RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (Full Version)

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JanahX -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/15/2015 7:35:57 PM)

=fast reply=
Then give these people the fetus. Sounds like its their problem how to keep it alive since they want to so bad.



Greta75 -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/15/2015 11:06:23 PM)

FR

I wanna share this video, with anybody who does not believe that Islam permits and teaches beating of wives.

Let the Muslims explain it to you where it says this in the Quran and also explain to you the logic of why this is so. And why thanks to their clear instructions in the Quran on proper procedure to beat your wife, no wife in the middle east got beaten to death apparently, as compared to the US where they claim a wife gets beaten to death every 12 secs. Not sure where they got this stats from, but that's what they claim. Oh and this is even BDSM related. They even bring up how some men are sadist and some women are masochist, and the cure for masochist women is to beat them heavily.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJ_HHZvt31U

Who are we non-muslims to tell these Muslims they are wrong about their religion? Ha! They are the ones living and breathing it everyday from birth.





MariaB -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 2:11:38 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75
Who are we non-muslims to tell these Muslims they are wrong about their religion? Ha! They are the ones living and breathing it everyday from birth.


That video btw is about not using the rod on the wife and only punishing as an absolute last resort. The man says, "You must not discipline your partner with the rod but you must try deal with problems through dialogue and mutual understanding."

I would honestly worry a lot more for Hindu women than I would for a Muslim woman.


Inequity and degradation of women are sanctified in the Hindu religion.
Never trust a woman. Never sit alone with a woman even if it may be your mother, she may tempt you. Do not sit alone with your daughter, she may tempt you. Do not sit alone with your sister, she may tempt you.

Now see the verses of “Sacred” Hinduism Literature about women

Women = Dogs = Sudras = Untruth

“And whilst not coming into contact with Sûdras and remains of food; for this Gharma is he that shines yonder, and he is excellence, truth, and light; but woman, the Sûdra, the dog, and the black bird (the crow), are untruth: he should not look at these, lest he should mingle excellence and sin, light and darkness, truth and untruth.”

Lets compare the 2

Hindu women

The Hindu woman has no right to divorce her husband.
She has no property or inheritance rights.
Choice of partner is limited because she can only marry within her own caste; moreover her horoscope must match that of the intending bridegroom/family.
The family of the girl has to offer an enormous dowry to the bridegroom/family.
If her husband dies she should commit Sati (being cremated with her dead husband). Since today’s law forbids Sati, society mainly punishes her in other “holy” ways (see below).
She can never remarry.
The widow is considered to be a curse and must not be seen in public. She cannot wear jewelry or colorful clothes. (She should not even take part in her children’s marriage!)
Child and infant marriage is encouraged.

Muslim Woman

The Muslim lady has the same right as the Muslim man in all matters, including divorce.
She enjoys property and inheritance rights. (Which other religion grants women these rights?). She can also conduct her own separate business.
She can marry any Muslim of her choice. If her parents choose a partner for her, her consent has to be taken.
The dowry in Islam is a gift from a husband to his wife (not the other way round as is practiced by some ignoramuses).
A Muslim widow is encouraged to remarry, and her remarriage is the responsibility of the Muslim society.
Mixed marriage is encouraged and is a means to prevent racism creeping into society.
A Muslim mother is given the highest form of respect.

https://hinduismexposed.wordpress.com/women-in-hinduism/

The vidieo




Staleek -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 2:54:07 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Staleek
Why do you hate Islam so much you have to actually manufacture bullshit to hurl at it? If the silent majority of Islamic people have no quarrel with you why do you still have to fight with them? This is how ideological then military conflicts start.

I don't manufacture it.

I can say that of all the Islamic folk that I have come into contact with (and bearing in mind I have, and still do, live among them), most of them I am finding their behaviour towards women as deplorable and completely unacceptable.
I am not finding that among those who are not Islamic.
Almost a quarter of the noble city of Peterborough (north-west quadrant) where I used to live is predominantly (almost exclusively) Islamic.
Even among those that I befriended, I hated the way the women were treated in most aspects of their lives.
The menfolk thought the christian ways and our law were utterly wrong in regard to affording women equal rights and having a say.
Sure, there are some Islamic women who have made great strides; but these are minuscule by comparison.
To my mind, Islam (in general) is homophobic, mysoginistic, and anti-women.

