RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue

RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (Full Version)

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Phydeaux -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 7:12:17 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: ORIGINAL: CodeOfSilence "Yeah suck it up you raped hoe and go public about it unless you want to have the state rape you too. " A woman reporting rape is always a positive thing, since I want every rapist to be convicted! IF this will force a woman to get over her fear of reporting rape, it's a positive thing. quote: Or what about that women might blame men for rape to get an abortion? :) This was brought up by wayward. First of all, rape is not something that you can claim by your own mouth. It has to be proven. On the opposite side, there may be women who actually got raped, but could not prove it that will fall through the cracks too, that's why humane punishment such as community service is inflicted. Which also why, the whole forced sterilisation thing is not a good idea if the woman can't prove she got rape. That's too physical altering of a punishment. I see community service as "forced volunteering" to do good, and it's a positive punishment. A woman reporting rape is not always a good thing - as significant numbers of them - aka Taneka Brawley; The Duke Rape; etc. etc. ad infinitum - are FALSE. And this is why the sexual guidelines put it at major universities are bullshit.

Lucylastic -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 7:16:25 PM)
women reporting rape is a very hard difficult thing to do, yes women should report it, but they should never be made a victim twice. If they falsly accuse they should be charged with it, but you are an ignorant twat if you think that the vast majority of rapes are false

ThatDizzyChick -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 7:16:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: ORIGINAL: CodeOfSilence "Yeah suck it up you raped hoe and go public about it unless you want to have the state rape you too. " A woman reporting rape is always a positive thing, since I want every rapist to be convicted! IF this will force a woman to get over her fear of reporting rape, it's a positive thing. quote: Or what about that women might blame men for rape to get an abortion? :) This was brought up by wayward. First of all, rape is not something that you can claim by your own mouth. It has to be proven. On the opposite side, there may be women who actually got raped, but could not prove it that will fall through the cracks too, that's why humane punishment such as community service is inflicted. Which also why, the whole forced sterilisation thing is not a good idea if the woman can't prove she got rape. That's too physical altering of a punishment. I see community service as "forced volunteering" to do good, and it's a positive punishment. A woman reporting rape is not always a good thing - as significant numbers of them - aka Taneka Brawley; The Duke Rape; etc. etc. ad infinitum - are FALSE. And this is why the sexual guidelines put it at major universities are bullshit. And Greta's idea will just add a real incentive for falsely claiming rape. As for the guidelines, while off topic, I fear I agree with you, well certain aspects of it.

Phydeaux -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 7:42:31 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic women reporting rape is a very hard difficult thing to do, yes women should report it, but they should never be made a victim twice. If they falsly accuse they should be charged with it, but you are an ignorant twat if you think that the vast majority of rapes are false Inventing things again twat. I said significant numbers, which is not the same as "vast majority" now is it. The FBI uniform Crime report, 1996, and the US doJ 1997 said 8 % of rape accusations are unfounded or false. http://www.avoiceformen.com/mens-rights/double-standards-on-false-accusations-and-rapes/

Greta75 -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 8:02:09 PM)
As with every crime, there will always be people telling lies, like, people can plant drugs on innocents and get them accuse of drug smuggling too. I mean, there will always be bad people, but does not mean women should not be protected from rape. There will always be innocents who fall through the crack, no matter how stringent things are. But every rape accusation still needs to be investigated thoroughly and with evidence to convict or not convict.

Greta75 -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 8:07:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic She can be blase as she wants, her ignorance is pathetic, as for the fine and community service, sterilisation at welfare level and all the other bullshit the males and her have come up with, apart from the fact that they are so problematic not just legally, but morally, constitutionally and ethically dumb as a box of pencils. Again, so typical of leftist to misrepresent everything. This is the typical, because Trump wants illegals deported, leftist says Trump hates all hispanic. All the situations you brought up, I mean, people are even freaking allergied to peanuts as well and can die from it. Peanuts are 100% safe for me. I eat it everyday! So if you have a medical condition certified by a doctor that says birth control is detrimental to your health. This penalty does not apply to you. The law will be fair and just.

mechski -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 8:20:28 PM)
@ ifmaz) I am assuming you mean it is "anal" to say there is 101% way to not get pregnant? And 75 came back with this...I smile There was the Virgin Mary. Or, were you saying screw the front and just hit it from the rear? That wouldn't even be 101% quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: ORIGINAL: ifmaz Anal. Technically, that works too! And I know some ladies that can't cum from vagina penetration but only anal penetration. Lucky them! No contraceptive needed ever!

