Dahmer or anything. Instead, tell them that if they release you that you will commit suicide in the parking lot with the first sharp object you find. You've got a better shot.

quote:

There are many ways we as a nation could reduce firearm violence that are reasonable measures and not a violation of the 2nd amendment. The gun nuts will say and do.....ANYTHING....to stop it. Its upt to the nation's citizens to decide how much they enjoy funerals....

Oddly enough, I consider myself to be a rather law abiding citizen. I am not a gun nut. I am a second amendment supporter. I absolutely do believe that folks should be able to protect themselves. If I ever have to defend myself, I'm not going to care if the other person is crazy or not.



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(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 2:15:27 PM   
BamaD


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Oddly enough, I consider myself to be a rather law abiding citizen. I am not a gun nut. I am a second amendment supporter. I absolutely do believe that folks should be able to protect themselves. If I ever have to defend myself, I'm not going to care if the other person is crazy or not.

I also consider myself to be a law abiding citizen (fd's lies to the not withstanding) and I would figure they are either too stupid or to crazy to go on living. Both problems are soleved the same way.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to LadyPact)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 3:04:04 PM   
blnymph


Posts: 1600
Joined: 11/13/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: blnymph

The trouble with mass shooters and mental illness is that all/most/many/some/few (I have no figures for that, and those that get shot can no longer be asked) obviously seem to be perfectly convinced that they are the truly mentally normal and sane ones when they walk around shooting ...

Some might remember Anders Brejvik in Norway who believed he was the only sane person in court even when he was locked away ...

And Denmark has as tough of gun laws as our gunaphobes say they would be satisfied.



"Denmark" and "Norway" are two different words with different meanings:

can be found here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denmark

and here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norway


(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 3:17:55 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: blnymph


quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: blnymph

The trouble with mass shooters and mental illness is that all/most/many/some/few (I have no figures for that, and those that get shot can no longer be asked) obviously seem to be perfectly convinced that they are the truly mentally normal and sane ones when they walk around shooting ...

Some might remember Anders Brejvik in Norway who believed he was the only sane person in court even when he was locked away ...

And Denmark has as tough of gun laws as our gunaphobes say they would be satisfied.



"Denmark" and "Norway" are two different words with different meanings:

can be found here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denmark

and here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norway



Yes I know they are substantially different countries, I was in a hurry and put in the wrong country. Norway's laws would make our gunaphobes happy, and it didn't do a thing to stop the worst mass shooting of the decade.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to blnymph)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 3:46:55 PM   
blnymph


Posts: 1600
Joined: 11/13/2010
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Now I can tell you a secret:

A summary of the gun laws in Norway you can read here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Norway

those of other countries also here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overview_of_gun_laws_by_nation

you might be surprised about gun regulations in Norway being different from Denmark (Norway being, unlike Denmark, not a member state of the EU)



(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 3:54:45 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: blnymph

Now I can tell you a secret:

A summary of the gun laws in Norway you can read here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_Norway

those of other countries also here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overview_of_gun_laws_by_nation

you might be surprised about gun regulations in Norway being different from Denmark (Norway being, unlike Denmark, not a member state of the EU)




I will let you in on a secret, I am not an idiot. It never occured to me that Denmark had the same laws as Norway. I was not comparing them to Denmark, they are more restrictive than those in the U S. It would really help the conversation if you could abandon the arrogance of youth, when I was your age I thought I knew everything too.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to blnymph)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 4:23:41 PM   
blnymph


Posts: 1600
Joined: 11/13/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
It would really help the conversation if you could abandon the arrogance of youth, when I was your age I thought I knew everything too.


Simply exchanging "Norway" for "Denmark" will not get your post closer to facts.

At my age I know that when I do not know everything (who does? - I don't) I should get proper information before posting - even if pages like wikipedia usually offer just an overview, no sometimes relevant details.


(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 5:54:42 PM   
joether


Posts: 5195
Joined: 7/24/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tkman117

Lol, is that what you think he's doing? He's saying there will one day be an incident so horrible that it finally wakes you morons up from your blind adoration of killing machines and finally change things around. The death of school children clearly wasn't enough, so what will?

