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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 2:22:08 PM   
DarlingSavage


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quote:

Lenin was a self-proclaimed Marxist who dealt with dissenters in a fairly brutal manner (1919-1921). And he was convinced that a revolution was the preserve of a small group of committed people - not the masses. You take power through coercion; you have to maintain power through coercion.


Name your source, that's not what I've read.

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 2:25:33 PM   
NorthernGent


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quote:

ORIGINAL: DarlingSavage

quote:

Lenin was a self-proclaimed Marxist who dealt with dissenters in a fairly brutal manner (1919-1921). And he was convinced that a revolution was the preserve of a small group of committed people - not the masses. You take power through coercion; you have to maintain power through coercion.


Name your source, that's not what I've read.



lol...name your fucking source?! Do me a favour.

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 2:31:50 PM   
servantforuse


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Status: offline 		I think that subfever and Brain would both be happy in Cuba. There is no capitalisim there, the government makes all of the decisions for you and according to Michael Moore, they have better health care facilities than here in the states..I think you should move there.

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 2:49:02 PM   
NorthernGent


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Status: offline 		'It is impossible to maintain discipline without a revolver' - Trotsky.

'Shoot conspirators and waverers without asking anyone or any idiotic red-tape' - Lenin.

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 2:56:19 PM   
subfever


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quote:

You take power through coercion; you have to maintain power through coercion.


Gandhi didn't think so.

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:03:52 PM   
subfever


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I think that subfever and Brain would both be happy in Cuba. There is no capitalisim there, the government makes all of the decisions for you and according to Michael Moore, they have better health care facilities than here in the states..I think you should move there.


And leave all my loved ones behind? Nah... it's better to deprogram the years of indoctrination of the people right here, and start a grassroots effort towards a resource-based economy. Can I count on your support? ... ;-)

Of course, I only speak for myself here. From what I've seen so far, Brain and I aren't even close to being on the same page.

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:07:34 PM   
Moonhead


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quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I think that subfever and Brain would both be happy in Cuba. There is no capitalisim there, the government makes all of the decisions for you and according to Michael Moore, they have better health care facilities than here in the states..I think you should move there.

There's a lot of people besides Michael "factchecker" Moore who say that, sadly. It's pretty well documented.
(Mind you, Mexico has a better healthcare system than the States as well, doesn't it?)

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:14:37 PM   
MrRodgers


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quote:

ORIGINAL: karina18

Funny thing, we haven't had a free market since 1929.  We are defined as a "mixed market".  Blame all you want on capitalism, just remember all levels of government consumes over 40% of GDP.  Perhaps some of the economic problems stem from bad government?

Capitalism is alive and well. It is as strong as it ever was. Why ?

Unemployment...don't care.
Value of our currency...don't care.
Country...don't care.
Debt...they own it and don't care as long as labor pays the debt service.
Stay too big to fail...socialists only when there are losses.
Thus we have...socialism for the rich and
capitalism for the poor, who are not only not to big to fail, but will work themselves to death making sure the capitalist remains...to big to fail. The worker and the country could be dying a slow death ...capitalism has never been richer.

Profits for the big corps. are rolling in. Capitalism is still turning their paper into...your money and when that paper belongs on a roll in your bathroom, the capitalist quickly becomes a socialist running to Wash., with their hand out for multi-$trillion welfare and they got it.

You don't get it...you pay it.

So you see, the capitalist couldn't be happier, just a whole lot richer yet...they soon will be too.That's whether they have to turn socialist again and will, when their latest financial derivatives (est. $300 TRILLION) turn to shit and come to Wash. for more welfare or they somehow continue their Ponzi.

Careful here kinkroids...don't be the last buyer.

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:23:41 PM   
LadyEllen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever

quote:

You take power through coercion; you have to maintain power through coercion.


Gandhi didn't think so.