Lucylastic -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 9:07:44 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic women reporting rape is a very hard difficult thing to do, yes women should report it, but they should never be made a victim twice. If they falsly accuse they should be charged with it, but you are an ignorant twat if you think that the vast majority of rapes are false Inventing things again twat. I said significant numbers, which is not the same as "vast majority" now is it. The FBI uniform Crime report, 1996, and the US doJ 1997 said 8 % of rape accusations are unfounded or false. http://www.avoiceformen.com/mens-rights/double-standards-on-false-accusations-and-rapes/ couldnt find the FBI crime report so you use a MRA site? tacky

Lucylastic -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 9:30:02 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic She can be blase as she wants, her ignorance is pathetic, as for the fine and community service, sterilisation at welfare level and all the other bullshit the males and her have come up with, apart from the fact that they are so problematic not just legally, but morally, constitutionally and ethically dumb as a box of pencils. Again, so typical of leftist to misrepresent everything. This is the typical, because Trump wants illegals deported, leftist says Trump hates all hispanic. All the situations you brought up, I mean, people are even freaking allergied to peanuts as well and can die from it. Peanuts are 100% safe for me. I eat it everyday! So if you have a medical condition certified by a doctor that says birth control is detrimental to your health. This penalty does not apply to you. The law will be fair and just. Your "solution" is neither, "fair or just" to begin with and now your "rules" are getting broader and broader and are vastly different to mere "irresponsibility" as the reason for getting pregnant. Yes ignorance and bad education is the WORST thing for anyone sexually. Thats why you should brush up some... Did you know that peanut oil is found in some morning after pills? Im not misrepresenting ANY Thing you silly woman, Im entering more perfectly legitimate reasons and health concerns with reasons why "accidents happen" and that it happens more often than simply being "irresponsible." You are fine, you have no allergies, the pill you take (whatever it is) is enough to stop you getting pregnant. Congratulations. However MILLIONS and millions of women every year have an issue with hormonal contraception. Serious issues. This isnt being partisan, this is reality. Your claim that because you have more partners than anyone actually means nothing, with regards to birth control. You may think about protection constantly, with each partner, a married couple certainly dont. Ive had sex thousands of times with my husband, before and after having my tubes removed, we certainly didnt use protection other than the pill every time. Ask any of the men here if they use condoms everytime they have sex, and always have done. Plenty of women who are married have abortions, plenty of "religious" women too. Half of all pregnancies are "accidents" that doesnt just happen to teenagers, irresponsible women, or ignorant women.

freedomdwarf1 -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 9:52:40 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Wayward5oul quote: ORIGINAL: freedomdwarf1 quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 I didn't know you can get pregnant from anal sex? I mean, are you serious? It's possible? Scientifically how? Either way, condoms and contraceptive combo should make it literally impossible to get pregnant from anal sex too! Are you aware Greta, that most catholic and other non-christian schools in Singapore do not follow the MOE's teachings on sex education? Many are saying that it contradicts the teachings of their faith. So in that sense, there are many out there in your own country that do not use contraception at all; despite your assertions that everyone gets the same sex education. That claim is just bullshit. And for you, a female, who is so utterly selfish when it comes to sex that she can't find love, beggars belief. And a female that can't cook... at your age?? You should be ashamed of yourself. I really wonder how you've managed to survive for so long with such a blinkered PoV of the world. In many respects, you are no better than the poor women living in north Korea - blinded, brainwashed, spoon-fed propaganda that you swallow wholesale without question and dismiss everything else. I obviously disagree with everything Greta is saying in this thread. I have made that very clear. But I did not intend for my comments to be used as a jumping off point for comments of such a personal nature. A little sexist, don't you think? Not being able to cook is not something that women should be ashamed of, unless you think that women should be barefoot and in the kitchen. Not to mention the comments about sex and love. Greta, you know how I feel about your perspective on this and many things. But I did not intend to pave the way for personal, offensive, and sexist comments to be directed at you. And for that I apologize. Don't apologize on my behalf. I made the comment because Greta is such an isolated soul and at times has a very warped sense of the world outside her own little bubble and there are many times that she spouts stuff that even in her microcosmic universe is just plain wrong. She also replied that she learned her stuff in "staunched christian school" - which was my point exactly opposite, that catholic and non-christian schools are not following Singapore's MOE directives yet she insists that everyone gets the same sex education, which is blatantly untrue. And no, I don't believe women should be barefoot in the kitchen; that idea is chauvinistic and to me, quite abhorrent. I believe being able to cook is an essential life-skill that everyone should know, including men. I am certainly a better cook than my OH and she's fairly reasonable at most things. I even taught my son and daughter how to cook. My daughter went to college for 3 years on a City & Guilds catering course and she still comes to me for ideas and recipes and cooking methods.

