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RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 10:36:21 AM   
Nineveh


Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ThunderRoad

As a Dom, I always respect "hard limits".  However, I do think it's very warranted to discuss WHY it's a hard limit, and not necessarily accept "cuz I don't like it" as an answer. 

It's been my experience that many hard limits are things that are actually a mask for a deeper issue (for example:  "I won't do age-play" when discussed I find out that the person was molested as a child).  This is partially the psychologist and counselor in me (former professional life) and partially because sometimes people project one thing they don't want to deal with on to something only tangentally related.


In my opinon "cuz I don't like it"  is not a sufficient reason for a hard limit.  That would be what dislikes are for, or soft limits.  On the other hand sometimes people don't understand just why they are unwilling to do something or have something done to them and too much talkinga bout it can be traumatic if there is an underlying issue they are not yet ready to face.  I think some hard limits do change and evolve over tyime, but I am not going to view them as a challenge.  If I am interacting with a sub who has a ahrd limit that coincides with something I require I am just going to write her off as the wrong sub for me, possible friend material and move on from there.  Maybe the limit is flexible, but I don't want to start a relationship by pushing her limits.

(in reply to ThunderRoad)
Profile   Post #: 81
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 10:36:33 AM   
xxblushesxx


Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline 		How about this link to Mistress Steel's archives?

Especially beginning with 'hard limits are hard limits...etc'

http://www.steel-door.com/hard_limits.htm

_____________________________

~Christina

A nice girl with a disturbing hobby

My femdom findom blog: http://www.MistressAvarice.com


(in reply to Dnomyar)
Profile   Post #: 82
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 10:37:02 AM   
Justme696


Posts: 3236
Joined: 1/7/2008
From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dnomyar

I can see that this post came apart. So someone answer my question. OP you posted the word . What does it mean.



quote:

Pronunciation [edit] Adjective pedantic (comparative more pedantic, superlative most pedantic) Positive
pedantic
Comparative
more pedantic
Superlative
most pedantic
  1. Like a pedant, overly concerned with formal rules and trivial points of learning.
    • Winston Churchill, (On being informed that one should not end a sentence with a preposition.) That is the sort of arrant pedantry up with which I will not put.

  2. Being showy of one’s knowledge, often in a boring manner.
  3. Often used to describe a person who emphasizes his/her knowledge through the use of vocabulary; ostentatious in one’s learning.
  4. Being finicky or picky with language.
  5. Obsessive insistence or sureness that things or persons will or do conform to words exactly as they have been written.
[edit] Synonyms


_____________________________

~Been there, done that, got the t-shirt

(in reply to Dnomyar)
Profile   Post #: 83
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 10:44:19 AM   
xxblushesxx


Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Nineveh
In my opinon "cuz I don't like it"  is not a sufficient reason for a hard limit. 


The reasons are not always there for you to know. The only thing a potential dom(me) has to know is that they ARE there.

_____________________________

~Christina

A nice girl with a disturbing hobby

My femdom findom blog: http://www.MistressAvarice.com


(in reply to Nineveh)
Profile   Post #: 84
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 10:50:29 AM   
Jeffff


Posts: 12600
Joined: 7/7/2007
Status: offline 		Who needs a hug?

I am fully clothed and wearing a condom!!

SensitiveDom

(in reply to xxblushesxx)
Profile   Post #: 85
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 10:52:37 AM   
xxblushesxx


Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline 		*lol*

Take off the clothes and we'll talk...

_____________________________

~Christina

A nice girl with a disturbing hobby

My femdom findom blog: http://www.MistressAvarice.com


(in reply to Jeffff)
Profile   Post #: 86
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 10:53:16 AM   
OmegaG


Posts: 1474
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nineveh
In my opinon "cuz I don't like it"  is not a sufficient reason for a hard limit. 


The reasons are not always there for you to know. The only thing a potential dom(me) has to know is that they ARE there.


I think that depending on where the progression is with the potential dom that just saying "because I say so" kills a wonderful oppurtunity for getting to know each other better.

m'Lord and I had several lenghty conversations about limits, preferences, dislikes and willingness to try.  It was a back and forth, I learned how compassionate he is and how willing he is to understand why I thought the way I did about activities and I got to learn what his likes and dislikes were.  We got to find out not only how compatible we were with the activities themselves, but how compatible we were on an exploratory and ethical level.

I certianly couldn't imagine just saying I have X limit because I say so, especially to him.  I have some quasi-hard limits that as our relationship progresses I may reconcider, but he also knows that there is a lot of responsibility on his part if we engage in these activities.

_____________________________


Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable. Sydney J. Harris

Sex without pain is like food without taste.
- de Sade

(in reply to xxblushesxx)
Profile   Post #: 87
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 10:55:49 AM   
Nineveh


Posts: 1299
Joined: 2/5/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: xxblushesxx

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nineveh
In my opinon "cuz I don't like it"  is not a sufficient reason for a hard limit. 


