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Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? Have ... - 3/16/2007 3:53:25 PM

puella

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It almost felt like we needed Senator Welsh today.

I taped the Wilson testimony today... and was just flabbergasted!

You may remember Congressman Lynn Westmoreland, Republican, Georgia 3rd District, from his infamously hysterical display of idiocy on the Colbert Report:

http://gorillamask.net/colbert10c.shtml

Well.. he wasn't that far off today in the hearings. After complaining to the chairman that he was disappointed that they did not have enough time for everyone to ask all the questions they had... this is how he chose to employ his five minutes of questioning:

Lynn Westmoreland: Your husband, would you say that he is a democrat, or a republican?

Valerie Wilson: "Although my husband comes from a Republican family,with deep roots in California, I would say he's a
Democrat, now, Congressman."

Lynn Westmoreland: "..nn'kay, and just to kinda keep score, ... would you say that you are a Democrat or a Republican?"

After all the important information that was revealed and with all that was yet needed to be known, after hearing testimony about how losing the job she spent all her energies in training for, and the critical importance of the things she was working on.... and after whining about not having enough time.... that was what he wanted on the official record...

After all woman has been put through for so many years with this whole situation, when all she did was serve her country well. surely some one needed to say:
"Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? Have you left no sense of decency?"

Amazing!

_____________________________

We must move forward, not backward, upward, not forward, and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom...... The Simpsons

War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." ...Ambrose Bierce

"Don't you oppress me!"....Stan/Loretta

Post #: 1

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 4:24:11 PM

krys

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Are you now or have you ever been a member of the Democratic Party?

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Krys

(in reply to puella)

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RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 4:29:34 PM

puella

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hehehe

_____________________________

We must move forward, not backward, upward, not forward, and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom...... The Simpsons

War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." ...Ambrose Bierce

"Don't you oppress me!"....Stan/Loretta

(in reply to krys)

Post #: 3

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 4:34:42 PM

FirmhandKY

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puella,

It's pertinent in this case. I think there is good evidence that both her and her husband acted and said many of the things they did for purely party partisan reasons.

FirmKY

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Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to krys)

Post #: 4

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 4:36:29 PM

puella

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Joined: 12/2/2004
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You mean, Joe Wilson said there was no uranium purchased in Niger by Saddam Hussein, because he was being partisan?

_____________________________

We must move forward, not backward, upward, not forward, and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom...... The Simpsons

War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." ...Ambrose Bierce

"Don't you oppress me!"....Stan/Loretta

(in reply to FirmhandKY)

Post #: 5

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 4:45:15 PM

ferryman777

Posts: 198
Joined: 2/23/2007
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Some good questions are offered for serious evaluaction and debate here.......

I a senate hearing, the question was put to Captain Invincible
"Who appointed you Captain sir? Where did you recieve your rank.?"

Then it came......"I put it to you sir, that no one appointed you captian, that you sir...are a fraud and impostor."

OOOOhhhhhhh, the humanity.

(in reply to puella)

Post #: 6

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 4:46:03 PM

thompsonx

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Joined: 10/1/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: FirmhandKY

puella,

It's pertinent in this case. I think there is good evidence that both her and her husband acted and said many of the things they did for purely party partisan reasons.

FirmKY

FirmhandKY:
What exactly do you feel that was pertinent?
I thought this was a hearing not a case? Did I miss something?
What might that good evidence be?
What would the many things said and done be?
thompson

(in reply to FirmhandKY)

Post #: 7

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 4:56:14 PM

farglebargle

Posts: 10715
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From: Albany, NY
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If she tells a Partisan Lie while under oath, then she can just be prosecuted for Perjury, eh?

The "Partisan Lie" hypothesis pretty much evaporates under the scrutiny of Testimony under Oath.

If he had SPECIFIC questions about SPECIFIC statements, he would have raised them, instead he punted.

Sad in a way, what message does it send to the rest of the Intelligence Community about their classified status vs. being deemed "Politically Unreliable"?

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to thompsonx)

Post #: 8

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 5:25:14 PM

FirmhandKY

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Joined: 9/21/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: puella

You mean, Joe Wilson said there was no uranium purchased in Niger by Saddam Hussein, because he was being partisan?

If you wish to believe that they were both simply "avengers of the good", go ahead. I don't think you or most of the people who will post in support of them are even willing to listen to facts versus the story line you already have firmly in your head.

It's part of what I mentioned to you in the other thread. Some people (on both sides of the ideological divide) won't let facts get in the way of a good story that reinforces their pre-existing beliefs.

The only thing I'll ask you is:

Did she say she was outed as a covert CIA operative by the Novak story?

Did "many others" outside the CIA know she worked for the CIA before that occurred?

If the facts show both sentences to be true ... then she is at best dissembling, and the question becomes "why?"

If you are willing to look at those questions, and answer that "why" honestly, then you may convince me you aren't suffering from a form of BDS.

