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RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 6:40:58 PM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
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quote:

The word liberty is not a right ... it is something that is earned. And careless statements ... do hurt others and imflame passions. When there is no reason too.


I'd say there is a reason to. The point of this isn't to poke fun at Mohammed, but to make a statement about those who threaten violence if their religion is criticized. For valid reason, or just for lulz.

(in reply to seekingOwnertoo)
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RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 6:41:18 PM   
seekingOwnertoo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: domiguy

Here in the U.S. The number of muslims that are going to get their turbans in a twist over a cartoon of Mohammed are about the same as Christians that kill abortion Dr's and queers.



Perhaps ... and intellectually correct.

But unless You are looking forward to being insulted ... for Your race ... please do ...

give others respect for their beliefs.

Cause I can cut you, the same way. But I choose, to give respect.

(in reply to domiguy)
Profile   Post #: 22
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 6:52:04 PM   
seekingOwnertoo


Posts: 1323
Joined: 8/1/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

quote:

The word liberty is not a right ... it is something that is earned. And careless statements ... do hurt others and imflame passions. When there is no reason too.


I'd say there is a reason to. The point of this isn't to poke fun at Mohammed, but to make a statement about those who threaten violence if their religion is criticized. For valid reason, or just for lulz.


While i realize you are baiting here ...

You have totally generalized an entire population of billions ... into a religious belief that does not exist. At least validly ....

Muslims who threaten violence ... are as ubiquitous as drug dealers in Detroit ... not really functioning by the law, and hardly able to over throw the government.

And oh, by the way, the new MISS USA, is an Arab/Muslim too.

Congratulations ... USA and Donald Trump.

PS I was born and raised in Detroit ... so don't shoot at me for this. I might shoot back ;-)

< Message edited by seekingOwnertoo -- 5/21/2010 6:59:54 PM >

(in reply to Elisabella)
Profile   Post #: 23
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 6:54:03 PM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: seekingOwnertoo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

quote:

The word liberty is not a right ... it is something that is earned. And careless statements ... do hurt others and imflame passions. When there is no reason too.


I'd say there is a reason to. The point of this isn't to poke fun at Mohammed, but to make a statement about those who threaten violence if their religion is criticized. For valid reason, or just for lulz.


While i realize you are baiting here ...

You have totally generalized an entire population of billions ... into a religious belief that does not exist. At least validly ....

Muslims who threaten vilonece ... are as ubiquitous as drug dealers in Detroit ...

And oh, by the way, the new MISS USA, is an Arab/Muslim too.

Congratulations ... USA and Donald Trump.


First off I didn't generalize a population of billions, I said it's to make fun of those who threaten violence which, it is.

Drug dealers in Detroit are pretty funny too, there are whole movies making fun of that culture.

As far as Miss USA she's not that funny, but the runner up from last year sure as fuck was.

Also if anything you're generalizing Muslims by assuming they'll all get pissed over it. As someone who has gotten drunk with some Muslims in the past I can attest that not all of them take the Qur'an as something to follow to the letter.

< Message edited by Elisabella -- 5/21/2010 6:59:46 PM >

(in reply to seekingOwnertoo)
Profile   Post #: 24
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 7:23:04 PM   
seekingOwnertoo


Posts: 1323
Joined: 8/1/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

quote:

generalizing Muslims by assuming they'll all get pissed over it.


Only because .... if we had the same contest ... for Jesus ... a lot of people would not find it so funny.

It's Quid pro quo ....

(in reply to Elisabella)
Profile   Post #: 25
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 7:26:56 PM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
Status: offline
quote:

Only because .... if we had the same contest ... for Jesus ... a lot of people would not find it so funny.

It's Quid pro quo ....


Like I said it's not the drawing of Mohammed itself that's funny.

Madonna got threatened with excommunication, not assassination.

ETA: http://www.divine-interventions.com/baby.php

I suppose to really be fair, we'd have to have a "Design a Mohammed sex toy" contest.

< Message edited by Elisabella -- 5/21/2010 7:29:52 PM >

(in reply to seekingOwnertoo)
Profile   Post #: 26
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 7:44:16 PM   
Aneirin


Posts: 6121
Joined: 3/18/2006
From: Tamaris
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

quote:

ORIGINAL: seekingOwnertoo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

quote:

The word liberty is not a right ... it is something that is earned. And careless statements ... do hurt others and imflame passions. When there is no reason too.


I'd say there is a reason to. The point of this isn't to poke fun at Mohammed, but to make a statement about those who threaten violence if their religion is criticized. For valid reason, or just for lulz.


While i realize you are baiting here ...

You have totally generalized an entire population of billions ... into a religious belief that does not exist. At least validly ....

Muslims who threaten vilonece ... are as ubiquitous as drug dealers in Detroit ...