CodeOfSilence -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 10:24:49 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Greta75 quote: ORIGINAL: CodeOfSilence "Yeah suck it up you raped hoe and go public about it unless you want to have the state rape you too. " A woman reporting rape is always a positive thing, since I want every rapist to be convicted! IF this will force a woman to get over her fear of reporting rape, it's a positive thing. Learn humility! What you want is not interesting here. quote: quote: Or what about that women might blame men for rape to get an abortion? :) This was brought up by wayward. First of all, rape is not something that you can claim by your own mouth. It has to be proven. On the opposite side, there may be women who actually got raped, but could not prove it that will fall through the cracks too, that's why humane punishment such as community service is inflicted. Which also why, the whole forced sterilisation thing is not a good idea if the woman can't prove she got rape. That's too physical altering of a punishment. I see community service as "forced volunteering" to do good, and it's a positive punishment. It has to be proven how? By some tearing in the vaginal wall that can happen during rough sex, some semen left? There are a hundred ways of faking it and here you would be giving someone a reason to do that. I find it refreshing and inspiring that you as an atheist share my beliefs that abortion is a true waste of potential, effort, money, time, suffering and what ever else. But wasn't your solution supposed to bring people together?

Phydeaux -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 10:40:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic women reporting rape is a very hard difficult thing to do, yes women should report it, but they should never be made a victim twice. If they falsly accuse they should be charged with it, but you are an ignorant twat if you think that the vast majority of rapes are false Inventing things again twat. I said significant numbers, which is not the same as "vast majority" now is it. The FBI uniform Crime report, 1996, and the US doJ 1997 said 8 % of rape accusations are unfounded or false. http://www.avoiceformen.com/mens-rights/double-standards-on-false-accusations-and-rapes/ couldnt find the FBI crime report so you use a MRA site? tacky No. I presumed you had the tiny skills necessary to google it on your own. the FBI and the DOJ things says what I said they said. The MRA quote says other things I found interesting: the double standards that exist on rape accusations, for example. A sample of a false rape accusation. The destruction of a man's life. You know, things like that thatyou, twat that you are find inconsequential and uninteresting.

Lucylastic -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 10:52:42 PM)
Actually you are completely wrong. As always. This is not a rape topic, but nice try. I am fully aware of what happens, to men and women on both sides of the equation. Its funny that you can call clinton a rapist without proof, me a murderer, without proof....... and im the bad guy for daring to suggest college rape is actually a problem

Phydeaux -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 11:26:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic Actually you are completely wrong. As always. This is not a rape topic, but nice try. I am fully aware of what happens, to men and women on both sides of the equation. Its funny that you can call clinton a rapist without proof, me a murderer, without proof....... and im the bad guy for daring to suggest college rape is actually a problem No, you're a twat for representing that I said the vast majorities of all rapes are false- and calling me a twat to boot. As for calling you a murderer - well advocate for the killing of babies, its certainly more accurate than the things you have called me. Twat for example. As for calling clinton a rapist - well there seems to be adequate documentation for that accusation. But hey - you're all for supporting a woman in her accusation of rape. Well, except when its a democrat you favor, isn't that right.

Termyn8or -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/18/2016 11:59:12 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux How about this as an improvement. Implement what you said in addition: When you go on welfare, male or female you accept reversible sterilization.. Being sterilized is free. If you want to reverse it - you pay for it. How about they do it to all females regardless. That owuld end all discussion of discrinmina, errr bigotry or whatever. Have the government just take your tax dollars and sterilize every girl out there. Sounds like a good plan. To Jack The Ripper. LOL T^T

Termyn8or -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/19/2016 12:06:43 AM)
"I am for abortion, as I don't think unwanted babies should be in this world as it's psychologically damaging to the babies, but I also do think it's ridiculous when abortion is used as birth control. I call it, "Self-inflicted disease". It's like a situation you know you can prevent, but intentionally put yourself in. And there is also too many ignorance about safe sex out there, or deliberate ignorance about safe sex. I just feel like, abortion is totally an unnecessary disaster. I mean, it's beyond the murder thing, which like you, I am totally okay with murder of a human being because it's a foreign object in a woman's stomach and she should have the choice whether that foreign object stays or not. " Yeah, and what if she doesn't have the "fine" YOU want to charge her ? She ain't got five grand now or whatever so she has to support a kid for eighteen years ? She ain't even got money for diapers. WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU ? DO YOU NOT KNOW HOW TO THINK THINGS OUT OR WHAT THE FUCK ? Maybe you are a troll and they should ban your ass, or maybe they need you to keep it fiesty. Wahtaver it is, you do not make alot of fucking sense here. T^T

