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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 6:48:14 PM

kalikshama

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quote:

The problem as you're describing it seems to be the dom have unrealistic expectations. If someone hates strawberry ice cream, they might eat it to please you but it's unlikely they'll ever like it. So if you continue command them to like it for real you are simply setting everyone up for failure. Sure, you can stretch limits and modify behaviors but if a sub continually tells you she doesn't think she will ever feel that way, she's probably right. And her telling you to find another sub is probably a warning flare that you are beginning to test her patience with unreasonable demands.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 7:09:21 PM

LadyPact

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Karnikula

Ah yes but that's with a doable taks.

What about a non-doable task that doesn't violate hard limits such as "feeling a certain way about something".
That obviously takes time to realize, but what do you do until then? What if the sub thinks she can never feel that way ?

What if the sub thinks that taking on another sub instead would be a better idea to realize that thing? (contrary to what the dom thinks).

What the heck does this last paragraph mean? That the sub wants to take on a sub of their own? That he sub feels the Dom would be better off with another sub? You have to clear that up for Me to be able to answer that particular question.

Why would I assign a non doable task? There are some folks who like to do those "set up to fail" scenarios, but that's not My gig. If I want and expect submission, I believe it has to be an area where they can, ya know..... Submit.

I don't understand the deal about the sub "feeling that way," either. A person doesn't have to like a command or even feel good about it to be pleasing. Maybe, you are thinking of the term pleasing in a different way than I am. It doesn't mean that the submissive has to like everything. It does, however, mean that they do not pout, fuss, moan, or anything else while performing the task. That their service to Me matters more than their personal happiness in what they have been tasked to do, because in the end, no matter what it is, serving Me brings them joy.

< Message edited by LadyPact -- 8/15/2012 7:10:47 PM >

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 8:04:17 PM

JanahX

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I suppose I could throw this scenario out there.
So lets put this into play.

The Dom sits the sub down at the dinner table.
He puts a heaping, steaming bowl of fresh shit in front of him/her. - and says to them: "I want you to eat every drop, because thats what I want, it will make me happy---> and I want you to be pleasing."

The sub has never ate poop before - never even thought about it.

How many subs/slaves out there would eat it just to please their Dom? I'd like to know.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 8:57:41 PM

littlewonder

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I know I'm gonna regret this....<looks shiftily around to make sure he's nowhere near>

I would. I may not like it and he knows I would not like it since he knows me well and that's the reason why he would make me do it. I would do it to please him and in as much a pleasing manner as I could literally physically stomach before vomiting.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 9:03:47 PM

JanahX

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Youre a brave woman.

I think Id rather take a gun to my head than do that. And Im not even kidding.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 9:12:10 PM

JeffBC

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Karnikula

Ah yes but that's with a doable taks.

What about a non-doable task that doesn't violate hard limits such as "feeling a certain way about something".
That obviously takes time to realize, but what do you do until then? What if the sub thinks she can never feel that way ?

OK, a specific example of this. I'm not talking about doms and subs. I don't want to get hung-up in lingo but I'm talking about pretty steep levels of "inner control". Carol is a very strong and dedicated woman. The external commands "do this" are a given with her. The internal commands "feel this" are just much more of a crap shoot. I've never expected compliance with that, only effort.

So... Carol's collar 24/7. I tried to modify her feelings on this. I tried for two years. It just plain didn't work. At that point I conclude that either this is not possible for her in which case I abandon the command or else I need a different viewpoint/approach to give her. The status quo is temporarily on hold and I'm regrouping down a different path. This particular thing just happens to run very, very deep in Carol.

quote:

What if the sub thinks that taking on another sub instead would be a better idea to realize that thing? (contrary to what the dom thinks).

Carol wouldn't be thinking about what the solution to the problem was. She'd be relaying information to me about the status of her internal remodelling and I'd be making decisions about what to do.

PS: I have the same thing happen to me where I ask a muddy question and the real question takes shape as the thread develops. It's actually one of the coolest things that happens on these boards from my standpoint. I love it when the other posters not only give me the answers, but help me to shape the problem correctly.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 9:36:13 PM

NuevaVida

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JanahX

I suppose I could throw this scenario out there.
So lets put this into play.

The Dom sits the sub down at the dinner table.
He puts a heaping, steaming bowl of fresh shit in front of him/her. - and says to them: "I want you to eat every drop, because thats what I want, it will make me happy---> and I want you to be pleasing."

The sub has never ate poop before - never even thought about it.

How many subs/slaves out there would eat it just to please their Dom? I'd like to know.

Some of us have been subjected to this sort of thing. Every drop was impossible, though.

But why would you like to know (in italics, especially)?

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 9:42:51 PM

JanahX

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Id like to know why someone would do something that is probably to most people incomprehensible (such as eating a bowl of poop) to be pleasing to someone else to make them happy - and then, according to the OP - is supposed to make them happy -

Im a sub - but I dont have that need to do something that would really piss me off - so I can be pleasing to someone else.

I guess we are zoning into the "no limit" realm - just how far would some people go to be "pleasing".

I mean would anyone have their hand chopped off because it would please their Master/Dom? I dont understand for why someone would go to extreme lengths to do WHATEVER someone else says -

< Message edited by JanahX -- 8/15/2012 9:49:36 PM >

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 9:49:29 PM

NuevaVida

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JanahX

Id like to know why someone would do something that is probably to most people incomprehensible (such as eating a bowl of poop) to be pleasing to someone else to make them happy - and then, according to the OP - is supposed to make them happy -

Im a sub - but I dont have that need to do something that would really piss me off - so I can be pleasing to someone else.

It didn't make me happy. It made me sick and fucked up my head.