And oh, by the way, the new MISS USA, is an Arab/Muslim too.

Congratulations ... USA and Donald Trump.


First off I didn't generalize a population of billions, I said it's to make fun of those who threaten violence which, it is.

Drug dealers in Detroit are pretty funny too, there are whole movies making fun of that culture.

As far as Miss USA she's not that funny, but the runner up from last year sure as fuck was.

Also if anything you're generalizing Muslims by assuming they'll all get pissed over it. As someone who has gotten drunk with some Muslims in the past I can attest that not all of them take the Qur'an as something to follow to the letter.


Yes, you have that right, not all muslims are the fanatical nut job many in the west chose to believe them to be, in fact the nutjob might account for an extreme minority, something as close to a percent or even a fraction of that percent of the Muslim people. Could it ever occur that the common or garden muslim moderate is just as afraid of the fanatic as we are in the west, as a moderate has a different belief to a fanatic, and a fanatic sees a moderate belief as incorrect in their mentality.

But, there are certain factions in the west that have set out to demonise anyone who follows the Islamic faith, tarring each and every one of them with the same fanatic brush.

The vast majority of muslims just want to get on with life and enjoy it the best they can, instead of wasting their lives in pointless acts of terror that many in high places say they care about, but as long as it does not affect the status quo, they really could not give a shit.

And yes, I also have got drunk with muslims, and learned the truth of their beliefs.

Where there is god, there is always sinners.

But regards the cartoon fest, all I can see, is it is designed to outrage a religion opposite to the accepted and majority religion of the US, could it be the war against Islam, is really much of the same as was metered out in the early middle ages, America has in effect taken up where the Crusaders left off.

Oh shit, I seem to remember Bush mentioning the word Crusade following the 9/11 attack. Crusade means only one thing to Muslims, did Bush really declare war on Muslims ?

A final point, I believe the Qur'an states protection for the Dimi people, not anihilation. The Dimi people are needed by Islam, and the Dimi are of the book. Terrorist action that kill the Dimi, are against the Qur'an, the terrorists that commit atrocities in the name of Allah, are disregarding his teachings, they are in fact sinners, so I guess no pleasant gardens for them and x virgins in their new existence.


< Message edited by Aneirin -- 5/21/2010 7:51:42 PM >


_____________________________

Everything we are is the result of what we have thought, the mind is everything, what we think, we become - Guatama Buddha

Conservatism is distrust of people tempered by fear - William Gladstone

(in reply to Elisabella)
Profile   Post #: 27
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 8:09:02 PM   
seekingOwnertoo


Posts: 1323
Joined: 8/1/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin

quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

quote:

ORIGINAL: seekingOwnertoo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

quote:

The word liberty is not a right ... it is something that is earned. And careless statements ... do hurt others and imflame passions. When there is no reason too.


I'd say there is a reason to. The point of this isn't to poke fun at Mohammed, but to make a statement about those who threaten violence if their religion is criticized. For valid reason, or just for lulz.


While i realize you are baiting here ...

You have totally generalized an entire population of billions ... into a religious belief that does not exist. At least validly ....

Muslims who threaten vilonece ... are as ubiquitous as drug dealers in Detroit ...

And oh, by the way, the new MISS USA, is an Arab/Muslim too.

Congratulations ... USA and Donald Trump.


First off I didn't generalize a population of billions, I said it's to make fun of those who threaten violence which, it is.

Drug dealers in Detroit are pretty funny too, there are whole movies making fun of that culture.

As far as Miss USA she's not that funny, but the runner up from last year sure as fuck was.

Also if anything you're generalizing Muslims by assuming they'll all get pissed over it. As someone who has gotten drunk with some Muslims in the past I can attest that not all of them take the Qur'an as something to follow to the letter.


Yes, you have that right, not all muslims are the fanatical nut job many in the west chose to believe them to be, in fact the nutjob might account for an extreme minority, something as close to a percent or even a fraction of that percent of the Muslim people. Could it ever occur that the common or garden muslim moderate is just as afraid of the fanatic as we are in the west, as a moderate has a different belief to a fanatic, and a fanatic sees a moderate belief as incorrect in their mentality.

But, there are certain factions in the west that have set out to demonise anyone who follows the Islamic faith, tarring each and every one of them with the same fanatic brush.

The vast majority of muslims just want to get on with life and enjoy it the best they can, instead of wasting their lives in pointless acts of terror that many in high places say they care about, but as long as it does not affect the status quo, they really could not give a shit.

And yes, I also have got drunk with muslims, and learned the truth of their beliefs.

Where there is god, there is always sinners.

But regards the cartoon fest, all I can see, is it is designed to outrage a religion opposite to the accepted and majority religion of the US, could it be the war against Islam, is really much of the same as was metered out in the early middle ages, America has in effect taken up where the Crusaders left off.

