RE: Romney antigay bully?

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fucktoyprincess -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 5:51:54 PM)
p.s. I also want to add that most psychologists who deal with children in the lower and middle school years will tell you that bullying is invariably the result of deep-rooted insecurities. And to the extent it continues into high school years, it means the insecurities have really manifested themselves. Bullies bully because it makes them feel better about themselves. Because unless they are attacking others or putting others in their place, they do not have positive self-perception. Their positive self-perception only comes from stepping on others. So above and beyond everything else, Romney is a deeply, deeply insecure man. And what, about that, is appealing in a leader???

tj444 -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 5:52:55 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: dcnovice quote: oh I know you want to bash Romney and all Rs where ever you can and pretend that the Ds are all lily white and ignore their faults and transgressions when it suits you.. you wonder why a gay man would work for him? yet you dont wonder why women worked for womanizing user sleazoid Democrats like Edwards and Clinton, all the way back to JFK?.. its the exact same thing.. I'm no fan of womanizing, but I do see a difference between someone's personal transgressions (which I may deplore) and his or her policy stances. As was his right and for whatever his reasons, Grenell took a job as a spokesperson for a candidate who's made no small effort to stake out antigay positions--and who doesn't seem to have stood by Grenell in the face of homophobic attacks. As a gay man myself, I find Grenell's choice puzzling. The problem with the womanizing and personal transgressions and stealing money to pay someone to keep quiet is they have to be covered up by support staff like Young, etc. I have read that Grenell is a Republican.. maybe that was all the reason he needed.. He didnt hide his being gay,.. and yet Romeny wanted to give him a good position.. if Romney was so anti-gay he wouldnt have done that.. I dont envy any politician trying to affect positive change in the Republican party.. but of course Romney cant do much if he is shot out of the water..

SternSkipper -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 5:53:47 PM)
quote: You will never see a feral cat outside a Chinese Buffet. WRONG!!!! I have a great story about the MADlady who runs the Feline Rescue Of Cape Ann And our two horrific attempts at "Adoption"... I just don't think this is the thread because it'll drag it WAY off course. Suffice it to say I've met a few feral cats before they hit the plate and it wasn't what I would call an enriching experience [:D]

fucktoyprincess -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 5:57:34 PM)
FR Here is Romney's current record on being supportive of his gay employees.... http://www.washingtonblade.com/2012/05/10/romney-grenell-get-a-quickie-divorce/

tj444 -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 6:04:04 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess If you don't want to engage in the debate that is your choice. Done. lol nice try.. you just dont want to answer my questions... [:D]

tj444 -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 6:13:46 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SternSkipper That's pretty oversimplified. And I won't bother rehashing the details of what I find wrong with each of these democrats you mention, I will say though that my opinions can be searched up right here. And to be honest, I was thinking of this as fluff earlier, mainly because I think of Mitt Romney is perhaps the most PREPOSTEROUS OFFERING the GOP has ever shot our way for deeper reasons than this event. But ya know, given the waffle act this guy has so consistently demonstrated. I think I'm pretty clear Romney's got a lasting contempt for gays as well. I was already to put it off to teenage misdeeds that maybe like many of us we evolve out of. But you know what? I unlike you, and for that matter most on this forum have been the guy's constituent and been a direct beneficiary of his mismanagement of my state. So I think I will firmly ad ANTI-GAY to the list and be happy with it. And you know what else? I happen to like the way I express my disdain for politicians I feel to be assholes. Cause unlike my opponents, who more and more seem to be smothering in overt anger. I'm good with the "make em a laughing stock" policy. I expect since you feel he mismanaged your state, you wont be voting for him regardless.. lol What i dont get is why, if Romney really is anti-gay, wtf would he hire an openly gay guy for the position he was given? That to me just doesnt make sense.. I personally dont think Romney (or any R) will win the next election, not a hope in hell.. I think Obama has it in the bag and has already won it.. People will vote for the devil they know..