But that was his version of sadism.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 9:52:40 PM

JanahX

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quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

It didn't make me happy. It made me sick and fucked up my head.
But that was his version of sadism.

BINGO - and I dont think that anyone should be doing things that will mentally harm them. If they do - they should probably step back and reevaluate what it is that they are doing.

The whole - I am a robot thing is really wierd to me.

< Message edited by JanahX -- 8/15/2012 9:58:05 PM >

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 9:52:42 PM

littlewonder

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JanahX

Id like to know why someone would do something that is probably to most people incomprehensible (such as eating a bowl of poop) to be pleasing to someone else to make them happy - and then, according to the OP - is supposed to make them happy -

Im a sub - but I dont have that need to do something that would really piss me off - so I can be pleasing to someone else.

I guess we are zoning into the "no limit" realm - just how far would some people go to be "pleasing".

I mean would anyone have their hand chopped off because it would please their Master/Dom? I dont understand for why someone would go to extreme lengths to do WHATEVER someone else says -

I would assume that if he told me to chop off my hand that he had a good reason to do so. I trust him that much.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 9:57:11 PM

NuevaVida

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JanahX

quote:

ORIGINAL: NuevaVida

It didn't make me happy. It made me sick and fucked up my head.
But that was his version of sadism.

BINGO - and I dont think that anyone should be doing things that will mentally harm them. If they do - they should probably step back and reevaluate what it is that they are doing.

It was a past relationship, and internal enslavement. There is no reevaluation at that point, there is only "Do."

I'm not of the mindset of, "If it makes him happy, it will make me happy." Some things, no matter what his reason, I'm just not going to be happy about. But in our world over here, that's OK. We've had some really good relationship discoveries when I've been pissed off lol.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 9:59:32 PM

JeffBC

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quote:

I would assume that if he told me to chop off my hand that he had a good reason to do so. I trust him that much.

Carol is the same way. This seems sort of like basic logic to me though. Either I have lost my mind (n her assessment) or I have not.

In the end, my opinion is that this stuff has nothing to do with how submissive she is or how dominant I am. It has to do with how trusting she is and how trustworthy I am.

< Message edited by JeffBC -- 8/15/2012 10:03:50 PM >

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 10:01:57 PM

JanahX

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The whole - I am a robot thing is really a weird concept to me.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 10:17:30 PM

littlewonder

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I don't see it as being a robot. I see it as having chose a partner wisely who I feel I can trust with my entire life and even of those I love.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 10:25:04 PM

sunshinemiss

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Funny, I had one of these moments TODAY. I was doing my exercise with the trainer who basically runs my life. He had me jogging. Stop. Turn around. Go the other direction. Jog backwards. He got me to a point where I just do it. No thinking. He does this from time to time when I have difficulty focusing. Today was one of those days. So off we go doing what he tells me to do. Some people pass by. "Jog. Touch the people" he says to me. I. Didn't. Even. Question. It. I jogged toward the people.

O.o

I had some serious cognitive dissonance about it until I figured out what to do. It didn't matter though. When I got about 3 feet from them he told me to turn around and come back to him. When he asked me if I would have really touched them, I said that I knew he wouldn't have me do something inappropriate so yes I would have... but I would have touched their ears with my voice by saying hello. (and then a high five or something). He was happy with that. He knows I'm smart enough to do what he says even if it seems weird to me. It's his country and culture. He understands it better than I do. If he tells me to do something, I know I'm not in danger.

I gotta say... although I've never been in this kind of non-dating / non-romantic relationship before, it sure does feel pretty solid. I trust him more than just about any dom I've ever been involved with. THAT is saying something. Funny thing - he's starting to require that I be more emotionally transparent. If I'm not happy, I have to tell him why. He just made this rule this week because I told him that I wanted to enjoy exercise and food. Anything that doesn't make me happy interrupts the happy from exercise and food, and he wants to know about it and help me fix it. O.o

best
sunshine

< Message edited by sunshinemiss -- 8/15/2012 10:30:47 PM >

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 10:26:02 PM

JanahX

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Ah - I see.
But when it comes to what the thread initially is asking - to please your Dom/Master = would you go to no limits: eg - having your hand, leg whatever chopped off for the soul reason because thats what pleases your Dom(me)/Master? Because you want to be "pleasing"? Because that is what will make him happy? No other reason - Just the soul purpose of being pleasing to them.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 10:41:49 PM

littlewonder

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again, yes. And like I said, I didn't choose Master willy nilly. Hell it took me two years to meet him in person from us talking online lol. Why would I choose someone who would tell me that just for the fuck of it? Why would I choose a partner in life if I couldn't even trust my daughter's life with him??

To please him? Yes but when people start talking about all this extreme stuff and "what if...". What if...if I ran my life thinking about that constantly I'd be insane and imo thinking of relationships in those terms is setting it up for failure.

In our relationship I simply don't think about what he's asking me to do. I just do it. Yeah, I may hem and haw and even bite my tongue and not want to do it, but I do it. It's just automatic. I feel no reason to NOT please him.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 10:44:54 PM

NuevaVida

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JanahX

The whole - I am a robot thing is really a weird concept to me.

IE isn't about robotics, and to imply that those who obey to please their owner are robots is...well...not very cool.

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RE: Emotional Transparency vs. Being Pleasing. - 8/15/2012 10:46:44 PM

NuevaVida

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JanahX

Ah - I see.
But when it comes to what the thread initially is asking - to please your Dom/Master = would you go to no limits: eg - having your hand, leg whatever chopped off for the soul reason because thats what pleases your Dom(me)/Master? Because you want to be "pleasing"? Because that is what will make him happy? No other reason - Just the soul purpose of being pleasing to them.

Limb-chopping hypotheticals aren't really productive. How many amputated slaves do you see out there, hmm? Do you think this is really an issue?

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