Oh shit, I seem to remember Bush mentioning the word Crusade following the 9/11 attack. Crusade means only one thing to Muslims, did Bush really declare war on Muslims ?

A final point, I believe the Qur'an states protection for the Dimi people, not anihilation. The Dimi people are needed by Islam, and the Dimi are of the book. Terrorist action that kill the Dimi, are against the Qur'an, the terrorists that commit atrocities in the name of Allah, are disregarding his teachings, they are in fact sinners, so I guess no pleasant gardens for them and x virgins in their new existence.




Exactly right Aneiran.

The point westerns miss ... is really very simple angle ...

How do we really KNOW that the person we refer to as God the Father, Allah and Yahweh are NOT the SAME PERSON?

One who feels DECENTRALIZTION is important?

The only real difference, between christians and muslims ... is WHO FOUNDED THE RELIGION ...

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 28
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 8:21:06 PM   
seekingOwnertoo


Posts: 1323
Joined: 8/1/2009
Status: offline
One last point ...

Yes, it is topical to make jokes ... about a LOT of STUFF here in America (And Canada, too).

My point is ... somewhere i remember the words ...

Race, Creed, Color AND Religion ....

An amendment to the constitution .. as I recall ...

So I think it is important ... to give each other, the opportunity to be FREE ... regardless of Race, Creed, Color AND Religion.

And one of the ways people FEEL FREE ... is to avoid being CRITIZISED OR JOKED ABOUT ... for deep beliefs.

Comedy about Mohammad .. is uncalled for and un-Christian.

After all, are not Christians the ones who should turn the other cheek?

(in reply to seekingOwnertoo)
Profile   Post #: 29
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 8:35:02 PM   
belladevine


Posts: 437
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline

Mohammad's face should be posted every where in America. He is a WANTED man (a criminal) by American standards.


I say paint him, draw him, or do him on an etch-a-sketch, whatever........just make sure his face is a target!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYGoZ8b2Wwk&feature=related

(in reply to seekingOwnertoo)
Profile   Post #: 30
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 8:37:58 PM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
Status: offline
quote:


An amendment to the constitution .. as I recall ...

So I think it is important ... to give each other, the opportunity to be FREE ... regardless of Race, Creed, Color AND Religion.

And one of the ways people FEEL FREE ... is to avoid being CRITIZISED OR JOKED ABOUT


Our opinions are so far apart I don't think that there can be any resolution.

I don't think that being free to practice any religion you want means that nobody can have a negative opinion about it.

(in reply to seekingOwnertoo)
Profile   Post #: 31
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 8:43:25 PM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
Status: offline
quote:

Yes, you have that right, not all muslims are the fanatical nut job many in the west chose to believe them to be, in fact the nutjob might account for an extreme minority, something as close to a percent or even a fraction of that percent of the Muslim people. Could it ever occur that the common or garden muslim moderate is just as afraid of the fanatic as we are in the west, as a moderate has a different belief to a fanatic, and a fanatic sees a moderate belief as incorrect in their mentality.

But, there are certain factions in the west that have set out to demonise anyone who follows the Islamic faith, tarring each and every one of them with the same fanatic brush.

The vast majority of muslims just want to get on with life and enjoy it the best they can, instead of wasting their lives in pointless acts of terror that many in high places say they care about, but as long as it does not affect the status quo, they really could not give a shit.


You're seriously missing my point. My point isn't that all Muslims are terrorist bombers, I don't think I said anything even remotely like that.
quote:

But regards the cartoon fest, all I can see, is it is designed to outrage a religion opposite to the accepted and majority religion of the US, could it be the war against Islam, is really much of the same as was metered out in the early middle ages, America has in effect taken up where the Crusaders left off.

Oh shit, I seem to remember Bush mentioning the word Crusade following the 9/11 attack. Crusade means only one thing to Muslims, did Bush really declare war on Muslims ?


If encouraging non-Muslims to "sin" in response to fundamentalist radicals who made death threats against someone for committing the same (seemingly trivial) sin is a "crusade" it's definitely an unconventional form of warfare.

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 32
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 8:47:44 PM   
Rule


Posts: 10479
Joined: 12/5/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin
Terrorist action that kill the Dimi, are against the Qur'an, the terrorists that commit atrocities in the name of Allah, are disregarding his teachings, they are in fact sinners, so I guess no pleasant gardens for them and x virgins in their new existence.

Muslims do not worship Allah.

Allah was the pagan god who participated in instructing Mohammed. The Quran was not written by Mohammed, but by Allah's Abrahamic Jewish enemies. Even the pagan god whom the Abrahamic Jews professed to worship made war agaisnt the Abrahamic Jews.