If that makes me an Islamophobe, then so be it.
I strongly believe in equal rights and decent treatment for all women.
Islam doesn't treat it's women favourably and to me, that is horribly wrong and inexcusable.




So you're ignoring the reality in the rest of the world, taking your own experiences (which are filtered through the lens of your bigotry), and assuming them to be the only accurate depiction of 1.8 billion people?

This is kind of like a person living in Africa saying they don't believe snow exists because it is always warm where they are, and is just as mindlessly narcissistic.



freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 4:59:14 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Staleek
So you're ignoring the reality in the rest of the world, taking your own experiences (which are filtered through the lens of your bigotry), and assuming them to be the only accurate depiction of 1.8 billion people?

This is kind of like a person living in Africa saying they don't believe snow exists because it is always warm where they are, and is just as mindlessly narcissistic.

Reality??
The reality I saw in EVERY Islamic I have come across in my life is that Islam does not treat women equally or fairly.
I have seen under the skin, not the media spin.

If you live in a different reality or want to be in denial and believe the nay-sayers, that's your problem.



MariaB -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 5:02:48 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Staleek


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Staleek
Why do you hate Islam so much you have to actually manufacture bullshit to hurl at it? If the silent majority of Islamic people have no quarrel with you why do you still have to fight with them? This is how ideological then military conflicts start.

I don't manufacture it.

I can say that of all the Islamic folk that I have come into contact with (and bearing in mind I have, and still do, live among them), most of them I am finding their behaviour towards women as deplorable and completely unacceptable.
I am not finding that among those who are not Islamic.
Almost a quarter of the noble city of Peterborough (north-west quadrant) where I used to live is predominantly (almost exclusively) Islamic.
Even among those that I befriended, I hated the way the women were treated in most aspects of their lives.
The menfolk thought the christian ways and our law were utterly wrong in regard to affording women equal rights and having a say.
Sure, there are some Islamic women who have made great strides; but these are minuscule by comparison.
To my mind, Islam (in general) is homophobic, mysoginistic, and anti-women.

If that makes me an Islamophobe, then so be it.
I strongly believe in equal rights and decent treatment for all women.
Islam doesn't treat it's women favourably and to me, that is horribly wrong and inexcusable.




So you're ignoring the reality in the rest of the world, taking your own experiences (which are filtered through the lens of your bigotry), and assuming them to be the only accurate depiction of 1.8 billion people?

This is kind of like a person living in Africa saying they don't believe snow exists because it is always warm where they are, and is just as mindlessly narcissistic.



Well said.

Peterborough has a very low population if you were to compare it with somewhere like Tower Hamlets in London and because I've lived on and off in East London, surely I should of seen some or even many of these despicable acts against Muslim women? or could it be that the Tower Hamlet Muslims are generally kinder and more tolerable than those living in Peterborough?!?.

Every Islamaphobic I've ever had the misfortune to bump into has a stories like those Freedom Dwarf has. I've just got back from Harrogate in North Yorkshire, a predominantly white middle class town with large houses, picket fences and leafy avenues. You won't see a Muslim sipping high tea in the famous Betty's cafe because they don't want people like that here 'thank you very much'. You can't speak to these people about the the Syrians fleeing a war because their tongues become so vile they would turn butter sour.

