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Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 6:45:08 AM   
GBaxter


Posts: 15
Joined: 11/24/2015
Status: offline 		I know it's a popular platitude we hear in BDSM, but as some female subs can be rather arrogant and condescending about it,
is a female sub, or a female switch's submission really a gift ?
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 6:51:45 AM   
RebeccaRayne66


Posts: 4
Joined: 7/21/2016
Status: offline 		When I've been with Dominants,....they wanted my submission, they took it. For me, its the way it should be. But then I classify me as a 'slave' not a submissive.

(in reply to GBaxter)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 6:53:27 AM   
MoxieMcfly


Posts: 76
Joined: 3/26/2015
Status: offline 		It's no different than any other relationship. One person is more dominant. One is more submissive. Two people with complementary personalities. The rest is negotiable.


(in reply to RebeccaRayne66)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 7:06:01 AM   
Greatlilbabygirl


Posts: 786
Joined: 9/9/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GBaxter

I know it's a popular platitude we hear in BDSM, but as some female subs can be rather arrogant and condescending about it,
is a female sub, or a female switch's submission really a gift ?

Did somebody hurt your feelings?
Yes, for some like me, my submission is earned by my Dom. I choose to give it. He must be trustworthy, capable, commanding, and someone I can look up to and respect. I can take this submission away. Conversely my Dom's domination is also something I must earn. None of this is a given and no one is entitled to submission or domination just because they self identify what side of the slash they are on. The "arrogance" you say you've encountered from female subs is probably them being fed up with domly Doms who lead off with disrespect and rudeness and think all subs should automatically submissive towards them with no actual work on the Dom's part. This isn't a game we are playing and we don't have the time or patience for little boys who play at being Doms.

< Message edited by Greatlilbabygirl -- 9/29/2016 7:07:32 AM >

(in reply to GBaxter)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 7:41:21 AM   
DesFIP


Posts: 25191
Joined: 11/25/2007
From: Apple County NY
Status: offline 		It's a useful concept for a new sub in that it reminds them to ignore the frenzy and take time to determine if this person will be a good partner or not.

I must admit, that when an unpartnered dude starts throwing out negativity about women who rejected him, the natural assumption is to cheer that they were smart enough not to 'gift' their submission to him.

Butt hurt is never attractive.

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Cynical and proud of it!


(in reply to Greatlilbabygirl)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 7:54:30 AM   
WickedsDesire


Posts: 9362
Joined: 11/4/2015
Status: offline 		One of you reprobates on here giving me cake would be a gift but there is a bit of cat in me so sometimes it simply tastes more delicious when I steal it

popular platitude we hear in BDSM - not from me its not

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 8:25:11 AM   
Alecta


Posts: 1355
Joined: 1/19/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GBaxter
I know it's a popular platitude we hear in BDSM, but as some female subs can be rather arrogant and condescending about it,
is a female sub, or a female switch's submission really a gift ?


I don't believe in submission being a gift, but then, I'm not a sub/slave.
To me, submission is not a gift, it is a pre-requisite of being a sub/slave. If you don't submit, if you don't give me your submission, you are not my sub/slave, it's that simple.
But the person behind the submission, that could be a gift. And I only say "could be" because I'm a mean bitch with high standards and if you turn out to be a pain in the ass, you're a pain in the ass, not a gift.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 8:34:02 AM   
Greatlilbabygirl


Posts: 786
Joined: 9/9/2016
Status: offline 		I'd like to add I do not see submission as a gift. A gift is largely irrevocable unless you are a jerk that expects gifts to be returned if things go south. If you've given any submission those moments are gone. But submission is an ongoing process. Like I said before, it is revocable. It's not an assumption and if a Dom/me comes at me assuming and demanding my submission before they've gotten to know me and I them, then they are barking up the wrong subby and will get the "arrogance" in return for their asshattery.

(in reply to Alecta)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 8:35:13 AM   
Greatlilbabygirl


Posts: 786
Joined: 9/9/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: WickedsDesire

One of you reprobates on here giving me cake would be a gift but there is a bit of cat in me so sometimes it simply tastes more delicious when I steal it

popular platitude we hear in BDSM - not from me its not

I thought you were more of a muffin guy.

