Noah
Posts: 1660
Joined: 7/5/2005
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quote:
ORIGINAL: MasterFireMaam
quote:
ORIGINAL: CelticPrince
LA,
Thanks for the statements, now how about expanding on those thoughts.
CP
Seems pretty clear cut to me. Cyber = fantasy. Fantasy is great, but not a basis for a real-time relationship.
Master Fire
Lots of things are clear-cut. Like the principle that men are dominant and women submissive, or the theory that since men occupy the majority of positions of authority throughout the world, women are shown to be inferior beings, generally.
So now we have three clear-cut ideas to look at. They seem to me to have a few things in common; primarily the fact that they are all false. Isn't that interesting? Clear-cut does not = true.
If all your kink and your relationships generally consist in is rubbing, then you had darned well better get next to your prospective partner toot sweet.
If there is anything in the least psychological or emotional about your kinks and/or your relationships then the story is different. Rubbing, though nice, is not required to form a deep and genuine basis for a relationship, with or without power exchange. Please see the above post about the real estate between the ears.
If you were confined to a quarantined hospital room, your partner able to interact with you only via phone and chat, I guess your power dynamic would evaporate, since for you anything but being in the same room is fantasy.
Mine wouldn't, I assure you.
Other dominants, as well as military officers, business executives, religious leaders, parents, and many other sorts of people have been exerting their will over over others at great distances for thousands of years, long before there were even telephones, never mind the internet.
I would be sort of embarrassed to pipe up in a venue like this and admit that I didn't have a fucking clue how one person could dominate another without the benefit of physical contact. That just sounds utterly retarded to me.
Can you dominate someone who is sitting across the room, without touching them? I can.
In the next room? Out in the back yard? Calling from work across town? It would be absolutely out of the question, right? Sheer fantasy and not domination at all, right?
Just where have you drawn this imaginary line? I'd like to know so that I can straddle it accurately for you.
People have met and gotten to know one another through the post for dozens of generations. Your local library has shelves full of non-fiction books based upon these epistolary romances. Some ended badly. Some ended well--just as with romances generally. Some resulted in happy families, even dynasties. And those relationships relied on a far more tenuous link than modern technology affords us if we choose to use it.
It isn't a matter of opinion whether long-distance interactions can be the basis of a good, real-time relationship. It has been tried countless times and on very many occasions, before and since the advent of the internet, it has succeeded. So unless you believe that the scientific method is worthless you must cede that, yes, as a matter of cold, hard fact this can work because it has worked and it continues to work. It can also fail, just like assertions posted to this thread.
As a matter of fact, not opinion, two people can choose to interact with complete integrity and deep honesty and tenderness via any means of communication they care to choose, rubbing or no rubbing.
If you prefer to hook up with people who can only be trusted when they are close enough to smell your breath, that's your choice.
Some of these people who chose integrity and honesty are constituted as to be able love, hate or be apathetic to other people without having physically touched them--as strange as this may sound to you. Some of these same people can impose their will upon or subjugate their will to another human being without having swapped sweat with them.
Other people can live in a single room together, naked, lying to themselves and one another from morning to night.
For Christ's sake—if you'll pardon the expression—countless people have read a volume of sripture and proceeded on that basis to dedicate their life and being to another Being they cannot even hope to ever see or touch. Many of them underwent hand-to-hand indoctination, yes, but some of them didn't. They just read the freaking book. Then they submited their will as utterly as they could figure out how to. They freaking martyr themselves with disconcerting frequency, if the truth be told, for a power exchange partner of a distinctly intangible sort.
Were talking major edge play there.
If some guy writing in a desert 1400 or 2000 years ago can hold millions in thrall even today, is it so hard for you to grasp that doms and subs can hookup and interact meaningfully via phone or chat between Atlantic City and Philadelphia on a Thursday night?
It is unquestionably doable. It is unquestionably fuckupable. These are facts shown by empirical evidence, not opinions of mine. It seems pretty clear as well that it isn't for everyone. But I'll no sooner feel compelled to stand by while you try to invalidate this than I will while someone else tries to invalidate power exchange relationships generally or spouts some inane gender-supremacy crap from either side of the aisle. I call bullshit on all of you.
With that sorted out I'd like to ask why anyone would think that fantasy cannot be the basis of a solid relationship.? I know of relationships based on a common interest in hobbies, literature, or politics. I know of relationships based on shared time in the wilderness or in business boardrooms or sitting beside game boards.
I think, and this is opinion, now, that if you find someone with whose fantasies--sexual and otherwise--your fantasies mesh nicely then you may well have found a wonderful basis for a relationship.
If every time you try to go to the store in your car it ends up in a ditch, this doesn't prove that cars can't transport people to stores. It might be seen to indicate something about the range of your personal skills and abilities.
If every time you've tried interact mind-to-mind, heart-to-heart, soul-to-soul with someone who wasn't in the room with you you also ended up in a ditch, or shit on by a liar, or shitting on someone yourself, it doesn't prove that long distance interactions is "fantasy" or "unreal" or "Not the basis for a real-time relationship". It just proves that your gifts are elsewhere.
Please cultivate them fully and use them in good health with my warmest blessings and good wishes. But expect little more than ridicule when you tell me that some of the most important experiences in my life could never have happened. The experiences I'm referring to are the processes by which I came to know some people who are terribly important to me, at long distance, using cyber technology.
Here's a little mantra you can print on a card and carry in your wallet: “Different things have different meanings, and degrees of meaning, for different people.”
I respect your kink that can arise nowhere but in the confines of four walls. Rock on with it. I hope you can respect the people who find that they can do things that you can't do.
< Message edited by Noah -- 1/5/2007 6:53:07 PM >
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RE: To Cyber or Not - 
Profile
. LOL it's fun and I am fine saying I've done it 
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