Such people are like vultures feeding off every sprinkling of propaganda. They are ripped through with fear and paranoia and that fear and paranoia is backed up by their rather large collectives.



freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 5:28:31 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
Muslim Woman

The Muslim lady has the same right as the Muslim man in all matters, including divorce.
She enjoys property and inheritance rights. (Which other religion grants women these rights?). She can also conduct her own separate business.
She can marry any Muslim of her choice. If her parents choose a partner for her, her consent has to be taken.
The dowry in Islam is a gift from a husband to his wife (not the other way round as is practiced by some ignoramuses).
A Muslim widow is encouraged to remarry, and her remarriage is the responsibility of the Muslim society.
Mixed marriage is encouraged and is a means to prevent racism creeping into society.
A Muslim mother is given the highest form of respect.

https://hinduismexposed.wordpress.com/women-in-hinduism/

That's not what I see here Maria, nor what the Women's Rescue shelters are seeing.
It's also not what has been reported either.

The Muslim women has no rights to divorce her husband off her own bat in most cases.
She has to get the approval of her husband and win her case at a Sharia Court.
From reports, most Muslim women fail in the Sharia Court stage even if the husband agrees to the divorce.
According to Wiki: Divorce in Islam. In the ṭalāq divorce, the husband pronounces the phrase "I divorce you" (in Arabic, talaq) to his wife. A man may divorce his wife three times, taking her back after the first two (reconciling). After the third talaq they can't get back together until she marries someone else.
Only in the most unusual circumstances can the woman divorce her husband and be successful.

Most divorced Muslim women are shunned by her family and the general Muslim community.
Not in every case, but it is commonplace. This is also where honour killings come in.
If the woman divorces against her husband's or her family's wishes, she is often given a fatwa and very likely to be put to death by either her own family or those of her husband even if the divorce was attained properly and legally under Islamic law.
In theory, she may enjoy property and inheritance rights but in practice, very few get that luxury.

Again, because of the stigma of divorce, most Muslim women don't get given the opportunity to re-marry as a lot of men don't want 'spoiled' goods.
Not an impossible task but nowhere near as common as we enjoy in our western society.
Even so, she must wait three menstrual cycles in case her husband decides to reconcile.




Staleek -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 5:35:55 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Staleek
So you're ignoring the reality in the rest of the world, taking your own experiences (which are filtered through the lens of your bigotry), and assuming them to be the only accurate depiction of 1.8 billion people?

This is kind of like a person living in Africa saying they don't believe snow exists because it is always warm where they are, and is just as mindlessly narcissistic.

Reality??
The reality I saw in EVERY Islamic I have come across in my life is that Islam does not treat women equally or fairly.
I have seen under the skin, not the media spin.

If you live in a different reality or want to be in denial and believe the nay-sayers, that's your problem.



Yes. Ok. Let's assume you're telling the truth and not making shit up in a misguided attempt to get other people on the internet to hate Muslims. Just for the sake of pressing a logical point, I'll accept that even though I know better.

Why on earth do you think that your experiences outweigh hard data?

This may come as a shock to you, but you are not the center of the universe. Your experiences do not speak to every single one of the 1.8 billion Muslims, especially those who are living on those parts of the planet you clearly don't know anything about.

Bangladesh, 2008. A democratic election was held in an Islamic state to decide who the prime minister of their country would be.

Here are the three candidates. WARNING: They look Muslim, because they are Muslim, but don't be afraid.

[image]http://st3.cricketcountry.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/Sheikh-Hasina.jpg[/image]

Sheikh Hasina, she had 33,887,451 votes. Many of them presumably Muslim men.

[image]http://www.topnews.in/files/khaleda-zia0012.jpg[/image]

Khaleda Zia, she had 22,963,836 votes. Again, many of them presumably Muslim men.

[image]http://static.republika.co.id/uploads/images/detailnews/mantan-pemimpin-bangladesh-hussain-muhammad-ershad-_131205195827-103.jpg[/image]

Hussain Muhammad Ershad, he had 4,867,377 votes.

What do you notice about the first two candidates? The candidates who by far got the lions share of the vote? They both lack penises.

That's right, the females between them polled 82% of the votes cast. How is that possible for a demographic which, according to you, would never let a woman hold a position of authority?

Answer: It isn't, ergo your premise is wrong.

However genuine your anecdote might be it simply doesn't compare to that sort of data. There are many Islamic nations which do oppress women, just as there have been Christian and atheist states which have done the same. That is cultural, not religious.