(in reply to WickedsDesire)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 8:40:17 AM   
Alecta


Posts: 1355
Joined: 1/19/2010
Status: offline 		I think the arrogance he means is the "count your lucky stars I'm even remotely considering being your sub" and the "buy me stuff and I'll consider, because I'm such a prize" types.

(in reply to Greatlilbabygirl)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 8:51:07 AM   
ResidentSadist


Posts: 12580
Joined: 2/11/2007
From: a mean old Daddy, but I like you - Joni Mitchell
Status: offline 		Some strange perspectives in this thread.

Unless at gun point or overwhelming threat of force, no one takes anything from anyone without a voluntary choice being made. I may not verbally ask for submission, but you can bet your ass the person I am interacting with has a choice. So no matter how you look at it, submission was granted not taken. That is the reality of it. Now in fantasy role play... that is another ballgame entirely.

As far as the stereotype that runs around spouting "submission is a gift"... I just don't see the world from their point of view. I don't think "respect should be earned" either. Respect and manners should be granted by the grace of your good character and retracted when someone shows they don't respond in kind.

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I give good thread.

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 9:12:53 AM   
Greatlilbabygirl


Posts: 786
Joined: 9/9/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alecta

I think the arrogance he means is the "count your lucky stars I'm even remotely considering being your sub" and the "buy me stuff and I'll consider, because I'm such a prize" types.

Well, they'll get the Doms that kinda attitude deserves. Some guys like that bratty stuff. I don't get it, that crap wears thin pretty quickly in my opinion but those women get what they want so it works for them.

(in reply to Alecta)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 9:18:52 AM   
Greatlilbabygirl


Posts: 786
Joined: 9/9/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ResidentSadist

Some strange perspectives in this thread.

Unless at gun point or overwhelming threat of force, no one takes anything from anyone without a voluntary choice being made. I may not verbally ask for submission, but you can bet your ass the person I am interacting with has a choice. So no matter how you look at it, submission was granted not taken. That is the reality of it. Now in fantasy role play... that is another ballgame entirely.

As far as the stereotype that runs around spouting "submission is a gift"... I just don't see the world from their point of view. I don't think "respect should be earned" either. Respect and manners should be granted by the grace of your good character and retracted when someone shows they don't respond in kind.


Much better put than I could have
Submission is granted just as dominance is. If either is just given willy-nilly to whomever bounces along its not worth anything in my book. Casual bdsm isn't what I'm looking for. It's like casual sex, if it's not taken seriously then it's come and gone in one day or one week, rise, repeat. So a Dom can't be surprised when the sub who just gave her submission so easily jumps into the next one quickly. If a Dom thinks he's special to the fly by night sub he's in for a rude awakening. Happened to my ex Daddy. Took on a new girl 48 hrs after meeting her she's playing, submitting, giving him a key to her apt. Then he acts surprised when she tells him 3 weeks later she's moving back home and it was nice knowing him. Big reason why I lost respect for him and asked to be released. I valued my submission and thought he valued his Dominance but he gave it so easily and quickly to a girl who was obviously playing games and he either didn't care or didn't see it and made a huge mistake.

(in reply to ResidentSadist)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 9:27:41 AM   
WickedsDesire


Posts: 9362
Joined: 11/4/2015
Status: offline 		Greatlilbabygirl I actually got sick of them as I discovered how to make them...but scones I never tire off and delicious doughnuts and ice fruit slices 9do they have those inn america?) (its actually the sponge I like regarding all things cake ) Muffin is a good word to use for analogy - metaphysical malarkey- value worth etc

What is a gift - many ways to answer I liked my original
A 40 foot cock
Life
A sunset
An unexpected complement
To never be truly alone
A purr
A selfless gesture to mum, a friend, a loved one
A good scone recipe - now if I ever get one of those I am leaving the internet

is submission a gift - absolutely not - neither is dominance they are simply states of being a part of the jigsaw that makes us all who we are. Sometimes someone on here makes me think, or causes me to laugh - that is a gift, to me, they are often unaware but I try and thank them for it

(in reply to Greatlilbabygirl)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 9:33:58 AM   
Greta75


Posts: 9968
Joined: 2/6/2011
Status: offline 		I think it is a gift totally.