Yes, but Gandhi only got away with it because the UK was broke after fighting WWII, and the British ruling classes had become too liberal to go in for violent suppression of a mass revolt.

E

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:28:32 PM   
subfever


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quote:

Careful here kinkroids...don't be the last buyer.


The masses don't seem to understand that when the big boys roll the dice and win, they keep the profits. When they roll the dice and lose, they turn into the biggest socialists on the planet.

Yet... this is the system the indoctrinated masses endear themselves to, and blindly defend.

Can anyone say "Kiss the hand that enslaves you?"

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:33:02 PM   
Moonhead


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Status: offline 		Wasn't that Trent Reznor?

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:46:26 PM   
subfever


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

Wasn't that Trent Reznor?


He didn't match the quote on Google.

Then I tried the quote by itself and didn't see any matches either. I may have picked up the quote in a different form somewhere, and altered it over the years.

Anyone know the original quote and its author?

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:55:50 PM   
RCdc


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Trent Reznor/NIN

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Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:56:37 PM   
Moonhead


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Status: offline 		I'm pretty sure there's a line something like that in The Hand That Feeds off the NIN album before last. I'm probably misremembering, though.
(edit: Bugger, beaten to the draw again...)

< Message edited by Moonhead -- 3/17/2010 3:57:21 PM >

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:57:55 PM   
eyesopened


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever
And leave all my loved ones behind? Nah... it's better to deprogram the years of indoctrination of the people right here, and start a grassroots effort towards a resource-based economy.


Having watched the 'orientation' from the other thread, I don't see that people are indoctrinated to catpitalism.  As the Beloved Leader guy in the video said, our current system places value based on scarcity.  But that is not indoctrination.  As anyone trying to lose weight knows, the body, our very DNA assumes starvation is around every corner.  The scarcity=value thing is part of our very core as animals.  So it might take getting the correctly genetically-engineered human to make it all work.  That would be the only way to really be sure people are properly deprogrammed.  Just my perspective.

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:59:07 PM   
RCdc


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quote:

Just how deep do you believe? Will you bite the hand that feeds? Will you chew until it bleeds? Can you get up off your knees? Are you brave enough to see? Do you want to change it?


Etc.blah.blah.blah.

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 3:59:41 PM   
subfever


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

I'm pretty sure there's a line something like that in The Hand That Feeds off the NIN album before last. I'm probably misremembering, though.
(edit: Bugger, beaten to the draw again...)


Hmm... I don't think I picked it up off a lyric, but I could be wrong.

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RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 4:00:27 PM   
Moonhead


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Status: offline 		Possibly, but I do wonder about connecting basic animal drives with more abstract desires that probably are culturally programmed. I don't think it's a very neat fit, a lot of the time.

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Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 4:04:00 PM   
willbeurdaddy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead


quote:

ORIGINAL: servantforuse

I think that subfever and Brain would both be happy in Cuba. There is no capitalisim there, the government makes all of the decisions for you and according to Michael Moore, they have better health care facilities than here in the states..I think you should move there.

There's a lot of people besides Michael "factchecker" Moore who say that, sadly. It's pretty well documented.
(Mind you, Mexico has a better healthcare system than the States as well, doesn't it?)


Uhhh, no, neither one does.

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Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Capitalism Is Dying a Natural Death - 3/17/2010 4:04:36 PM   
RCdc


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quote:

ORIGINAL: subfever


quote:

ORIGINAL: Moonhead

I'm pretty sure there's a line something like that in The Hand That Feeds off the NIN album before last. I'm probably misremembering, though.
(edit: Bugger, beaten to the draw again...)




Hmm... I don't think I picked it up off a lyric, but I could be wrong.

Possible you picked it up quoted elsewhere though.  Reznor and NIN tend to be pretty quotable.
Theres some Romanian proverb about kissing the hand that you cannot bite?

Geeze my edits suck tonight.

< Message edited by RCdc -- 3/17/2010 4:06:33 PM >

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