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RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 5:30:22 PM   
domiguy


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Joined: 5/2/2006
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This is but another rediculous argument conducted by people who don't possess the ability to learn or listen....You all would be better off shouting at the wind.....

I see people using quotes from sources that all have a huge agenda...Why even include it? It makes you look lazy or unable to identify a credible source....I know this knife cuts both ways...people on both sides are guilty of this tactic.

Wow...

_____________________________



(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 101
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 7:50:12 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sternhand4

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

Don't do the CRIME if you can't do the TIME is all I've got in reply. If Bush, Cheney, Rice et. al. are above the law, what's the point having ANY laws?




Then why did all the dems fall in line during the Clinton impeachment trial? It was clear that he had commited perjury while president, in a deposition, for which he was later disbarred.

Oh I forgot it was a dem..
Only can be "outraged" at the other guys.



No. I'm outraged about Clinton. I'm outraged that the House and Senate didn't have better things to do.

We're not talking about getting your dick sucked, and as Wanda Sykes correctly points out, "The First Lady shouldn't have to suck anyone's dick."

We're talking about 250,000 Dead People.

We're not talking about looting the Enron pension fund, and lying to your shareholders.

We're talking about 250,000 Dead People.

What have YOU done to prevent people from dying TOMORROW because of this fraud?

Because sure as shit, anyone who dies over there tomorrow is our fault. Because we didn't bring them home today.




You are going to charge Bush with the killings of 250,000 people? Unfortunately war doesn't work that way. If it did, shouldn't we have charged Harry Truman with the deaths of 500,000-1,000,000 innocent Japanese that died when he ordered not one but two atomic bombs dropped on Japan?

War is not murder. That's just the reality of it.

Murder is when millions of innocent people are slaughtered in Darfur or Rwanda and the United Nations and the world turns the other way and pretends it doesnt happen. That, my friend, is murder. So don't give me this preaching about how Bush lied and people died crap.

< Message edited by cyberdude611 -- 2/27/2007 7:51:13 PM >

(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 102
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 7:54:31 PM   
Sanity


Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline
Is that the best you can do?

Seems like, if the President really did lie to the Congress, THEY would be the ones who should be upset about it, even more so than you. It must not be that big a deal if Congress doesn't care. Especially now that the Left is in control by a vote or two.

Or maybe you're just exagerating.

Do you have any theories as to why Congress wouldn't care?

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

That would have to presume that Congress actually gave a shit. They don't.


(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 103
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:00:00 PM   
Sternhand4


Posts: 422
Joined: 3/6/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Is that the best you can do?

Seems like, if the President really did lie to the Congress, THEY would be the ones who should be upset about it, even more so than you. It must not be that big a deal if Congress doesn't care. Especially now that the Left is in control by a vote or two.

Or maybe you're just exagerating.

Do you have any theories as to why Congress wouldn't care?

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

That would have to presume that Congress actually gave a shit. They don't.




The left lacks the courage of their convictions. Poll numbers tell them to lay low.

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 104
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:10:30 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

You are going to charge Bush with the killings of 250,000 people? Unfortunately war doesn't work that way. If it did, shouldn't we have charged Harry Truman with the deaths of 500,000-1,000,000 innocent Japanese that died when he ordered not one but two atomic bombs dropped on Japan?

War is not murder. That's just the reality of it.


But Bush's Invasion and Occupation of Iraq IS NOT A WAR. Alberto Gonzales has testified to Congress specifically on the fact that it is NOT A WAR. Since it's not a War, then the WARTIME LAWS don't apply, do they?

And the crime Bush should be charged with is not Murder, but rather Conspiracy to Defraud in violation of 18 USC 371.

Do you have comprehensive replies to the OVERT ACTS identified by sequential letters "A" through "N". That's the best evidence against the Administration, and remember Martha Stewart went to prison for less. Ken Lay was going to prison for less.



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

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Profile   Post #: 105
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:14:12 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Is that the best you can do?