Lucylastic -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/19/2016 3:06:11 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic Actually you are completely wrong. As always. This is not a rape topic, but nice try. I am fully aware of what happens, to men and women on both sides of the equation. Its funny that you can call clinton a rapist without proof, me a murderer, without proof....... and im the bad guy for daring to suggest college rape is actually a problem No, you're a twat for representing that I said the vast majorities of all rapes are false- and calling me a twat to boot. As for calling you a murderer - well advocate for the killing of babies, its certainly more accurate than the things you have called me. Twat for example. As for calling clinton a rapist - well there seems to be adequate documentation for that accusation. But hey - you're all for supporting a woman in her accusation of rape. Well, except when its a democrat you favor, isn't that right. poor baby, cant deal without a "qualifier" What I actually said was, quote: but you are an ignorant twat if you think that the vast majority of rapes are false Does that make it easier for you? Nothing I have said or done, has killed anyone.....you keep talking about facts, but its simply your opinion.And really, that is so low on my consideration chart, its practically hanging on by its fingernails in the den of dont give a shit. I have never been in favour of supporting women who accuse rape, no matter what his side IN fact I said it earlier on the thread. post 62 quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic; women reporting rape is a very hard difficult thing to do, yes women should report it, but they should never be made a victim twice.If they falsly accuse they should be charged with it, but you are an ignorant twat if you think that the vast majority of rapes are false And Ive said it many times on here when false rape accusations have been brought up. That the woman should be charged. Please find me an example of me saying that women shouldnt be charged after a false accusation. http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4348552 http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=4884565 http://www.collarchat.com/fb.asp?m=3918312 ooooh..yeah dont bother you wont ever find one. useless lies is all you have.

Lucylastic -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/19/2016 3:29:18 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Termyn8or quote: ORIGINAL: Phydeaux How about this as an improvement. Implement what you said in addition: When you go on welfare, male or female you accept reversible sterilization.. Being sterilized is free. If you want to reverse it - you pay for it. How about they do it to all females regardless. That owuld end all discussion of discrinmina, errr bigotry or whatever. Have the government just take your tax dollars and sterilize every girl out there. Sounds like a good plan. To Jack The Ripper. LOL T^T [image]http://www.lucylasticslair.com/sarcasm.gif[/image] Why not make it simple termy...so that women dont have to worry about accidental pregnancy at all We should sterilize all baby boys at birth, and not let them get untied, until they have the responsibility and financial means to support their spermie success rates. When he has achieved suitability, he can apply to have his tubes untied so he can go forth and procreate. Everyone can screw to their hearts content without having kidlets who are not wanted or loved. The rest of the time the only thing people have to worry about is STDs, that affects women AND men.... It seems to be a perfect answer. Oh and I also think that men who want viagra should get a permission slip from their wives. a la http://www.nytimes.com/2016/02/17/us/viagra-proposed-kentucky-law-wifes-consent.html or http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/want-viagra-s-c-bill-would-make-men-go-through-n480741 oh and this could be the reasoning..... In March 2012, Illinois state Rep. Kelly Cassidy introduced an amendment to the “Ultrasound Opportunity Act,” which would have forced women to undergo an ultrasound before getting an abortion. Cassidy proposed a related “gender equity” stipulation that would require men to view a graphic video about the potential side effects of erectile-dysfunction medication—a painful four-hour boner, for example, and other undesirable penile afflictions. “If [right-wing legislators] are serious about us not being able to make our own health care decisions, then I’m just as serious about them not being able to make theirs,” Cassidy said at the time. Virginia state Sen. Janet Howell introduced an amendment to a similar 2013 ultrasound bill that would have obligated doctors to perform a just-for-hoots rectal exam on all men seeking Viagra and similar meds. In Ohio, state Sen. Nina Turner protested a bill restricting abortions to the weeks before a fetal heartbeat with her own bill, which demanded that men undergo cardiac testing, side-effect counseling, and sex therapy with their partners before receiving a Viagra prescription. Turner told MSNBC that she wanted to show “men as much love in the reproductive health arena as they have shown us over the years.” Vasectomies are another favorite target for feminist trolls in state legislatures. Georgia state Rep. Yasmin Neal and Missouri state Rep. Stacey Newman both filed bills in 2012 that would limit vasectomy procedures to men who would otherwise be at risk of dire injury or death. Neal wrote hers in response to a proposed 20-week abortion ban; Newman included a provision that would require all vasectomy providers to meet the onerous and unnecessary standards of an ambulatory surgical center. The men must be protected, they argued—it’s for their own good! [image]http://www.lucylasticslair.com/sarcasm.gif[/image]