dcnovice -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 6:15:47 PM)
quote: The problem with the womanizing and personal transgressions and stealing money to pay someone to keep quiet is they have to be covered up by support staff like Young, etc. I didn't say womanizing was okay--far from it--and I think the stealing and coverup stuff does extend beyond the realm of personal transgression. That's why Edwards is on trial, no? quote: I have read that Grenell is a Republican. Yes, he is. And he made a big fuss not long before joining the Romney campaign in the Washington Blade (our local gay paper), slamming openly gay Post columnist Jonathan Capeheart for attending a state dinner and declining to use the occasion to confront Obama on his failure (at that point) to support marriage equality. So if, by Grenell's own standard, a dinner guest is emblematic of one politican's positions, it seems not unreasonable to associate an actual spokesperson with his candidate's policies. quote: He didnt hide his being gay No. to his credit, he did not. And we've seen where that got him with the Republican base. quote: ,.. and yet Romeny wanted to give him a good position.. if Romney was so anti-gay he wouldnt have done that.. It is good that Romney hired an openly gay guy (for a week). That's pretty small potatoes, though, compared to public policy positions aimed at changing the law of the land. quote: I dont envy any politician trying to affect positive change in the Republican party Me neither. quote: .. but of course Romney cant do much if he is shot out of the water.. But who shot Romney out of the water? The homophobic attacks on Grenell came from his own party, and Romney doesn't seem to have made much effort to stand up to them.

tj444 -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 6:41:47 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: dcnovice quote: He didnt hide his being gay No. to his credit, he did not. And we've seen where that got him with the Republican base. quote: ,.. and yet Romeny wanted to give him a good position.. if Romney was so anti-gay he wouldnt have done that.. It is good that Romney hired an openly gay guy (for a week). That's pretty small potatoes, though, compared to public policy positions aimed at changing the law of the land. quote: I dont envy any politician trying to affect positive change in the Republican party Me neither. quote: .. but of course Romney cant do much if he is shot out of the water.. But who shot Romney out of the water? The homophobic attacks on Grenell came from his own party, and Romney doesn't seem to have made much effort to stand up to them. it is going to take a long time to affect that kind of change in the Republican party.. but Romney cant do anything in that vane if he doesnt have a position to do that with.. thats what i mean about him being shot out of the water (not wining the election), even as leader of the Rs, his power to do that is limited, as President he might be able to.. I am sure there are other more anti-gay Rs that would be much worse for gays.. I guess Grenell wouldnt be an R if he didnt have more reasons for being one,.. i have yet to find any politician whose positions i agree with 100%,.. you go with the one that has the most and most important positions that you agree with.. It appears that Romney didnt want him to resign, but that decision was Grenells to make.. he might have decided the issue of his gayness was overshadowing a lot of other important issues and he resigned because he thought it was best to.. I think it would have been better had he stayed but i can understand him not.. I think Obama will win this election.. but i expect at some point down the road the Rs will win and imo, it would be best at that point for gays to have the most pro-gay rights R that could be voted to lead that party.. so,.. who out of all of the Rs would that be?

fucktoyprincess -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 6:50:38 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: dcnovice The homophobic attacks on Grenell came from his own party, and Romney doesn't seem to have made much effort to stand up to them. At the end of the day, this is ultimately the issue. Whether it is beating up on a gay teen because he looks different, or lacking the fortitude to stand up to other bullies to defend someone working for him, the fact remains that Romney is not a champion of gay people or gay rights. Something tells me that his becoming President would not suddenly turn him into a champion for gay rights. Am I wrong?