Seems like, if the President really did lie to the Congress, THEY would be the ones who should be upset about it, even more so than you. It must not be that big a deal if Congress doesn't care. Especially now that the Left is in control by a vote or two.

Or maybe you're just exagerating.

Do you have any theories as to why Congress wouldn't care?

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

That would have to presume that Congress actually gave a shit. They don't.




Because if they care, they don't get to stay and profit? They wouldn't have gotten IN unless they were ready to play ball. That's what really gets me about y'all. You BELIEVE it's not as fake as Pro Wrasslin! I mean, really.

Gore lost because it was PLANNED for Gore to lose. Bush won because it was PLANNED for Bush to win.

Substitute the name of your local rep or senator, and there you go.

Maybe you'll get the idea when Vince McMahon becomes President.



< Message edited by farglebargle -- 2/27/2007 8:15:17 PM >


_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to Sanity)
Profile   Post #: 106
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:15:32 PM   
caitlyn


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Joined: 12/22/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: NorthernGent
Caitlyn, we're poles apart. I'm not sure whether your "we run from no one" and lions and food comments are a product of youth or US nationalism. Either way, I'm not impressed.

You say they're not necessarily your opinions, if I'd wanted someone else's I would have asked them.


A very wise college professor taught me to look with a critical eye at those that use youth as a weapon against those they don't agree with.

(in reply to NorthernGent)
Profile   Post #: 107
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:17:22 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sternhand4

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Is that the best you can do?

Seems like, if the President really did lie to the Congress, THEY would be the ones who should be upset about it, even more so than you. It must not be that big a deal if Congress doesn't care. Especially now that the Left is in control by a vote or two.

Or maybe you're just exagerating.

Do you have any theories as to why Congress wouldn't care?

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

That would have to presume that Congress actually gave a shit. They don't.




The left lacks the courage of their convictions. Poll numbers tell them to lay low.


The left lacks the support.

Also, Congress does not have the constitutional power to micromanage war. The Constitution says that the President is the commander-in-chief. In other words, it is the executive branch that determines military strategy...not the congress.

Congress can either support the war or revoke their authorization. They have no authority to tell the President how to conduct the war. That violates the seperation of powers. The problem is that next year is a presidential election year. And many of the presidential candidates voted in favor of the war. So now they want to go on record by voting against the war in order to try to court the anti-war voters.

It's all about politics.

< Message edited by cyberdude611 -- 2/27/2007 8:18:05 PM >

(in reply to Sternhand4)
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RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:21:57 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sanity

Is that the best you can do?

Seems like, if the President really did lie to the Congress, THEY would be the ones who should be upset about it, even more so than you. It must not be that big a deal if Congress doesn't care. Especially now that the Left is in control by a vote or two.

Or maybe you're just exagerating.

Do you have any theories as to why Congress wouldn't care?

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

That would have to presume that Congress actually gave a shit. They don't.




Because if they care, they don't get to stay and profit? They wouldn't have gotten IN unless they were ready to play ball. That's what really gets me about y'all. You BELIEVE it's not as fake as Pro Wrasslin! I mean, really.

Gore lost because it was PLANNED for Gore to lose. Bush won because it was PLANNED for Bush to win.

Substitute the name of your local rep or senator, and there you go.

Maybe you'll get the idea when Vince McMahon becomes President.




No, Bush won because stuck-up senior citizens in Palm Beach County, Florida dont know how to vote in 2000.

As for 2004, John Kerry is a total and complete moron. The Democrats handed that election to Bush by nominating that left-wing elitist fool.

(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 109
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:31:55 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
You just keep grooving to the show, and BELIEVE it's real, if that's what it takes to get through the night...



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to cyberdude611)
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RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:39:32 PM   
cyberdude611


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Joined: 5/7/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

You just keep grooving to the show, and BELIEVE it's real, if that's what it takes to get through the night...




Other than Clinton, name one Democrat candidate over the past 25 years worth voting for... NONE! The Dems keep nominating these elitists or socialists from northern states. And I'm sick and tired of it. I refuse to vote for rich New England elitists that have no idea what is going on in middle or lower classes and have no clue about what the South is about. Other than Clinton, a Democrat has not won a southern state since Jimmy Carter was elected. The Dems are lost.