FirmKY

< Message edited by FirmhandKY -- 3/16/2007 5:29:07 PM >

_____________________________

Some people are just idiots.

(in reply to puella)

Post #: 9

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 5:39:07 PM

puella

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1. Yes, she did,under oath.
2. Only those with security clearance.

Honestly, I do not follow your logic after that point.

I am not willing to be swayed by anything without facts FirmhandKY. The facts are that the head of the CIA testified that Valerie Plame Wilson was covert, and that her identity was compromised as was that of all the others working with her in the Brewster Jennings operation. Infact that entire operation.. years and years of work into monitoring nuclear proliferation in the middle east was ceased because of that outing.

< Message edited by puella -- 3/16/2007 5:41:03 PM >

_____________________________

We must move forward, not backward, upward, not forward, and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom...... The Simpsons

War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." ...Ambrose Bierce

"Don't you oppress me!"....Stan/Loretta

(in reply to FirmhandKY)

Post #: 10

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 5:50:23 PM

popeye1250

Posts: 18104
Joined: 1/27/2006
From: New Hampshire
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There's that phrase, "critically important!"
That's what they say in the U.S. State Dept and the "U.N.".
"The placement of the silverware is "critically important."
And they have a varient on it; "Absolutely Critical."
As in , "Senator, this funding is Absolutely Critical to the safety of this nation!"
Translation; ("Damn! If we don't get this funding young Bisby will have to go to U.Mass with the hoi poloi instead of Harvard!")

< Message edited by popeye1250 -- 3/16/2007 6:35:50 PM >

(in reply to puella)

Post #: 11

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 6:04:13 PM

UtopianRanger

Posts: 3251
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: puella

After all the important information that was revealed and with all that was yet needed to be known, after hearing testimony about how losing the job she spent all her energies in training for, and the critical importance of the things she was working on.... and after whining about not having enough time.... that was what he wanted on the official record...

After all woman has been put through for so many years with this whole situation, when all she did was serve her country well. surely some one needed to say:
"Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? Have you left no sense of decency?"

Amazing!

Get em' Puella! lol!

- R

_____________________________

"If you are going to win any battle, you have to do one thing. You have to make the mind run the body. Never let the body tell the mind what to do... the body is never tired if the mind is not tired."

-General George S. Patton

(in reply to puella)

Post #: 12

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 6:05:41 PM

Sanity

Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
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Earth to puella, mainstream news sources said things like, this was just political theatre and that nothing new was revealed.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070316/ap_on_go_co/cia_leak_congress_29

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ibd/20070316/bs_ibd_ibd/2007316issues

quote:

ORIGINAL: puella

After all the important information that was revealed...

< Message edited by Sanity -- 3/16/2007 6:06:47 PM >

(in reply to puella)

Post #: 13

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 6:13:37 PM

farglebargle

Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
Status: offline

quote:

Did she say she was outed as a covert CIA operative by the Novak story?

Yes, under oath.

quote:

Did "many others" outside the CIA know she worked for the CIA before that occurred?

That's Classified, and covered under Ex. Order 12958.

quote:

If the facts show both sentences to be true ... then she is at best dissembling, and the question becomes "why?"

Actually, she's committed the crime of Perjury. If you think there's a case against her, bring on the Grand Jury.

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to FirmhandKY)

Post #: 14

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 6:36:15 PM

puella

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Joined: 12/2/2004
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Lets start with this, Sanity... Did you watch the entire proceedings? I did.

Now lets work backwards from your links.

Yahoo news plucks its articles from other sources... your second one came from a publication called "Investors Business Daily", The title of the piece is "Blonde Faith"... sorry, but right off the bat it is demonstrating its opinions of the people in the piece, and opinions are not a part of credible journalism... but to make it that much clearer...the entire piece is riddled with half truths, opinions and belittling comments about her.. not at all credible in my opinion... laughable is more like it. Yahoo also snips news from TMZ, that doesn't make it legitimate journalism)

The first article is from AP, which is a reputable news source. That article states: "

"She revealed little new information about the case, which sparked a federal investigation and brought perjury and obstruction of justice convictions of Vice President Dick Cheney's former top aid.."

That is pretty much true, as there was a lot of really damning evidence exposed there. However, the purpose of this hearing is not at all the same as that of the Libby trial, and Valerie Wilson is still not allowed to comment on much, due to the covert nature of her work at the CIA:

[http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/16/AR2007031600276_2.html ]

"In an opening statement, Waxman, the committee chairman, said the purpose of the hearing was to determine how the leak of Plame's identity occurred, whether the White House took appropriate investigative and disciplinary steps afterward and what changes are needed to prevent a recurrence."

"Any characterization that minimizes the personal risk of Ms. Wilson that she accepted in her assignments is flatly wrong," Waxman said. "There should be no confusion on this point." He said her work was so sensitive that she is still prohibited by the CIA from publicly discussing many details of it."