He constantly gloats about how some day there will be an incident that will give him a political advantage. Remember the laws Obama wanted to "fix" things after Sandy Hook would have, by his own admission, done nothing to stop such things. Mental health problems and over medication have more to do with this than guns. When I was 16 I could order a gun by mail. Kids at high school had hunting rifles in their pickups. There were no school shootings. Crime was lower then the left decided, based on the UT shooting and the Richard Speck massacare (where he used a knife) that gun control was the way to go. It doesn't work. Joe comes up with all kinds of wacko excuses to take away guns all with holes you can push a mack truck through, and most refuted outright by the writters of the 2nd amendment. He says his wisdom is greater than theirs and that we sould let the government do our thinking for us. Do you really think a person like that really cares about a couple of dead kids? No he is just in love with government control.


I dont gloat. It saddens me that this nation has to suffer something....TRULY....ugly. Something that makes 9/11 look pale by comparison. I have no idea what that could be. I really do not want to find out what that is. But it will happen for two reasons:

1. Time and Events
2. Human Psychology

To get 'into the history books' the would-be shooter in the future must not just kill more people, but do it in a flasher way. Or get individuals of similar viewpoints and ideas to help in the destruction. When its all over, we'll find they got their firearm arsenal the easy way; they went to local gun shops and purchased it. Or drove to a gun show, portrayed themselves as conservative NRA-flukies. The people selling will not know their guns helped in the massacre until the FBI catches up with them. I do not imagine such individual take that sort of news lightly.

BTW, BamaD, we are not living in 1950's America. Its 2015. Things have changed in so many ways. Apparently our gun laws are out of date. We know this by all the violence in our nation. More Americans have been killed by firearms in domestic confrentations than terroist (domestic and foreign).

I've been saying for a long time now; lets do some semi-live action studies and see what works and what doesn't with all these 'gun nut' myths. You and others are afraid in having your values and beliefs tested with science. You would rather put Americans at risk than admit your beliefs are fucked-n-the-head-stupid. I've suggested we do a number of things to keep firearms out of criminals hands. Someone wants to buy a gun, there is a process:

A ) Two week waiting period from purchase to delivery.
B ) Mandatory background check
C ) They purchase insurance on the gun (just like a car)
D ) The must take a firearms training class on their firearm and how proficiency
E ) The firearm(s) are locked up

If a firearm turns up at a crime scene and your the last one to make a purchase on it, you should face the same penalty. That way all those guns that 'mysterious' disappear into the criminal world are shut down.

Or....we could just ban firearms. Your choice. They are both ugly to you. Well to bad, your 'political side' seems to ally itself with people that would be against my ideas and others: criminals, terrorists, thugs, villians, etc. That's whom your fighting to protect; the ones spreading violence, fear, and destruction onto Americans.

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
Do you really think a person like that really cares about a couple of dead kids?


I've buried some of those kids, asshole! I've watched the parents suffer. I've watches their brothers and sisters....suffer.
They have asked me "why?", to which I can not give them a good enough answer. How many times have you been a man and comforted those whom have suffered violence from firearms?

But it will not be liberals whom shut down the 2nd amendment. Over the week, one of the very important people in Australia's government suggested a non-essential travel ban to the USA (i.e. only diplomatic folks travel to the USA from Australia). Imagine when other nations sign on with such a boycott. Quite a few industries will feel the pinch directly and many others will feel it indirectly. Corporations, BamaD, want profit. If they see firearms in the hands of lunatics like you as the reason for their lost in profits; they'll start supports those that want firearms restricted or ban. And they'll form the political speeches that convince most of the moderates in the nation to side with liberals. Should our national economy...SUFFER....for your beliefs too?

quote:

ORIGINAL: BamaD
No he is just in love with government control.


Why yes, I *DO* love the US Constitution. You often conveniently forget that the people in the US Government *ARE* US Citizens. That there are a fair number of liberals in the US Military just as there are conservatives and moderates. This nation was founded on many good things. But it was also founded on freedom from tyranny big and small. Without government control, the US Constitution is just a 220+ year old piece of paper. That you can't understand that concept is your problem!

(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 6:45:03 PM   
Aylee


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The twit really, really wants more black people in jail/prison.

I should not be surprised. He is a liberal/democrat and that is a goal they work towards and succeed at well.

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I don’t always wgah’nagl fhtagn. But when I do, I ph’nglui mglw’nafh R’lyeh.

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RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 6:52:31 PM   
dcnovice


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quote:

He is a liberal/democrat and that is a goal they work towards and succeed at well.

Oh my.

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No matter how cynical you become,
it's never enough to keep up.

