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RE: The slap of reality - 3/7/2008 6:14:24 PM

SinergyNstrumpet

Posts: 305
Joined: 2/26/2008
Status: offline

quote:

You don't have these attitudes. But there are those who do. It is the right of anyone who is contemplating a relationship to be aware of the pitfalls of relationships and to make certain that they avoid those pitfalls. Each person has his or her own way of avoiding them, and Lady Hathor's way obviously rubs some people the wrong way. That doesn't say anyone is shallow; it just says that you and Lady Hathor would not be a good match. Besides, I didn't see any amounts being discussed - she just asks that the person have their finances in order.

Lady Hathor's way does not rub me the wrong way. I sincerely do not care what criteria other people choose mates with. What I do take a small issue with is the wording of the OP that if one does not view it her way they are not living in "reality". I addressed this and she later posted an amendment to her original OP to state she was speaking for herself only. After that I was not really addressing her at all.

I suppose I view the term responsibility differently from you. I do not judge people as irresponsible because they have a different path than my own. I hear this word "responsible" over and over and over again, what exactly do you mean by that? If others have had a hard path to go because of a bad decision it does not make them the label "irresponsible", it makes their judgment flawed in one particular instance. It does not mean that forever more that their lives will be a trainwreck because they married young, had a bankruptcy due to job loss, or lost their insurance because they came down with a very bad disease. It means they are human. Just because someone does not meet some random list or criteria of someone at any given time does not mean they are wholly irresponsible. To judge someone out of hand like that is indeed a choice a lot of people make... it isn't one I made, like i said, happily so.

I

(in reply to SubbieOnWheels)

Post #: 101

RE: The slap of reality - 3/7/2008 6:15:38 PM

Leatherist

Posts: 5149
Joined: 12/11/2007
Status: offline

I think people need to be responsible for themselves. No one else can really be trusted to do it for you-no matter what they may say.

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I'm not taking custom orders.

(in reply to SinergyNstrumpet)

Post #: 102

RE: The slap of reality - 3/7/2008 6:18:43 PM

SinergyNstrumpet

Posts: 305
Joined: 2/26/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Leatherist

I think people need to be responsible for themselves. No one else can really be trusted to do it for you-no matter what they may say.

For my life, I agree with you. I need to be responsible for me to a great extent. It does not mean that we cannot pick each other up once in a while... people do that for each other. But I do not agree that all people all the time everywhere can't have a relationship in which one person works and the other takes care of the home... many relationships work very well under such circumstance... and guess what? They can last a lifetime.

(in reply to Leatherist)

Post #: 103

RE: The slap of reality - 3/8/2008 2:30:49 AM

edgepassion

Posts: 67
Joined: 2/20/2008
Status: offline

I’d love for my partner / Domme to bring all that to the relationship but....
My reality:
if there’s chemistry, passion, love…..hell, we’ll work on the rest.

(in reply to SinergyNstrumpet)

Post #: 104

RE: The slap of reality - 3/8/2008 9:31:23 AM

SugarMyChurro

Posts: 1912
Joined: 4/26/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHathor
8. you will sign a prenup if it comes to that as my estate goes to my UM.

I should probably let this thread die, but I wanted to return to highlight two things about the above quote:

1. The OP is extremely specific about finances not mixing with this part. The idea of the prenup can certainly mean many things, but I think at its core it means financial independence for each party - whatever that means for each of them specifically. So why worry about the rest? It just got taken care of by contract. Your stuff is secured.

2. I don't know what the estate may consist of, but let's assume for our purposes it's just a home. So the OP and her partner/sub/slave have been living there together for 20 years. Upon her death the estate goes to her UM. Interesting turn of events in my view, and not quite how I'd treat a long-term partner either. That's two problems for the prospective partner to deal with at once: the death of a respected/loved one, and finding a new place to call home. The prospective partner is now persona non grata in the place they called home for the last 20 years.

Uh huh...