I happen to think there was some very important information uncovered today, including testimony regarding the Senate Intelligence Committee:

"Rep. Chris Van Hollen (D-Md.) asked Plame whether she had talked to a Counter proliferation Division reports officer at the CIA who was interviewed by the Senate Intelligence Committee and allegedly said she played a role in Wilson's trip.
"Yes, Congressman," Plame replied. "And I can tell you that he came to me almost with tears in his eyes. He said his words have been twisted and distorted. He wrote a memo, and he asked a supervisor to allow him to be reinterviewed by the committee. And the memo went nowhere, and his request to be reinterviewed so that the record could be set straight was denied."
Waxman said his committee "will insist on getting that memo."

And the discrediting of Victoria Toensing;s (talk about partisan interests : http://mediamatters.org/items/200501140005 ) in er assertions that Valerie Wilson was not covert:

Under questioning from Democrats who quoted the CIA as saying Plame's affiliation with the agency was classified, Toensing acknowledged that the improper disclosure of classified information violates a 1995 executive order.

There was much more than that but, I think those two things alone merit "important new information".

Also, there is no need to bold and enlarge your font. I can read quite well, thank you. There is also no need to get petty with childish remarks to me, simply because you do not appreciate my position on this matter.

< Message edited by puella -- 3/16/2007 6:44:38 PM >

_____________________________

We must move forward, not backward, upward, not forward, and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom...... The Simpsons

War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." ...Ambrose Bierce

"Don't you oppress me!"....Stan/Loretta

(in reply to Sanity)

Post #: 15

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 6:37:19 PM

BOUNTYHUNTER

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IT seems like we are dead ended here folks,I realize the questions must be limited in an open hearing but damm give us a little meat at least....we can pick the bones at a later date...If she didn't send her boy joe then who did and whom did he report back to??BH

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US going to hell in a hand basket/

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RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 6:42:07 PM

puella

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Joined: 12/2/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: BOUNTYHUNTER

If she didn't send her boy joe then who did and whom did he report back to??BH

Her supervisor. She did not have the authority to make reccomendations of that nature.

"I did not recommend him. I did not suggest him. There was no nepotism involved. I didn't have the authority," Plame said....Plame said she was "somewhat ambivalent" about such a trip because the couple had 2-year-old twins at home at the time and she did not want to be left alone with them. "So I wasn't overjoyed with this idea," she said.

She and her colleague went to their supervisor, who asked her to invite her husband to come to CIA headquarters to discuss the matter the following week, Plame said. The supervisor also "asked me to draft a quick e-mail to the chief of our Counterproliferation Division letting him know that this might happen," she said.

_____________________________

We must move forward, not backward, upward, not forward, and always twirling, twirling, twirling towards freedom...... The Simpsons

War is God's way of teaching Americans geography." ...Ambrose Bierce

"Don't you oppress me!"....Stan/Loretta

(in reply to BOUNTYHUNTER)

Post #: 17

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 6:48:19 PM

farglebargle

Posts: 10715
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Albany, NY
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quote:

Under questioning from Democrats who quoted the CIA as saying Plame's affiliation with the agency was classified, Toensing acknowledged that the improper disclosure of classified information violates a 1995 executive order.

For those of you following along, that's Executive Order 12958.

http://www.fas.org/sgp/clinton/eo12958.html

_____________________________

It's not every generation that gets to watch a civilization fall. Looks like we're in for a hell of a show.

ברוך אתה, אדוני אלוקינו, ריבון העולמים, מי יוצר צמחים ריחניים

(in reply to puella)

Post #: 18

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 7:04:03 PM

juliaoceania

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FR

For those who believe that Joe Wilson and his wife Valarie Plame are partisan hacks... I will remind all of you there was no niger yellowcake, we were lied to about wmd, and they have never found any wmd. I think the facts support the Wilson family... the case for war was fabricated.. and we KNOW that Bush Co are nothing but partisan hacks

_____________________________

Once you label me, you negate me ~ Soren Kierkegaard

Reality has a well known Liberal Bias ~ Stephen Colbert

Great minds discuss ideas; Average minds discuss events; Small minds discuss people. Eleanor Roosevelt

(in reply to farglebargle)

Post #: 19

RE: Have you no sense of decency, sir, at long last? H... - 3/16/2007 7:08:45 PM

Sanity

Posts: 22039
Joined: 6/14/2006
From: Nampa, Idaho USA
Status: offline

And you're not a "partisan hack"?

quote:

ORIGINAL: juliaoceania

FR

For those who believe that Joe Wilson and his wife Valarie Plame are partisan hacks... I will remind all of you there was no niger yellowcake, we were lied to about wmd, and they have never found any wmd. I think the facts support the Wilson family... the case for war was fabricated.. and we KNOW that Bush Co are nothing but partisan hacks

(in reply to juliaoceania)

Post #: 20

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