MariaB -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 8:02:50 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1

That's not what I see here Maria, nor what the Women's Rescue shelters are seeing.
It's also not what has been reported either.

The Muslim women has no rights to divorce her husband off her own bat in most cases.
She has to get the approval of her husband and win her case at a Sharia Court.
From reports, most Muslim women fail in the Sharia Court stage even if the husband agrees to the divorce.
According to Wiki: Divorce in Islam. In the ṭalāq divorce, the husband pronounces the phrase "I divorce you" (in Arabic, talaq) to his wife. A man may divorce his wife three times, taking her back after the first two (reconciling). After the third talaq they can't get back together until she marries someone else.
Only in the most unusual circumstances can the woman divorce her husband and be successful.

Most divorced Muslim women are shunned by her family and the general Muslim community.
Not in every case, but it is commonplace. This is also where honour killings come in.
If the woman divorces against her husband's or her family's wishes, she is often given a fatwa and very likely to be put to death by either her own family or those of her husband even if the divorce was attained properly and legally under Islamic law.
In theory, she may enjoy property and inheritance rights but in practice, very few get that luxury.

Again, because of the stigma of divorce, most Muslim women don't get given the opportunity to re-marry as a lot of men don't want 'spoiled' goods.
Not an impossible task but nowhere near as common as we enjoy in our western society.
Even so, she must wait three menstrual cycles in case her husband decides to reconcile.



Are you saying you work in rescue centres now?

Lets go straight to the Quora because Wiki so often gets things wrong. 'Khula' is the right of a woman in Islam to seek divorce or separation. Many women choose to separate rather than divorce because it takes away family pressure for her to re-marry a new suitor. A Muslim woman may petition for divorce on a community panel (Sharia Law panel). She is then expected to wait one menstural cycle or if she's pregnant, till the child is born before a divorce is granted. She can divorce her husband much quicker than a British woman in most circumstances and she's not expected to pay out of pocket. It normally takes a month to get divorced but in cases of physical neglect its often instant.

Sharia law in this country has to follow national law....its a law that is used for litigation and domestic disputes but little else. Sharia law in this country can not insist the wife remains with the husband and Sharia law in Islamic countries can not insist she remains with her husband if he has neglected her in any way...including no sex for 2 months.

A divorced Muslim woman isn't shunned, unless she's seen as an adulteress. If her husband wronged her or neglected her in any way, then she can expect an entire community to come out and fight her cause. Indian women are shunned and we have a real problem in the UK with Hindu honour killings but no such problem with Muslim ones. Honour killings in Islam are very rare, but do happen in Saudi and Morocco against women who have committed adultery but in Saudi, honour killings also happen to men.

In Iran I knew plenty of happily divorced women. One thing that is very unfair is, they have to give up custody of their child from the age of seven but these women weren't destitute, seen as spoilt or ruined, in fact, once a woman is divorced in Islam or over here for that matter, her family will get a sudden influx of new and interested men looking for her hand in marriage.




BamaD -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 8:16:33 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: kdsub

It is not human nature to beat women where i live.... I think there is enough evidence to say much of Islam is suppressing women's rights. Treating women as property is so ingrained in the Muslim world that women themselves think it is God's will.

Butch

When I was substitute teaching I saw a guy shoving a girl around.
When I intervened she told me it was ok because he was a brother.
The the guy on the other side of her shoved her and she said that it was ok because he was a brother. I told the guys that they were brothers but they weren't her brother and that it was going to stop. This girl will defend this behaviour and in ten years she won't understand why she gets abused and the white woman across the street doesn't. She was in a culture where bad behaviour was accepted and couldn't see what it lead to. By the time they saw a problem they were asking for it just by complaining.



kdsub -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 8:38:44 AM)

Is it possible to worry about both? Because one group treats their women unequally should another be forgiven.

Butch



freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 8:42:11 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Staleek
Yes. Ok. Let's assume you're telling the truth and not making shit up in a misguided attempt to get other people on the internet to hate Muslims. Just for the sake of pressing a logical point, I'll accept that even though I know better.