JANE WAGNER, THE SEARCH FOR SIGNS OF
INTELLIGENT LIFE IN THE UNIVERSE

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Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 7:04:59 PM   
Lucylastic


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Lol...scummy scummy scummy

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RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 7:28:50 PM   
BamaD


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Why yes, I *DO* love the US Constitution. You often conveniently forget that the people in the US Government *ARE* US Citizens. That there are a fair number of liberals in the US Military just as there are conservatives and moderates. This nation was founded on many good things. But it was also founded on freedom from tyranny big and small. Without government control, the US Constitution is just a 220+ year old piece of paper. That you can't understand that concept is your problem!



No you love a warped interpretation of the Constitution that gives the government far more control over it's citizens than it was ever intended to have. I understand that very well, I put the level were government micromanagement of my life and yours much lower than you do. There is no big government program you have opposed. Anyone who says, as you have, we should let the government do our thinking for us has no love of the Constitution, no matter what they believe.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 7:31:19 PM   
BamaD


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To get 'into the history books' the would-be shooter in the future must not just kill more people, but do it in a flasher way. Or get individuals of similar viewpoints and ideas to help in the destruction. When its all over, we'll find they got their firearm arsenal the easy way; they went to local gun shops and purchased it. Or drove to a gun show, portrayed themselves as conservative NRA-flukies. The people selling will not know their guns helped in the massacre until the FBI catches up with them. I do not imagine such individual take that sort of news lightly.

The sheriff in Oregon is doing this right, and for the most part the media is following his lead. Don't use the shooters name, that ends the fame.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 7:35:50 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
BTW, BamaD, we are not living in 1950's America. Its 2015. Things have changed in so many ways. Apparently our gun laws are out of date. We know this by all the violence in our nation. More Americans have been killed by firearms in domestic confrentations than terroist (domestic and foreign).

No, our values have changed, we tell kids they are great just for showing up and then they get into the real world and it doesn't work that way. Then they build up rage against society for holding them down and bang you have an incident. Teach kids real values and you'll get somewhere.

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 7:39:40 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
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I've been saying for a long time now; lets do some semi-live action studies and see what works and what doesn't with all these 'gun nut' myths. You and others are afraid in having your values and beliefs tested with science. You would rather put Americans at risk than admit your beliefs are fucked-n-the-head-stupid. I've suggested we do a number of things to keep firearms out of criminals hands. Someone wants to buy a gun, there is a process:

Don't have too, there are already studies in place from real situations and they show that armed resistance to these nuts reduces the fatalities by at least 2/3.
Any "live action" test has an air of phonyness about it even when put together by someone as wise as you think you are.

< Message edited by BamaD -- 10/5/2015 7:45:19 PM >


_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 7:41:50 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
Status: offline
Or....we could just ban firearms. Your choice. They are both ugly to you. Well to bad, your 'political side' seems to ally itself with people that would be against my ideas and others: criminals, terrorists, thugs, villians, etc. That's whom your fighting to protect; the ones spreading violence, fear, and destruction onto Americans.


Do it your way or else. Surrender a bit at a time or we will take it all at once. Spoken like a true statist

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 7:43:43 PM   
BamaD


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Joined: 2/27/2005
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I've buried some of those kids, asshole! I've watched the parents suffer. I've watches their brothers and sisters....suffer.
They have asked me "why?", to which I can not give them a good enough answer. How many times have you been a man and comforted those whom have suffered violence from firearms?



And I have friends who are alive because they were armed but you want them to be defenseless asshole!

_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 7:45:29 PM   
BamaD


Posts: 20687
Joined: 2/27/2005
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Corporations, BamaD, want profit. If they see firearms in the hands of lunatics like you as the reason for their lost

Lunitic = sees through your BS

You say you have known people killed in mass shootings didn't know there were any in MA, a pressure cooker bombing, yes, but shootings no. In any case you also claim that because I am pro 2nd I have a conflict of interest. By your statements here you show that because of personal envolvment it is you, and not I, who has a conflict of interest. Clearly your anger and grief cloud your judgement.

< Message edited by BamaD -- 10/5/2015 7:56:12 PM >


_____________________________

Government ranges from a necessary evil to an intolerable one. Thomas Paine

People don't believe they can defend themselves because they have guns, they have guns because they believe they can defend themselves.

(in reply to joether)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Mental health satirical truth?? - 10/5/2015 9:03:55 PM   
Lucylastic


Posts: 40310
Status: offline
seven separate posts to respond to one
That has to be a record.
Taking over another thread with your drivel Bama???


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<) )╯SUCH
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\(•_•)
( (> A NASTY
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(•_•)
<) )> WOMAN
/ \

Duchess Of Dissent
Dont Hate Love

(in reply to BamaD)
Profile   Post #: 40
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