The reasons are not always there for you to know. The only thing a potential dom(me) has to know is that they ARE there.


That is part of the point I was making. 

(in reply to xxblushesxx)
Profile   Post #: 88
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 10:56:16 AM   
xxblushesxx


Posts: 9318
Joined: 11/3/2005
From: Kentucky
Status: offline 		I agree, Omega, that is why I said a 'potential' dom.
A 'potential' dom just really needs to respect limits as what they are.
As time goes in, they become closer, the sub trusts his/her dom more, THEN we can consider why they are there...

_____________________________

~Christina

A nice girl with a disturbing hobby

My femdom findom blog: http://www.MistressAvarice.com


(in reply to OmegaG)
Profile   Post #: 89
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 11:00:42 AM   
OmegaG


Posts: 1474
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline 		well, we were potentials when we had that conversation, but quite a bit further in the journey then exchanging photos.

_____________________________


Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable. Sydney J. Harris

Sex without pain is like food without taste.
- de Sade

(in reply to xxblushesxx)
Profile   Post #: 90
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 11:06:23 AM   
GrizzlyBear


Posts: 278
Joined: 3/26/2004
From: Missoula Montana
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ruthiexxxx

from what i've read about BDSM i got the impression that it was a very responsible movement with a great emphasis on safety and consideration   So why is it so bloody hard to have Doms repect 'hard limits'?!  ...



It seems to me that you have confused being a "Dom" with being a "rude asshole".  (So, BTW, have they...)  The two are definitely different.  There is more to being Dominant than just declaring it, and chasing after subbies.

When you run across these rude assholes just block and ignore them.  When you do run across a Dom, you will see the difference.


_____________________________

GrizzlyBear

"Come to the edge," he said.
They said, "We are afraid."
"Come to the edge," he said.
They came. He pushed them. And they flew.
~Guillaume Apollinaire

(in reply to ruthiexxxx)
Profile   Post #: 91
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 11:09:33 AM   
SubbieOnWheels


Posts: 590
Joined: 12/14/2007
Status: offline 		Addressing the OP's concerns as she has amplified them (at least as I understand them):

The hard limit of requiring a condom/practicing safe sex does not need to be negotiated. You can feel good about saying "my way or the highway." This is your health you're talking about, and - NO - you don't have to accede to his request or demand to "trust him" on this. The way things are in the world today, anyone would be less than wise to give in on this limit.

As for the compromising pictures - if you are uncomfortable sharing them with someone you have not been intimate with, that's your prerogative. If you have not decided to be his slave, you have the right to set boundaries, even if you are submitting to him in some respects. Don't give in to a smooth soft voice telling you that he knows you better than you know yourself. That's utter BS, and any man that tries that on me now (yes, it worked once or twice, but not any more) will get a right load of attitude.

It frequently happens that the Domly-type in question tries to throw my attitude back in my face. It doesn't make me feel bad or down on myself or that I've been "un-subly" - it just makes me feel like the Smart-As Masochist I proudly admit to being. The Italians have a lovely gesture for men like that.


_____________________________

Bethical
Beat me, strike me, take away my reindeer! I'll never tell! -- Walt Kelly, Pogo Possum
I yam what I yam - Popeye

http://www.myspace.com/bethical_wheels


(in reply to OmegaG)
Profile   Post #: 92
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 11:27:54 AM   
joy2u


Posts: 89
Joined: 2/2/2008
Status: offline
Just because "safety and consideration" might be advocated, within BDSM circles, doesn't mean that everyone agrees to what "safety and consideration" means or that everyone who practices BDSM is responsible or agrees with being "safe and considerate".  That's why you need to decide for yourself what you will and will not do to or for or with someone else and make that very clear from the start.  If someone tells you or asks you to do something that violates your principles then you have the right to refuse. 
 
BDSM isn't about "having" to do anything.  It's about choosing to do what you want to do.  If you want to be in a relationship where you are told what to do and you have to do it, that's your choice.  But, there are no shortcuts, in BDSM, to having that sort of relationship with someone.  You still need to get to know them and find out if what they are looking for within a relationship with you is compatible with what you're looking for.  If they aren't willing to take the time and energy required to get to know you well enough to reach that sort of understanding then, let them know that and move on.  Delete, Block, Ignore, etc. all work very well on this site.