Why on earth do you think that your experiences outweigh hard data?

This may come as a shock to you, but you are not the center of the universe. Your experiences do not speak to every single one of the 1.8 billion Muslims, especially those who are living on those parts of the planet you clearly don't know anything about.
Answer: It isn't, ergo your premise is wrong.

However genuine your anecdote might be it simply doesn't compare to that sort of data. There are many Islamic nations which do oppress women, just as there have been Christian and atheist states which have done the same. That is cultural, not religious.

I lived among over 1,000 Islamics of Sunni, Shea, Hindi and Sikh's.
I currently live very close to something similar in numbers.

So it's only a couple of thousand or so Islamics.
I don't know them all personally but I speak to and am pleasant to the majority of them.
I don't hate the people - I hate the doctrines of the faith they follow, particularly when it comes to womenfolk.

So you mention my experiences shouldn't outweigh 'hard data' and you come up with just THREE examples compared to my couple of thousand???
And I already said that some have made some wonderful gains in the world.
You pick 3 of the better known ones. Big deal.
That doesn't change my perspective on Islam.
It's not the people. It's the doctrines of the faith I don't like.



Staleek -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 8:57:11 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1


quote:

ORIGINAL: Staleek
Yes. Ok. Let's assume you're telling the truth and not making shit up in a misguided attempt to get other people on the internet to hate Muslims. Just for the sake of pressing a logical point, I'll accept that even though I know better.

Why on earth do you think that your experiences outweigh hard data?

This may come as a shock to you, but you are not the center of the universe. Your experiences do not speak to every single one of the 1.8 billion Muslims, especially those who are living on those parts of the planet you clearly don't know anything about.
Answer: It isn't, ergo your premise is wrong.

However genuine your anecdote might be it simply doesn't compare to that sort of data. There are many Islamic nations which do oppress women, just as there have been Christian and atheist states which have done the same. That is cultural, not religious.

I lived among over 1,000 Islamics of Sunni, Shea, Hindi and Sikh's.
I currently live very close to something similar in numbers.

So it's only a couple of thousand or so Islamics.
I don't know them all personally but I speak to and am pleasant to the majority of them.
I don't hate the people - I hate the doctrines of the faith they follow, particularly when it comes to womenfolk.

So you mention my experiences shouldn't outweigh 'hard data' and you come up with just THREE examples compared to my couple of thousand???
And I already said that some have made some wonderful gains in the world.
You pick 3 of the better known ones. Big deal.
That doesn't change my perspective on Islam.
It's not the people. It's the doctrines of the faith I don't like.



No, not three examples. Go count again.

And yes, I picked three of the better known ones. I assumed if you were interested you could look up Mariam Kaïdama Sidibé, Gurib-Fakim, or Tansu Çiller on your own.

But your last sentence says it all - you're not looking for fact but a justification of your own beliefs. As I said, a very religious mind-set.



freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 9:14:04 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
Are you saying you work in rescue centres now?

I have never claimed that I do. So why do you think that??

quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
Lets go straight to the Quora because Wiki so often gets things wrong. 'Khula' is the right of a woman in Islam to seek divorce or separation. Many women choose to separate rather than divorce because it takes away family pressure for her to re-marry a new suitor. A Muslim woman may petition for divorce on a community panel (Sharia Law panel). She is then expected to wait one menstural cycle or if she's pregnant, till the child is born before a divorce is granted. She can divorce her husband much quicker than a British woman in most circumstances and she's not expected to pay out of pocket. It normally takes a month to get divorced but in cases of physical neglect its often instant.

According to just about everything I've read and personal testimony, it is 3 menstrual cycles, not one.
And as I said earlier... altho in theory she can instigate the divorce, most fail in the Sharia Court.
A Panorama program followed one such example.
Yes, if she wins, it is often instant according to Islamic/Sharia law.
But the UK does not recognise Sharia Law.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
Sharia law in this country has to follow national law....its a law that is used for litigation and domestic disputes but little else. Sharia law in this country can not insist the wife remains with the husband and Sharia law in Islamic countries can not insist she remains with her husband if he has neglected her in any way...including no sex for 2 months.