Greta75 -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/19/2016 4:49:38 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Lucylastic Your "solution" is neither, "fair or just" to begin with and now your "rules" are getting broader and broader and are vastly different to mere "irresponsibility" as the reason for getting pregnant. My rules are actually consistent all the way. It has never occur to me to convict women who have medical conditions that can't use birth control. That's the same as punishing a woman who wants to abort for rape. It's exactly the same thing. We don't punish the woman who got rape because it's not her fault. We don't punish people with medical issues, because it's not their fault. I am trying to only target irresponsible people. So most medical allergies and conditions can easily be proven it exists, I don't think alot of innocent people will get targeted. quote: Yes ignorance and bad education is the WORST thing for anyone sexually. Thats why you should brush up some... Did you know that peanut oil is found in some morning after pills? So they will have to go for the pill without peanut oil in it. And actually, I don't advise morning after pill for anything but emergency situations when condoms fail. It's not something to pop every time after you have unprotected sex. quote: the pill you take (whatever it is) is enough to stop you getting pregnant. I never said the pill alone is enough. I always use both pill+condoms. I never trust the pill ever, so I always use condoms no matter what as a back up. And if condom breaks, I go for the morning after to be extra sure! quote: You may think about protection constantly, with each partner, a married couple certainly dont. I was married for 9 years and I used pill+condom every time with my x-husband without fail too! It has nothing to do with married or not. That's why I never got pregnant during my marriage. I took responsibility for my own body to make sure I can never get pregnant.

Greta75 -> RE: Win-Win to Abortion issue (2/19/2016 4:58:31 AM)
quote: ORIGINAL: CodeOfSilence Learn humility! What you want is not interesting here. I have no idea what you are trying to convey here? I am interpreting that you do not agree with me that I want rapists to get convicted. Why would you defend the conviction of rapists? This is alarming. quote: It has to be proven how? By some tearing in the vaginal wall that can happen during rough sex, some semen left? There are a hundred ways of faking it and here you would be giving someone a reason to do that. I find it refreshing and inspiring that you as an atheist share my beliefs that abortion is a true waste of potential, effort, money, time, suffering and what ever else. But wasn't your solution supposed to bring people together? I don't know precisely how the forensic in the law ascertify if a female is raped or not. So I can't explain to you how they prove it. It's not my field of expertise, but I have to trust the experts this field to do their due diligence from what is their profession to figure out if it's rape or not. I have a case in my country which I thought irrevocably, it was 100% rape, but the rapist got the best criminal lawyer in my country and somehow got off. The girl was heavily intoxicated, he brought her home, she was crying and saying she don't want it, and she even managed get to her handphone and call her mom and cry in distress for her mom to come get her! He snatch the phone from her and told her mom, everything is okay, he will send her home to the mom in the morning. Then he shut off her phone and kept her away from being able to use her phone and he raped her, and then threw her out of his home naked without her clothes. She actually had to ask passerby for help while naked, trying to get home. This man was not convicted of rape, despite clear medical evidence that her intoxication level of alcohol was extremely high. And while they accuse her of agreeing to go back with the guy, she claimed she was too intoxicated and weak to know what was really going on until she got to his home and got really scared and didn't want to have sex with him! But there were no wounds, nothing, no violence was done to her, she claim she was too terrified to fight back. It is not easy to prove rape, so I don't know why you think alot of men are gonna get in trouble. I think more women who actually got raped can't prove it is more of the bigger issue. This was one case that always troubled me, how did the man get off! How is it possible she was considered consensual in her state! The funny thing is, the advice for women when they do get rape is to incite the man into getting physical violent with you, so there will be physical hurt evidence. You can't win him, but make sure there is alot of evidence of resistance. I say this is funny, because, it's like, you are already suffering rape and yet you gotta incite the man to hurt you more, so you can prove it that he rape you later. And of course he could end up killing you if you piss him off so much, so you gotta take that risk anyway.

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