Not everybody will submit to you, if you know what I mean. When one choose to, it should be special.

I actually don't understand why it's a trend nowadays to make it less than what it is.

Even if a woman was so naturally submissive that she submits to any tom, dick or harry that commands her. She is a gift, because of her natural submissive state. It is rare and not common in a woman.

And I think my submission is a gift as I submit to almost nobody. Most of the time, I have a more alpha demeanor and really, I often feel more dominant than the doms who contact me majority of the time.

So for me to even feel submissive, it's special.

But I have zero interest in topping or dominating so it just annoys me when it naturally starts happening because some dude doesn't feel dominant enough to me to bring up my submissive side.

I mean, it drives me crazy when doms contact me and say, "I know you have your softer side, show me your softer side!"

Like WTF? That is totally gonna get me more aggressive on him!

Finding a man I feel submissive towards is a very peaceful and happy state for me. But I need to feel it.





< Message edited by Greta75 -- 9/29/2016 9:42:33 AM >

(in reply to GBaxter)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 9:48:32 AM   
Alecta


Posts: 1355
Joined: 1/19/2010
Status: offline
quote:

I actually don't understand why it's a trend nowadays to make it less than what it is.


Don't you find it dehumanizing when they value your submission more than they value you?

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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 9:54:36 AM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline 		I don't view it as a gift.

When you give a gift, you give it without expecting something in return. (And does it comes with a gift receipt, so you can return or exchange it if you don't like it or it doesn't fit?)

How many would give the "gift of submission" without getting Dominance in return?

And what about the Dominant? Why isn't his/her Dominance considered a "gift" too? Why is submission the only side that's a gift?

It's relationship. It's a power exchange relationship which means that submission and Dominance are prerequisites. The relationship doesn't exist because I have deigned to be submissive to him. It exists because we fit each other and have come to an agreement about our roles.

_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to Greta75)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 10:00:43 AM   
OsideGirl


Posts: 14441
Joined: 7/1/2005
From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75


Not everybody will submit to you, if you know what I mean. When one choose to, it should be special.






Not everyone will like you....so I guess that's a gift.
Not everyone will love you......so I guess that's a gift.
Not everyone will have sex with you.....so I guess that's a gift.
Not everyone will give you a job....so I guess that's a gift.

Yeah, there's a lot of things that "not everyone will" falls under.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Greta75



I actually don't understand why it's a trend nowadays to make it less than what it is.



25 years ago when I got into this - I can't recall a single person referring to submission as a gift. Then Castlerealm came along and suddenly it was submission gifts and puffy pirate shirts everywhere.

We're not making less than it is....you're making more than it is. It's just a relationship with predefined roles.


_____________________________

Give a girl the right shoes and she will conquer the world. ~ Marilyn Monroe

The Accelerated Velocity of Terminological Inexactitude

(in reply to Greta75)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 10:01:39 AM   
MrRodgers


Posts: 10542
Joined: 7/30/2005
Status: offline 		You are all wrong in your own way. Submission...is inspired.

I managed to enjoy such before these sites, no profiles, email or chat...whatever they are.

In that pre-kinkosphere stratum, it was sexual submission at the start and it had to be, or there was no submission at all.



_____________________________

You can be a murderous tyrant and the world will remember you fondly but fuck one horse and you will be a horse fucker for all eternity. Catherine the Great

Under capitalism, man exploits man. Under communism, it's just the opposite.
J K Galbraith

(in reply to Alecta)
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RE: Is submission really a 'gift' ? - 9/29/2016 10:48:13 AM   
ThatDizzyChick


Posts: 5490
Status: offline 		Yes, it's a gift I give myself.

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Not your average bimbo.

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