Sharia Law is not recognised in the UK.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
A divorced Muslim woman isn't shunned, unless she's seen as an adulteress.

Tell that to the many thousands of Muslim women - some of whom are dead because of honour killings.
Tell that to the many Muslim women in shelters who are in fear of their lives because of Islamic traditions.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
If her husband wronged her or neglected her in any way, then she can expect an entire community to come out and fight her cause. Indian women are shunned and we have a real problem in the UK with Hindu honour killings but no such problem with Muslim ones. Honour killings in Islam are very rare, but do happen in Saudi and Morocco against women who have committed adultery but in Saudi, honour killings also happen to men.

See my comment above.
What you read in media PR isn't always reflected in real life.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MariaB
In Iran I knew plenty of happily divorced women. One thing that is very unfair is, they have to give up custody of their child from the age of seven but these women weren't destitute, seen as spoilt or ruined, in fact, once a woman is divorced in Islam or over here for that matter, her family will get a sudden influx of new and interested men looking for her hand in marriage.

Oh good. I'll tell my friend in the local shelter she can expect lots of wonderful suitors.... NOT!!
She tried to divorce her husband because of the daily beatings and constant rapings from his friends.
The local (illegal) Islamic council refused her divorce on grounds that her husband was entitled to beat her.
She tried to go home and was physically thrown out the door by her father for abandoning the marriage.
She fears for her life.
She has been warned by her husband and her family that if they set eyes on her they'll kill her.
The local mosque won't allow her to pray there.
She was with someone for a short while until they heard that she wasn't a virgin and had been married before.
She was dropped quicker than a hot potato and had to flee to the shelter.
At the weekend when I see her with my step-daughter, I'll tell her that what's happening to her (and many other Muslim women in that shelter) that what they are going thru is all lies and doesn't happen.

[ETA: she is 20 (I believe), never strayed and never been pregnant. Got married as a virgin at 16 in Pakistan]



freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 9:24:16 AM)

I'm not religious. I'm not even spiritual.
I'm not an atheist nor an agnostic.

I don't need to look up famous Islamic people that are an example.
I'll go by what I've seen and witnessed personally.
I know it's only a few thousand as a sample. Not many in the grand scheme of things.
But I can honestly say, the experience I've seen with my own eyes is 100% as I've described.
Not a single one who was any different. Not one. Not one exception.
There are many in my group of acquaintances who are fantastic people - as people go.

So you pick a few from 1.8 billion people who did well and are famous for getting there.
How many Islamic people do you know and interact with on an almost daily basis??
And how many fit the examples you gave??

And as I said... It's not the people, it's the doctrine of their faith.



MariaB -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 10:08:21 AM)

Everyone here calls it Sharia Law and that's why I initially said Sharia Council. Yes we do have Sharia Council over here and like I've already said, they only deal with things like litigation and domestic matters.

I'm sorry mate but you don't convince me. You look and read what you want to believe and watch documentaries that will back up those beliefs but that's all you have to go on. I on the other hand have a world of experience. Direct experience, in their country living and working with them experience, speaking their language experience. I bet you're one of these people who talks to people who know people, who know other people and that you all have your own example regarding the treatment of Muslim women.

You take one women and you believe she represents all Muslim women. What's happening in her world is not representative of what goes on in the Muslim community but if it makes you feel better to think that, go right ahead...just don't try and spread such nonsense.



freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 10:21:09 AM)

No, I don't take just one women and extrapolate her experiences to all of Islam.

Did you read my other posts??
I've lived among several thousand of them, and still do.
Not abroad, but here in the UK.

Many things happen overseas that don't happen here and vice-versa.
What is supposed to happen, and what obviously does happen overseas, doesn't happen here.

I have quoted other happenings that were reported in the Telegraph.
They match pretty much what I have personally witnessed happening where I lived and where I live now.
Honour killings and being shunned by the family have been reported quite a few times in the News items.
They can't all be wrong.