Master2811 -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 7:14:56 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess My very first reaction was "is anyone surprised at this??" Seems quite consistent with everything else we know about him. I'm not sure it matters per se. In the sense that people can outgrow their immaturity, so I would not want to hold people responsible for what they did while their frontal lobe was still developing. HOWEVER, this is further proof that Romney has not really evolved as a human being. He was a privileged intolerant teen who has grown into a privileged intolerant adult. Not who I want for President. Be tolerant, remember? [:D][:D][:D]

fucktoyprincess -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 7:17:59 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Master2811 quote: ORIGINAL: fucktoyprincess My very first reaction was "is anyone surprised at this??" Seems quite consistent with everything else we know about him. I'm not sure it matters per se. In the sense that people can outgrow their immaturity, so I would not want to hold people responsible for what they did while their frontal lobe was still developing. HOWEVER, this is further proof that Romney has not really evolved as a human being. He was a privileged intolerant teen who has grown into a privileged intolerant adult. Not who I want for President. Be tolerant, remember? [:D][:D][:D] I am very tolerant of gay people. But thanks for the reminder. [:D][:D][:D]

Master2811 -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 7:31:39 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: thompsonx quote: ORIGINAL: Iamsemisweet No importance whatsoever. I am soooo surprised that a self confessed zenophobe and biggot would find nothing important about the homphobic behaviour of a presidential candidate. Now there is something very inconsistant in that claim. He bullied gays right? So he had no fear of them right? If he had feared them he would not have bullied them right? Then why do you call his behaviour "homophobic"? The "phobic" part comes from the Greek language. Phobos is fear in Greek. He did not fear the gays he was bullying. So the word "homophobic" is inaccurate. But liberals and progessive people always have this unccontrolable urge to label people they don't agree with. If you are not in favour of the islamic ideology you most certainly are an islamophobic person. If you don't want too many immigrants in your country because it costs too much you most certainly are a xenophobic person. It's the old progessive way of hammering progressive thoughts and ideas into our societies by labeling people in a way as if they have a certain disease. Actually it's a sort of strawman. If you don't like the message shoot (in this case label) the messenger to make him look bad.

dcnovice -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 7:34:31 PM)
quote: Be tolerant, remember? I know you're teasing, and I did chuckle. But the idea of tolerating intolerance led this Google geek to some surfing, and I came across an interesting aphorism: “Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice.” The words come from Ayaan Hirsi Ali, who left Somalia as a girl, landed in the Netherlands (where she was a screenwriter and politician), and now lives in the U.S. (where she works at the American Enterprise Institute, a conservative think tank). She sounds like one interesting woman!

SternSkipper -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 7:47:21 PM)
quote: I expect since you feel he mismanaged your state, you wont be voting for him regardless.. lol Before you kill yourself laughing with your obvious misread of my political behavior in the past. Try and understand this. I voted for the asshole in 2002. The Democratic party fielded a TERRIBLE candidate in Shannon O'Brien right after we'd had Jane Swift who was SUCH a poor governor, she used reverse discrimination tactics, like breast feeding just to raise a commotion. Which in my opinion was sad since she was making history in Massachusetts and decided to cheapen it because her OWN PARTY'S IN THE BAG RADIO COMMENTATOR Howie Carr was drilling her a new asshole daily. Anyway, Shannon O'Brien had bad policies in my opinion and I went with Romney. 2 years later, 100k jobs gone, a 4% increase in property taxes and a 2% increase in Income tax... and then as soon as his 'exploratory study' was done for the presidency. He ditched on the state, hardly even finishing his term. So yeah, I suppose I should give it more careful thought before considering myself an authority on Mitt Romney's mismanagement of the State Of Massachusetts. quote: What i dont get is why, if Romney really is anti-gay, wtf would he hire an openly gay guy for the position he was given? That to me just doesnt make sense.. When divers want to stay deep they use a buoyancy COMPENSATOR ... do the math.