Good luck in finding what you're looking for.  While there are jerks everywhere, there are many fine men on this site who are serious about wanting a healthy and mutually-satisfying D/s or M/s relationship and they are worth the time and energy to get to know.
 
joy
Owned servant of Master David

(in reply to ruthiexxxx)
Profile   Post #: 93
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 11:33:20 AM   
Dnomyar


Posts: 7933
Joined: 6/27/2005
Status: offline 		TY Damien

(in reply to joy2u)
Profile   Post #: 94
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 12:02:22 PM   
Justme696


Posts: 3236
Joined: 1/7/2008
From: Royal kingdom of the Netherlands
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dnomyar

TY Damien


yvw love


_____________________________

~Been there, done that, got the t-shirt

(in reply to Dnomyar)
Profile   Post #: 95
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 12:12:34 PM   
swtnsparkling


Posts: 1738
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

Taboo4two
Limits don't apply until both sides have agreed to them.


This I don't agree with. If were talking about HARD Limits, then I make my own and I don't need anyone to agree with them. They are mine and No one No Time No Way is going to change them. I don't have many at all but the few I do. Are cemented.

As for everything else, I'm open to try/explore/have pushed. Over the years no matter how nervous/scared I was or how much I was sure I couldn't do some thing I still had a need to find out for myself before I could honestly say no I cannot do this. After all how was I to know if I'd never experienced it.

I've found I love Breath-Fire-Abrasion-Knife and so on. Other than those few Hard Limits I've set -I have tried most everything  and found, yes I do enjoy it all.

< Message edited by swtnsparkling -- 2/26/2008 12:19:01 PM >

_____________________________

Never make anyone a priority who treats you as an option 2003

Walk in Peace
A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better than a "Yes" uttered merely to please



(in reply to Taboo4Two)
Profile   Post #: 96
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 12:23:34 PM   
SubbieOnWheels


Posts: 590
Joined: 12/14/2007
Status: offline 		You know, I went from reading this thread to reading my cmail. i had been corresponding with a Dom who is outside my area, even though I'd prefer not to relocate. He asked me how I lost my leg, and I told him. His response: "Unfortunate. Do you have any nude pics?" Exactly like that - no paragraph break or anything like it.

After donning my neck brace for the whiplash (abrupt change of subject without signalling will do that to me), I told him the pics on my profile (more risque than I am accustomed to publishing)  will have to satisfy him for now. That is one of my hard limits in beginning a relationship.

I haven't heard back from him yet, and I may never hear from him again. C'est la vie. If he wants to be snippy or snarky about my limits, it's no skin off my nose.

_____________________________

Bethical
Beat me, strike me, take away my reindeer! I'll never tell! -- Walt Kelly, Pogo Possum
I yam what I yam - Popeye

http://www.myspace.com/bethical_wheels


(in reply to swtnsparkling)
Profile   Post #: 97
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 12:26:30 PM   
swtnsparkling


Posts: 1738
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

Jefff
Who needs a hug?

I am fully clothed and wearing a condom!!

SensitiveDom


L M B O!!   

_____________________________

Never make anyone a priority who treats you as an option 2003

Walk in Peace
A "No" uttered from deepest conviction is better than a "Yes" uttered merely to please



(in reply to Jeffff)
Profile   Post #: 98
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 12:39:23 PM   
SailingBum


Posts: 3225
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Sailin the stormy sea
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: CalifChick

Now I'm confuzzled.

Cali



Confused don't be another episode after this announcement!

BadOne

_____________________________

The beatings will continue until morale improves.

According to SwithNSpanky
We are all so very lucky to have you with us to impart your great wisdom.

(in reply to CalifChick)
Profile   Post #: 99
RE: 'hard limits?' - 2/26/2008 12:42:30 PM   
BitaTruble


Posts: 9779
Joined: 1/12/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: swtnsparkling

quote:

Taboo4two
Limits don't apply until both sides have agreed to them.


This I don't agree with. If were talking about HARD Limits, then I make my own and I don't need anyone to agree with them. They are mine and No one No Time No Way is going to change them. I don't have many at all but the few I do. Are cemented.



I agree 100%. Hard limits need neither be compromised nor discussed. "Because I don't like it" is a perfectly valid 'reason' to have one in place and, as far as I'm concerned, is 'nuff said on the issue.

I had a submissive male contact me and explain that while needles were a hard limit for him, he'd enjoy belonging to me as long as I didn't go there. I explained that having a play partner who had needle play as a hard limit was a hard limit for me. He didn't understand why I wouldn't compromise and got a bit ticked about the whole thing. I tried explaining to him that we just weren't compatible and ended up having to cut off communication because of his inability to respect that 'my' hard limit was just as valid as his own. My reason for my hard limit? I like needle play. Of all the activities available in SM it's my favorite so my reason is 'because I like it'. Because I don't like it is just as valid a reason.

Celeste

_____________________________

"Oh, so it's just like
Rock, paper, scissors."

He laughed. "You are the wisest woman I know."


(in reply to swtnsparkling)
Profile   Post #: 100
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