Lucylastic -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 10:44:09 AM)

A Michigan store clerk is recovering after being shot in the face and called a "terrorist" by an armed robber who may have perpetrated a hate crime.
An armed robber entered a party store in Grand Rapids, Michigan, early Sunday morning, according to a statement from the Grand Rapids Police Department. The robber pointed a gun at the 34-year-old clerk, who reportedly goes by "Tony," and demanded money.
After Tony handed over a bag of cash, the store manager says, the robber stuck the gun in Tony's mouth and said something to the effect of “I shot people like you overseas in the Middle East." The manager also said the robber called Tony a "terrorist" and a member of ISIS, according to WOOD-TV. Grand Rapids police Sgt. Terry Dixon confirmed the manager's statements to the station.
The clerk fought back and grabbed the gun, according to reports. The gun went off and the bullet went through Tony's cheek, police said.
"We're very proud of how [the clerk] responded in light of this incident. This could've been much, much worse given the apparent intent of the suspect," Dixon told MLive. "If the victim had not fought off the suspect, then this could've been a much more serious incident."
Dixon told WOOD-TV that police are currently treating the case as an armed robbery and a shooting. He said they will need to investigate further to determine if the incident was indeed a hate crime.
The clerk is Punjabi, not Middle Eastern, and is not Muslim, WOOD-TV reports.
“We shouldn’t be targeted for it because we have nothing to do with it. We are just trying to live our normal lives," the store manager told the TV station. "I grew up here and a lot of my Punjabi friends did. Whether we’re Indian or whether we’re (not), it doesn’t matter. You shouldn’t specifically be going for one race."
"We’re not involved in any of it and so it’s just really sad that people are thinking like that,” she added.
Since the Nov. 13 attacks in Paris, there have been at least 71 Islamophobic incidents in North America, several of which have been perpetrated against people of the Sikh faith or people of Indian descent who have been mistaken for Middle Eastern Muslims. All of these acts, of course, are equally inexcusable.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/robber-shoots-clerk-terrorist_5670a826e4b0dfd4bcbfdb37

THis was just posted on my facebook by a "friend".

[image]https://scontent-ord1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xft1/t31.0-8/11999771_904569576291004_8298746017790640648_o.jpg[/image]

It broke the proverbial camels back.




PeonForHer -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 10:45:27 AM)

quote:

I lived among over 1,000 Islamics of Sunni, Shea, Hindi and Sikh's.


What? Hindi is a language, not a people. Sikhs aren't Muslims. What does this sentence mean, FD?



joether -> RE: Would people defend Hijab wearing women being beaten in public? (12/16/2015 11:49:51 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lucylastic
Arent you lucky you have never seen any other kind of male beat up on a female in public.

Are all the shitty people in your life only muslims?

There are many incidents where men beat women for no real apparent or justifiable reason.
However, only in Islam is it actually encouraged and sanctioned as not only permissible, but expected.
There are many references in This Website where sections of the Qur'an are quoted as being the definitive permission for wife-beating.


LOL....YOUR FULL OF SHIT!

Women get beaten in the United States of America all the time. They are beaten for so many reasons. And encouraged to be beaten by others whom feel they are above the law. Never heard of the KKK in America? That organization would use torture, law, and terrorism to keep black women from speaking out. In modern day, quite a few 'christian' organizations force their women to be nothing more than property. On the surface they are shown as being free; its when one peels back the layers and finds the bruises and the raw mental/emotional abuse. Quite a few of those 'sovereign citizens' beat their women because, according to them, they can not be held accountable by the United States of America.

So to say "This only happens where Islam is around" either spoken from a deep level of ignorance, or completely bullshitting and hoping no one points things out with facts.

There are sections of the Bible that can be 're-interpreted' to allow women to be beaten. Doesn't take to much 'creative' bent to make it work. After all, 'christians' have re-interpreted passages to fight against gay marriage, women as the bread winner in the family, and serving in public office.



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