fucktoyprincess -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 7:48:37 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: Master2811 Now there is something very inconsistant in that claim. He bullied gays right? So he had no fear of them right? If he had feared them he would not have bullied them right? Then why do you call his behaviour "homophobic"? The "phobic" part comes from the Greek language. Phobos is fear in Greek. He did not fear the gays he was bullying. So the word "homophobic" is inaccurate. But liberals and progessive people always have this unccontrolable urge to label people they don't agree with. If you are not in favour of the islamic ideology you most certainly are an islamophobic person. If you don't want too many immigrants in your country because it costs too much you most certainly are a xenophobic person. It's the old progessive way of hammering progressive thoughts and ideas into our societies by labeling people in a way as if they have a certain disease. Actually it's a sort of strawman. If you don't like the message shoot (in this case label) the messenger to make him look bad. No, you have it backwards. Homophobia is a polite term for hate. i agree with you that we should just call it what it is. Hate. Mitt Romney is a hateful individual. I will also copy what I wrote earlier: quote: p.s. I also want to add that most psychologists who deal with children in the lower and middle school years will tell you that bullying is invariably the result of deep-rooted insecurities. And to the extent it continues into high school years, it means the insecurities have really manifested themselves. Bullies bully because it makes them feel better about themselves. Because unless they are attacking others or putting others in their place, they do not have positive self-perception. Their positive self-perception only comes from stepping on others. So above and beyond everything else, Romney is a deeply, deeply insecure man. And what, about that, is appealing in a leader??? So I should also add - Mitt Romney is a hateful deeply deeply insecure man. A psychological profile just like Hitler. This isn't a strawman argument. This is the reality of what hateful bullying is all about. Bullying has psychological roots.

MasterSlaveLA -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 7:52:28 PM)
Hmmm... and then there's the fucking scum-bag OBAMA BULLYING A GIRL, as well as showing his RACISM... . . . . . President Obama’s Disturbing Pattern of Bullying and Stereotyping By Greg Pollowitz May 10, 2012 6:12 P.M. In light of the Washington Post’s Pulitzer-worthy piece today on Mitt Romney’s time in high school, conservatives decided to reciprocate and dig a little into the president’s past. Turns out the young Barack bullied a little girl named Coretta while in elementary school! He even called her "plump." What a jerk! But the president’s bad behavior doesn’t end there. I went out and ordered Dreams from My Father on Kindle and discovered young Barack’s horrific treatment of his fellow college student Tim. The future president wrote that Tim wasn’t a "conscious brother." He "talked like Beaver Cleaver" and had a white girlfriend who, Obama guessed, listened to "country music." What’s worse, Obama thought Tim’s real name should be "Tom." As in Uncle. Shameful! http://www.nationalreview.com/media-blog/299634/president-obamas-disturbing-pattern-bullying-and-stereotyping-greg-pollowitz# ----- *The bullying excerpt in question, from Obama’s Dreams from My Father:* There was one other child in my class, though, who reminded me of a different sort of pain. Her name was Coretta, and before my arrival she had been the only black person in our grade. She was plump and dark and didn’t seem to have many friends. From the first day, we avoided each other but watched from a distance, as if direct contact would only remind us more keenly of our isolation. Finally, during recess one hot, cloudless day, we found ourselves occupying the same corner of the playground. I don’t remember what we said to each other, but I remember that suddenly she was chasing me around the jungle gym and swings. She was laughing brightly, and I teased her and dodged this way and that, until she finally caught me and we fell to the ground breathless. When I looked up, I saw a group of children, faceless before the glare of the sun, pointing down at us. "Coretta has a boyfriend! Coretta has a boyfriend!" The chants grew louder as a few more kids circled us. "She’s not my g-girlfriend," I stammered. I looked to Coretta for some assistance, but she just stood there looking down at the ground. "Coretta’s got a boyfriend! Why don’t you kiss her, mister boyfriend?" "I’m not her boyfriend!" I shouted. I ran up to Coretta and gave her a slight shove; she staggered back and looked up at me, but still said nothing. "Leave me alone!" I shouted again. And suddenly Coretta was running, faster and faster, until she disappeared from sight. Appreciative laughs rose around me. http://www.mediaite.com/tv/hannity-panel-counters-romney-bullying-story-by-peering-into-obamas-bullying/