Here's a kicker: you get back what you give. And people wonder why they may be alone.

Herd them cats! Yeehaw!

(in reply to LadyHathor)

Post #: 105

RE: The slap of reality - 3/8/2008 11:45:15 AM

Firegoddez

Posts: 9
Joined: 9/4/2007
Status: offline

As much as having the things you listed are very well and good, I think it's all subjective. I relocated for Master and while I am working out finding a job and such things he is taking care of the bills. It was my choice to move so I paid for those costs, but everything else He has paid for. We had a long talk about me moving and why he didn't come to me and things of that nature. It's all about talking and communicating your expectations. I don't expect him to take care of the pet deposit on MY dog living in HIS apartment. He gladly offered but I feel that's too much. It's a compromise. Some things I was told He was paying for and some things He offers. I do not expect that, but it was a pleasant surprise.

(in reply to SubbieOnWheels)

Post #: 106

RE: The slap of reality - 3/8/2008 11:58:15 AM

Firegoddez

Posts: 9
Joined: 9/4/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: SubbieOnWheels

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania
how can someone take what is yours?

"Oh, gosh, Mistress, I just don't have my share of the household expenses this month. Please don't put me out. I can't get a lease cos my credit is too bad."

"Well, I'm sorry, but I'm gonna have to be late on my rent this month cos I have to get my car out of the impound lot - too many tickets."

Need more?

quote:

Perhaps I am wrong about this,but when I read people talking about how "indepedent" economically they are, and then they turn around and demand someone have similar economic status as they do, it comes off a bit strange sounding to me... why does it matter what someone else has as long as you already got yours? If they are not asking you for anything, what does it matter?

"Gee, Mistress, how come I have to pay anything for household expenses? Aren't I your property? Don't you have the responsibility for keeping me in food, housing, ciggies, gas, and all that?"

"Why should I have to pay that much? You make more money than I do, and you own this house. I'm serving you - you owe me."

You don't have these attitudes. But there are those who do. It is the right of anyone who is contemplating a relationship to be aware of the pitfalls of relationships and to make certain that they avoid those pitfalls. Each person has his or her own way of avoiding them, and Lady Hathor's way obviously rubs some people the wrong way. That doesn't say anyone is shallow; it just says that you and Lady Hathor would not be a good match. Besides, I didn't see any amounts being discussed - she just asks that the person have their finances in order.

But honestly before you move to be with someone or have someone move in to your home, don't you think you should have a conversation about these expectations. Or even before entering into the type of relationship where you are sharing expenses like that. It only takes a simple conversation. Communication.

(in reply to SubbieOnWheels)

Post #: 107

RE: The slap of reality - 3/8/2008 1:41:02 PM

Sundowner

Posts: 2549
Joined: 3/11/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: CalifChick

Well I'm not a male sub, but I would fail on the healthcare issue.
... lots of bits removed
Those things add up to "uninsurable."
Cali

Awww. But what's left is still cute Cali.

(And did you like the clever pun? Please say you liked the pun).

Sorry to go off topic for a mo, but that was irresistable.

(in reply to CalifChick)

Post #: 108

RE: The slap of reality - 3/8/2008 2:04:04 PM

toldimawesome

Posts: 11
Joined: 11/25/2007
Status: offline

Without being able to read the original 'Lady Hathores' text, I am at a slight loss to respond to this... but what intrigued me were the examples you gave for someone labeling another as being 'irresponsible' ... one being ignorant, or not thinking ahead of a situation that comes up, or one that hopes for the best in a sticky situation needing to make an alternative choice in life, is by no means criteria for the heading of being labeled 'irrisponsible', or 'unresponsible' which the latter usually describes one that can't be responsible, either for mentally challanged issues, too young, just doesn't have the logic thinking in place... I think of one that is careless, or lazy as being irrisponsible, choosing to be irrisponsible, now that person would fall under the label, don't you agree?.... Thanks, this was just a thought that peaked my interests reading from your entry and this topic?....