(in reply to Aneirin)
Profile   Post #: 33
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 8:56:59 PM   
seekingOwnertoo


Posts: 1323
Joined: 8/1/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rule

quote:

ORIGINAL: Aneirin
Terrorist action that kill the Dimi, are against the Qur'an, the terrorists that commit atrocities in the name of Allah, are disregarding his teachings, they are in fact sinners, so I guess no pleasant gardens for them and x virgins in their new existence.

Muslims do not worship Allah.

Allah was the pagan god who participated in instructing Mohammed. The Quran was not written by Mohammed, but by Allah's Abrahamic Jewish enemies. Even the pagan god whom the Abrahamic Jews professed to worship made war agaisnt the Abrahamic Jews.



Dude ... you have to be kidding me with this post ...

(in reply to Rule)
Profile   Post #: 34
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 8:59:04 PM   
belladevine


Posts: 437
Joined: 10/23/2007
Status: offline
Mohammad was a murderer!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EuhjpU5Rin4&feature=related

(in reply to Rule)
Profile   Post #: 35
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 9:34:02 PM   
seekingOwnertoo


Posts: 1323
Joined: 8/1/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

quote:


An amendment to the constitution .. as I recall ...

So I think it is important ... to give each other, the opportunity to be FREE ... regardless of Race, Creed, Color AND Religion.

And one of the ways people FEEL FREE ... is to avoid being CRITIZISED OR JOKED ABOUT


Our opinions are so far apart I don't think that there can be any resolution.

I don't think that being free to practice any religion you want means that nobody can have a negative opinion about it.

quote:

Our opinions are so far apart I don't think that there can be any resolution.

I don't think that being free to practice any religion you want means that nobody can have a negative opinion about it.


Your right ... we will never agree ....

Unless of course, you agree with me ...

That we have a right to disagree

Then perhaps ... we might find some common ground.

(in reply to Elisabella)
Profile   Post #: 36
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 10:29:36 PM   
seekingOwnertoo


Posts: 1323
Joined: 8/1/2009
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quote:

ORIGINAL: LadyAngelika

quote:

Will you be celebrating Draw Mohammed day?


No, but but I once defiled an Islamic artefact with the Mo ;-) What a superbly kinky night!

- LA




INFIDEL !!!!!!!!!!!!


(in reply to LadyAngelika)
Profile   Post #: 37
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 10:30:48 PM   
Elisabella


Posts: 3939
Status: offline
quote:

Your right ... we will never agree ....

Unless of course, you agree with me ...

That we have a right to disagree

Then perhaps ... we might find some common ground.


Heh well I do agree with you that provoking religious fundamentalists isn't a very nice thing to do. I'm not sure if you think it should be outlawed the way Aneirin does, but that's what I was taking the biggest issue with.

(in reply to seekingOwnertoo)
Profile   Post #: 38
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 11:05:49 PM   
seekingOwnertoo


Posts: 1323
Joined: 8/1/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Elisabella

quote:

Your right ... we will never agree ....

Unless of course, you agree with me ...

That we have a right to disagree

Then perhaps ... we might find some common ground.


Heh well I do agree with you that provoking religious fundamentalists isn't a very nice thing to do. I'm not sure if you think it should be outlawed the way Aneirin does, but that's what I was taking the biggest issue with.


We agree!

Provoking religious fundamentalists is not a nice thing to do.

In fact ... it can be hazardous to your health!

I support freedom of speech ... but I also am arguing for dignity and respect ... for all people!

my ancestors ... from Ireland and Poland ... suffered enormous insults for generations in this country.

As a result, they unanimously supported the Civil Rights movement in the 1950's and 60's. Knowing first hand ... the evils of prejudice and hatred. Even when the victims, are innocent.

In the same spirit, I feel compelled to defend innocent Arabs and especially innocent Arab Americans.

The terrorists ... are evil ... but Islam ... is not the enemy.

So, in my mind, making fun of Mohammed ... is no different ... than making fun of Jesus ...

And what is good for the goose, is good for the gander .... except of course ...

if i happened to joke with LA on this thread, for one post.

(in reply to Elisabella)
Profile   Post #: 39
RE: Draw Mohammed Day is near - 5/21/2010 11:14:14 PM   
seekingOwnertoo


Posts: 1323
Joined: 8/1/2009
Status: offline
Plus, I am a believer in that great American ....

Dale Carnegie ...

You catch more bee's with honey ... so to speak.

And this drawing day ... is really unlikely to do that!


And if you think about it, this could make the job of the American, British and Canadian troops .... in a foreign land ....... much more difficult.

So give our troops a break! ..... in my view.

< Message edited by seekingOwnertoo -- 5/22/2010 12:13:24 AM >

(in reply to Elisabella)
Profile   Post #: 40
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