SternSkipper -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 7:56:32 PM)
quote: Tell that to the 1994 Romney: Yep ... because Boston had gone through a huge migration of Young gay professionals in the years immediately before, you could practically order up a blowjob from the guy if you were willing to pick up phones and call all your friends. My ex and I lived in the South End in the Harriet Tubman house and our neighbor Billy, a gay divinity student told us "Oh you've GOT to come to the Romney Tea Dance". Billy later, after realizing he didn't trust Romney had these awful, filthy limericks about Romney ... they were whoever funny as hell. i don't know if the one I can remember bears repeating here though.

dcnovice -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 7:57:12 PM)
FR As long as we're talking tolerance, I'll share an insight that's stuck with me for decades now. I was complaining to my spiritual director in high school about the trouble I had tolerating members of my family. We all shared a small house, and money was tight, so the tension level could be pretty high. (I was also, I realize know, beginning to get inklings of my forbidden sexuality, which didn't help.) Father stunned me with what he said: "Maybe you should stop trying to be tolerant." Tolerance, he explained, often has a subtext of a superior being putting up with an inferior, or of a majority deigning not to persecute a minority. Better, he suggested, to strive for compassion. Rooted in the Latin for "to suffer with," compassion isn't hierachical, and it doesn't focus on grandly overlooking another's flaws. Rather it's a quest for seeing someone whole and finding common ground in the joys and pains that we share. It worked, allong with going away to college. Today I count my family as one of my greatest treasures, and I delight in our too-rare chances to be together. I've never forgotten that vocabulary lesson. I wonder what Father would think if I wrote and told him I'd just posted his wisdom on a BDSM message board! [:)]

tj444 -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 8:09:25 PM)
quote: ORIGINAL: SternSkipper So yeah, I suppose I should give it more careful thought before considering myself an authority on Mitt Romney's mismanagement of the State Of Massachusetts. quote: What i dont get is why, if Romney really is anti-gay, wtf would he hire an openly gay guy for the position he was given? That to me just doesnt make sense.. When divers want to stay deep they use a buoyancy COMPENSATOR ... do the math. I dont see you as a Republican, given your support of OWS and all that.. and I am not disputing your view of him mismanaging your state.. for most people that feel as you do, that would be enough reason not to vote for him again.. its not like jobs & taxes would be small tatters to most people.. I know some people might think he had a gay guy working for him to get gay votes but imo he would lose more votes than he might have gained.. so it still does not make sense to me that if he was anti-gay to hire an openly gay guy and alienate a larger number of votes..

dcnovice -> RE: Romney antigay bully? (5/10/2012 8:40:33 PM)
So we now have dueling dog dramas and battling bullyibouts. And November is still months off. This is definitely the campaign that keeps giving. We have two stories that involved physical contact: Coretta and John Lauber's haircut. In the Coretta scene, Obama was ten: one of two (I think) black kids in his class. Other kids began taunting him and Coretta about being a couple. Obama ignobly shoved Coretta away, saying he wasn't her boyfriend. Not a proud moment, to be sure. We know about this incident because Obama told the story on himself--honestly and ruefully. In terms of John Lauber's forced haircut, Mitt Romney was a high school senior, which would make him, what, 17 or so? Unlike Obama, who had the situation thrust upon him, Romney led a group to seek out Lauber and cut his hair. Unlike Obama and Coretta, Romney and his band were not minorities. They were members of the majority, setting upon a nonconformist whom they appear to have suspected of being gay. We know about this story because Romney's classmates told it to the press. Romney initially denied any recollection of the incident; I'm not sure if that's still his stance. Then we come to Tim. I had a little trouble getting the scoop on this, because Amazon's Look Inside feature was being a bit balky. From what I could gather, Obama looked down on Tim, viewing him as insufficiently black. That's pretty awful, as Obama says in his book. I couldn't tell whether this went on behind Tim's back or whether Obama did anything hurtful to Tim directly.

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