And now you want me to vote for Hillary? GIVE ME A BREAK! Another northern elitist. It ain't going to happen! And she ain't going to win!

< Message edited by cyberdude611 -- 2/27/2007 8:40:28 PM >

(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:40:57 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:


Other than Clinton, name one Democrat candidate over the past 25 years worth voting for.


You persist in this belief that VOTING actually has any effect. You are incorrect. It doesn't.

In other news. There is NO EASTER BUNNY.



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

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RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:43:12 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

quote:


Other than Clinton, name one Democrat candidate over the past 25 years worth voting for.


You persist in this belief that VOTING actually has any effect. You are incorrect. It doesn't.

In other news. There is NO EASTER BUNNY.




You are under the belief that every election is fixed. I'm telling you right now why it seems that way...because the candidates all suck.

(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 113
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 8:46:07 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
I disagree. I have 20 years background in Financial Auditing and Computer Security.

If it can't be audited, it never happened.

Now, where's the work from these tally's you're saying are legitimate and honest?





_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to cyberdude611)
Profile   Post #: 114
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 9:07:25 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

I disagree. I have 20 years background in Financial Auditing and Computer Security.

If it can't be audited, it never happened.

Now, where's the work from these tally's you're saying are legitimate and honest?



What hasn't been audited?

In Florida right now there is a fight going on with the US House district 13. The Republican Vern Buchanan beat Democrat Christine Jennings by 360 votes. However Jennings is demanding a revote since election machines registered 18,000 undervotes in that district race.
A judge recently ordered for the source code of the machines to be reviewed. Computer science and programming experts from Florida State University looked through the source code and found no irregularities or problems with the code. However, they said that the placement of the race on the ballot may have made it easy for some people to miss it when they were voting. The race was also very ugly with a lot of personal attacks even getting to a point where Christine Jennings made a statement that Buchanan shouldnt be elected because he's a jew. The fighting may have made many people not want to vote for either candidate.
Several independant companies have done audits on the machines and no issues or problems have been found.

Punch card ballots didn't work in 2000. Electronic voting didn't work in 2004 or 2006. Even electronic scanners attracted allegations of fraud because "votes were left on the machine." 
So what method do you want to use?

(in reply to farglebargle)
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RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 9:16:12 PM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle

I disagree. I have 20 years background in Financial Auditing and Computer Security.

If it can't be audited, it never happened.

Now, where's the work from these tally's you're saying are legitimate and honest?



What hasn't been audited?

In Florida right now there is a fight going on with the US House district 13. The Republican Vern Buchanan beat Democrat Christine Jennings by 360 votes. However Jennings is demanding a revote since election machines registered 18,000 undervotes in that district race.
A judge recently ordered for the source code of the machines to be reviewed. Computer science and programming experts from Florida State University looked through the source code and found no irregularities or problems with the code. However, they said that the placement of the race on the ballot may have made it easy for some people to miss it when they were voting. The race was also very ugly with a lot of personal attacks even getting to a point where Christine Jennings made a statement that Buchanan shouldnt be elected because he's a jew. The fighting may have made many people not want to vote for either candidate.
Several independant companies have done audits on the machines and no issues or problems have been found.

Punch card ballots didn't work in 2000. Electronic voting didn't work in 2004 or 2006. Even electronic scanners attracted allegations of fraud because "votes were left on the machine."
So what method do you want to use?



No. You don't understand what I'm saying. EVERY VOTE must be properly accounted for. EVERYWHERE. Like the individual dollars in a bank.

Show all work. No partial credit will be granted.

Your OTB tickets are worth more than your Vote.



_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to cyberdude611)
Profile   Post #: 116
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 9:29:19 PM   
cyberdude611


Posts: 2596
Joined: 5/7/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle
No. You don't understand what I'm saying. EVERY VOTE must be properly accounted for. EVERYWHERE. Like the individual dollars in a bank.