(in reply to SinergyNstrumpet)

Post #: 109

RE: The slap of reality - 3/8/2008 3:20:16 PM

ELUSIVE1

Posts: 536
Joined: 9/11/2005
Status: offline

I am having issues with some of the things on your list even now---I have been self sufficient for years, and plan to continue to be so, however 'Daddy' wants me to drop everything and travel with him.(7 days in Cabos San Lucas for my b-day)..as much fun as that sounds, the reality is if I want to keep my income coming in I will not miss so many days, 4 or 5 day weekends once or twice a month...and I don't see me not working...ho hum..

_____________________________

"Words have no power to impress the mind without the exquisite horror of their reality"

*Poe
http://alt.com/blog/ELUSIVE1NC
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(in reply to SubbieOnWheels)

Post #: 110

RE: The slap of reality - 3/8/2008 5:33:32 PM

SinergyNstrumpet

Posts: 305
Joined: 2/26/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Firegoddez

quote:

ORIGINAL: SubbieOnWheels

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania
how can someone take what is yours?

"Oh, gosh, Mistress, I just don't have my share of the household expenses this month. Please don't put me out. I can't get a lease cos my credit is too bad."

"Well, I'm sorry, but I'm gonna have to be late on my rent this month cos I have to get my car out of the impound lot - too many tickets."

Need more?

quote:

Perhaps I am wrong about this,but when I read people talking about how "indepedent" economically they are, and then they turn around and demand someone have similar economic status as they do, it comes off a bit strange sounding to me... why does it matter what someone else has as long as you already got yours? If they are not asking you for anything, what does it matter?

"Gee, Mistress, how come I have to pay anything for household expenses? Aren't I your property? Don't you have the responsibility for keeping me in food, housing, ciggies, gas, and all that?"

"Why should I have to pay that much? You make more money than I do, and you own this house. I'm serving you - you owe me."

You don't have these attitudes. But there are those who do. It is the right of anyone who is contemplating a relationship to be aware of the pitfalls of relationships and to make certain that they avoid those pitfalls. Each person has his or her own way of avoiding them, and Lady Hathor's way obviously rubs some people the wrong way. That doesn't say anyone is shallow; it just says that you and Lady Hathor would not be a good match. Besides, I didn't see any amounts being discussed - she just asks that the person have their finances in order.

But honestly before you move to be with someone or have someone move in to your home, don't you think you should have a conversation about these expectations. Or even before entering into the type of relationship where you are sharing expenses like that. It only takes a simple conversation. Communication.

I suppose this is the issue, when I first start a relationship with someone, sharing expenses and playing house are not expected by me. I just want to have fun with that person and get to know them over time and see what they are like. Having conversations like these just make me cringe when one is just getting to know a person... but that is just me

(in reply to Firegoddez)

Post #: 111

RE: The slap of reality - 3/8/2008 7:11:30 PM

stella41b

Posts: 4258
Joined: 10/16/2007
From: SW London (UK)
Status: offline

I'm sorry but I have to come back in on this.

I see this all the time, not just Lady Hathor. Go browse through the profiles and read them for yourselves.

This is a list of demands and additional conditions about what they want and expect from other person.

This isn't starting a relationship, it's got nothing to do with domination, submission, love or whatever.

If you're imposing requirements for a person you would like to find and meet then you're not starting a relationship at all. You're hiring someone or buying a product. It's exactly the same thing. It's got nothing to do with the reality of starting a relationship. Nothing at all. If you think it has, then I'm sorry, you don't have a clue about relationships.

Starting a relationship is a pretty straightforward and simple process. You put up a profile, you get a response, and you check that person out and give them a chance until you hit a red flag. You start out with simple communication, find out more about each other, learn to accept someone, get to know them, develop trust, friendship, and then it all develops.

If you're not interested, then say so. If someone's not interested in you then accept this and move on. You can only start a relationship with someone if they're as interested in you as you are in them. No need for mind games.

Relationships are developed, they grow, it takes hard work, it takes commitment, it takes sacrifice.

It's like these Dommes who come out with the statement 'This is all about ME'. This is just as ridiculous as the 'submission is a gift' argument. Complete and utter rubbish. Neither of these attitudes have got anything to do with either domination or submission, but they're both about the same thing - selfishness.

This might be a hard concept to swallow for some people, but self-interest is quite incompatible with the essential nature of a relationship between a Dominant and a submissive.

I personally feel that some people might achieve more success if they forget about the labels, the fantasies, the photoimage perfect photos, the material status, the social position, and in fact the whole BDSM thing altogether and just started out by trying to get to know the person who they're dealing with and showing themselves as a person, a fellow human being and just started out as friendship.

Please don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong in having a preconceived laundry list of requirements and expectations - when you're buying a car, a computer, hiring a domestic cleaner, looking for a job, looking for something on e-Bay or doing your shopping at Wal-Mart but surely not when you're looking for someone with whom you're hoping to share the rest of your life with.

Not unless you really want to end up disappointed and heartbroken later on.

_____________________________

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(in reply to ELUSIVE1)

Post #: 112

RE: The slap of reality - 3/8/2008 9:22:14 PM

StormsSlave

Posts: 629
Joined: 2/6/2008
Status: offline

With respect to everyone's opinions, I understand what Lady Hathor understands. Life is harsh. Finances are absolute. I've been ruined by having the wrong person in my life. Financially, I'm tens-of-thousands in dollars in debt, my fault because I trusted the wrong person. I was once paying my bills on time and had no debt. I was free and clear.

Once the relationship matures and develops, the lines between things begin to blur, and move, and life begins to blend, but there's nothing good in being solvent, and having someone in your life who will negatively influence that. It's important to protect yourself until you're sure the trust is not going to be broken.

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(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 113

RE: The slap of reality - 3/10/2008 7:58:42 AM

LadyHathor

Posts: 775
Joined: 1/2/2008
Status: offline

stella41b:

quote:

Please don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong in having a preconceived laundry list of requirements and expectations - when you're buying a car, a computer, hiring a domestic cleaner, looking for a job, looking for something on e-Bay or doing your shopping at Wal-Mart but surely not when you're looking for someone with whom you're hoping to share the rest of your life with.

Not unless you really want to end up disappointed and heartbroken later on.

wow, I've been off for a few days due to a bad hit to a substation in My area and no connectivity---this has some very very good debate---and I hope this lasts for those new to this lifestyle to ponder and think about--

all very good ideas--and stella. you are quite right--it isnt buying a car, its a person--a relationship--however, love does not put food on the table, nor keep the bill collectors away---and for those that have peaked at My profile--I am not 20 something, so if I faced financial ruin, it would be devastating at this time of My life---but that is for Me--

and this thread has accomplished what I hoped much much debate--and healthy debate as well--with many perspectives on reality.

_____________________________

Lady Hathor, I am the Mistress Hathor of Orleans, I am what I am, often to the dismay and discomfort of others.

(in reply to stella41b)

Post #: 114

RE: The slap of reality - 3/19/2008 8:34:36 AM

UncleNasty

Posts: 1108
Joined: 3/20/2004
Status: offline

This is refreshing. To see people discussing how it fits in with reality. I've just recently come to the forums, though I've been on the site for almost 4 years. Now I'm wondering why I hadn't done it earlier. Most that post seem to be much better grounded in reality than them that don't, at least in my experience.

Uncle Nasty

(in reply to SubbieOnWheels)

Post #: 115

RE: The slap of reality - 3/19/2008 10:24:47 AM

LadyPact

Posts: 32566
Status: offline

I've been waiting to come back to this thread when I had the time necessary to contribute a decent reply. With My schedule, that isn't always possible.