Show all work. No partial credit will be granted.

Your OTB tickets are worth more than your Vote.


But you dont seem to get it. You continuously think the election is a fraud because the vote can't be recounted. In 2000, they were able to recount the votes. The problem is the final count was dependant on HOW you count the votes. Do you count a vote if it is only partially punched? What if someone overvoted? What about pregnant chads?
This is why the Supreme Court steped in. You have 67 counties in Florida counting the votes 67 different ways. There is no way in hell that would be a fair and accurate election no matter how many times you count the votes. And if they try to establish a universal standard, everyone argues over that and gets mad.

My philosophy is that if you can't figure out something as simple as pushing a pin through the right hole, what the hell are you doing voting in the first place?

(in reply to farglebargle)
Profile   Post #: 117
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/27/2007 11:52:45 PM   
meatcleaver


Posts: 9030
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sternhand4

quote:

ORIGINAL: meatcleaver

Chirac said WMDs in Iraq was the stuff of fantasy, an excuse for war and it would only make the situation in the middle east worse.

I think the Americans called him a Cheese eating surrender monkey and the British weren't any kinder but you know what? He was right!


I have read a lot of the hind site reviews for the Iraq war.
There is no doubt that Iraq possed chem/ bio weaponry pre invasion.
There is no doubt that Saddam used theses weapons against Iran and the against the iraqi's themselves.
If the weapons were gone why didn't Saddam allow inspection by the UN or non US aligned country's. Because he was hiding his capability's and his ongoing programs.
Iraq did infact have ties to "terrorists" and al qaeda was one of those groups. http://www.newamericancentury.org/iraq-20040722.htm
Iraq and Saddam as its leader had the money to fund these groups.

After 9-11 the U.S. position was clear .. hide/ fund terrorists and you would answer for it.



Well we all knew Saddam had had chem/bio weapons, who do you think gave them to him...doh! But most had been accounted for by the inspectors (Saddam had actually surrendered them) and the rest were beyond their shelf life.

I wouldn't believe anything I read in The Project For The New American Century, it is a manifesto for American neocons/fascists. The idea Saddam was in leagues with al qeada is the stuff of fantasists.

But now you draw it to my attention, it shows this current administration had plans for Iraq and its oil way before 9/11.

If anyone is guilty of terrorism in this case it was America and poodle Britain.

< Message edited by meatcleaver -- 2/27/2007 11:54:36 PM >


_____________________________

There are fascists who consider themselves humanitarians, like cannibals on a health kick, eating only vegetarians.

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Profile   Post #: 118
RE: Your Taxdollars at Work ( Who needs enemies? ) - 2/28/2007 5:46:38 AM   
farglebargle


Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: cyberdude611

quote:

ORIGINAL: farglebargle
No. You don't understand what I'm saying. EVERY VOTE must be properly accounted for. EVERYWHERE. Like the individual dollars in a bank.

Show all work. No partial credit will be granted.

Your OTB tickets are worth more than your Vote.


But you dont seem to get it. You continuously think the election is a fraud because the vote can't be recounted. In 2000, they were able to recount the votes.


That's totally false. A "RECOUNT" is a narrowly defined legal process. I don't mean "RECOUNT" when I say "AUDIT". I mean "AUDIT". If I MEANT "RECOUNT" I would have SAID recount. I said AUDIT. I mean AUDIT.

Do you balance your checkbook every month? WHY?

quote:


The problem is the final count was dependant on HOW you count the votes.


No. The problem with COUNTING the votes it that the PROCESS is unauditable. That makes it, from an accounting viewpoint, worse than useless.

quote:


Do you count a vote if it is only partially punched?


The question you should have asked is, "In addition to recording the EXISTENCE of the Voter, and the presence of a matching Vote, how do you allocate the various issues with determining the voter's INTENT."

However, since the NUMBER OF PEOPLE VOTING cannot be counted properly, arguing about their INTENT is just "More of the Show". Light, but no heat. A waste of time.


_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to cyberdude611)
Profile   Post #: 119
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