If you've ever visited Lady H's profile, which I just went back to, you might have a clue of why she has these things clearly defined. It makes perfect sense to Me. It isn't really that hard to figure out. Maybe not everyone can read between the lines, but I'm not taking the liberty of spelling it out.

I'm not quite as specific as Lady H is in her financial requirements, but then again, I've never had to be. My experiences have been different than hers, though I certainly understand the mindset.

I think one thing she is trying to express is that, it really isn't that different on this side as a Domme, as it would be for a Dom. There are subs out there (and this isn't meaning to offend anyone) who are more than willing to suck you dry financially, if you let them. Having this list in place is a way to prevent that. It shows up front that she is not willing to be the lifeline of support, at least in a monetary sense. This isn't exactly the 50's, where one source of income being sufficiant applies to everyone. It's more common than not to have more than one person contributing to the household with more than doing the dishes, or kissing someone's feet when they come home. I can tell you straight out that I wouldn't want a sub who couldn't be financially responsible for themselves, and instead chose to rely on Me for his well being. To Me, it's just a variation of the 'life support for a whip' mentality. It just changes to 'life support for a wallet'.

_____________________________

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Beach Ball Sized Lady Nuts. ~ TWD

Happily dating a new submissive. It's official. I've named him engie.

Please do not send me email here. Unless I know you, I will delete the email unread

(in reply to UncleNasty)

Post #: 116

RE: The slap of reality - 3/19/2008 11:01:22 AM

daddyncherry

Posts: 656
Joined: 10/9/2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: flower2007

quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyHathor
SO reality shatter the fantasy a tad?

Thoughts?

Thoughts? I'm offended just reading it. Why on earth would you assume someone DIDN'T have their finances together? None of those things are even on my radar screen, because they're non-issues. Why wouldn't I be debt free? Why wouldn't I pay my taxes? Why wouldn't I maintain my car as legally required?

I think it's odd you seem to assume a submissive doesn't do all of that to begin with. And that you assume she/he smokes, drinks, and has an arrest/citation record. Really, really odd. I'd be beyond offended that anyone would think that little of me and walk right away from anyone who gave me a list like that.

Maybe I'd just walk away because it shows a definite disparity in how I live my life compared to his.

i don't necessarily ascribe to what Lady Hathor's list consists of, and am glad that my Daddy didn't have something like it cause i woulda failed on quite a few of those counts BUT....it IS HER list of who she seeks.

That being said, i think it is very odd that you took it the way you did.

If i made a list that said i want a
*Dominant male,
(with long brown hair,
*a big penis,
*spiritually inclined,
*of Danish decent,
*green eyes
*tall
*smokes cigars
*clean and sober
* Daddyish but firm
* Responsible
* loves cats
blah blah

THAT LIST makes ZERO ASSUMPTIONS about anyone who is reading it...it is what i personally want (have)

It in no way implies that the reader is NOT a male, or dominant, or Danish. It in NO WAY implies that they are a short in stature, brown eyed, female who hates cats, is an irresponsible, blonde,alcoholic, non-smoking, short haired atheist with a little tiny penis/clit.

Her list explains what she wants and expects out of her partner and if someone doesn't fit that bill, then they won't waste her time or theirs.

Edited to add: In looking back at Lady Hathor's list, i had/have NOTHING on her list except for the whole arrest thing, cause i've never even had a ticket for a seabelt fine.....other than that i'd be TOTALLY out!...Damn good thing my Daddy didn't care about that kind of stuff when he took me..his list was much different and luckily, i fit HIS PERSONAL list pretty nicely.

< Message edited by daddyncherry -- 3/19/2008 11:07:06 AM >

_____________________________

Hugs,
cherry

Walking through life, and fear with a smile on my face.
Walking directly through the eye of the hurricane...and through to the other side..without fear....realizing everything will be okay. :)

being obedient 1day at a time

(in reply to flower2007)

Post #: 117

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